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Shutting All Borders Makes Medical Sense?

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/07/superbug-gene-rife-delhi-water

A paper by Timothy Walsh from Cardiff University and colleagues, published in the Lancet Infectious Diseases journal, reveals that the gene, known as NDM-1, is widespread in the water used for cooking, washing and drinking in Delhi. It will inevitably be brought into hospitals in the gut flora of patients. The potential for movement around the world is high.

International travel and medical tourism have already brought NDM-1 to the UK. The same team of scientists reported last year that they had found NDM-1 positive bacteria in a small number of patients who had visited India for kidney or bone marrow transplants, dialysis, pregnancy care or burns treatment, while others had undergone cosmetic surgery

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Quarantine and testing prior to admittance?

I seem to recall Brits had to walk through disinfectant baths during the foot and mouth crisis.

Can't be that difficult to implement.

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This is just stupid fearmongering.

Bacteria and viruses have been around since before humanity existed, avoiding them makes you only more vulnerable to them.

Better to eat healthy in order to have a strong immune system, than obsess about something that's part of live.

--

Edited by wise_eagle

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This is just stupid fearmongering.

Not that stupid, I agree that the media over hypes the issues here but bacteria resistant to antibiotics is a real worry. MRSA, VRSA etc... are already major problems - MRSA more than VRSA in terms of numbers obviously but VRSA is starting to rear it's ugly little head. The stupid part is the shutting down of borders; once you've identified the threat it's invariably too late. But if this article prompts some money to be put into researching new antibiotics rather than producing the next anti depressant then it can only be a good thing...

Bacteria and viruses have been around since before humanity existed, avoiding them makes you only more vulnerable to them.

Damn Straight! I hate all those antibacterial handwashes etc... It's like giving a shedload of harmless, perfectly OK bacteria the skills to arm themselves, once they've evolved resistance to these antibacterials (pretty much inevitable) then they've got the potential to wreak bl00dy havoc! That being said, if someone offered me exposure to a nice portion of Necrotising Fasciitis I might politely decline...

Better to eat healthy in order to have a strong immune system, than obsess about something that's part of live.

--

Immune system hasn't got much to do with eating healthy, if you eat so much crap or too little food that it starts to affect your immune system in a serious enough way, then you're probably gonna die of something other than bacterial infection (as a primary cause at least). Vaccines and exposure to low levels of bacteria/viruses are the only way to maintain a 'strong' immune system. Though then of course you run the risk of dying of a cytokine storm as in bird flu!

Get your shots, don't lick stray dogs and ignore media scare stories is the best advice!

edit:spelling

Edited by down the tubes

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Get your shots, don't lick stray dogs and ignore media scare stories is the best advice!

edit:spelling

Sorry but I completely disagree. There is plenty evidence that the proliferation of vaccinations is doing far more harm than good to the immune system.

If by "get your shots" you mean the basic infant vaccines that were already around 30 years ago then fine, but most of the more recent vaccines are purely money spinners for the pharma industry with no benefits and most likely actually harmful for the people that take them.

Also the food that you eat has certainly lots of influence on the strenght of the immune system, I don't think there is any reason to debate such an obvious fact.

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Sorry but I completely disagree. There is plenty evidence that the proliferation of vaccinations is doing far more harm than good to the immune system.

If by "get your shots" you mean the basic infant vaccines that were already around 30 years ago then fine, but most of the more recent vaccines are purely money spinners for the pharma industry with no benefits and most likely actually harmful for the people that take them.

Also the food that you eat has certainly lots of influence on the strenght of the immune system, I don't think there is any reason to debate such an obvious fact.

No need to apologise... The world would be a fairly boring place if everybody agreed about everything, I like debating this sort of stuff, it's fun and one tends to learn things now and again.

Before I answer...

What do you mean by "There is plenty evidence that the proliferation of vaccinations is doing far more harm than good to the immune system."

Is this in reference to the MMR/Autism 'controversy' type of issues? Or the Guillain-Barre Syndrome type problems?

Of course, I afgree, the food you eat has an influence. The immune system is just part of the body, but its mechanism is not directly dependant on the nutrients absorbed by the body in the same way that scurvy is caused by lack of vitamin C. If your body is so poorly fed that the immune system is unable to produce macrophages to destroy an invader then you have bigger problems than the invader.

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That being said, if someone offered me exposure to a nice portion of Necrotising Fasciitis I might politely decline...

As I'm sure you know, Necrotising Fasciitis is a condition, not an organism. Many bacteria can cause it, the most common being streptococcus pygones. which is pretty much ubiquitous. Basically, you already have the bacteria responsible in you.

Edited by PrivateerMk2

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/apr/07/superbug-gene-rife-delhi-water

A paper by Timothy Walsh from Cardiff University and colleagues, published in the Lancet Infectious Diseases journal, reveals that the gene, known as NDM-1, is widespread in the water used for cooking, washing and drinking in Delhi. It will inevitably be brought into hospitals in the gut flora of patients. The potential for movement around the world is high.

International travel and medical tourism have already brought NDM-1 to the UK. The same team of scientists reported last year that they had found NDM-1 positive bacteria in a small number of patients who had visited India for kidney or bone marrow transplants, dialysis, pregnancy care or burns treatment, while others had undergone cosmetic surgery

There is quite a lot of things that are being brought into Britain by international travel and medical tourism. TB is the obvious one that most people know about, but there are others that labs can't identify.

My mother worked in the NHS until recently, and, a few years ago, she was infected by a strange virus she caught off an immigrant patient from a very rural area of a developing country. They could trace the virus back to that migrant patient because this virus made your eyes sockets bleed. :( My mum was floored for a long time, and her doctors suspect the virus led to her developing really severe depression.

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As I'm sure you know, Necrotising Fasciitis is a condition, not an organism. Many bacteria can cause it, the most common being streptococcus pygones. which is pretty much ubiquitous. Basically, you already have the bacteria responsible in you.

I do! Thanks for picking that up. But I must admit I was being lazy and basically just wanted to: 'insert scary sounding bacteria' into the sentence. I wouldn't stick my head in a bowl of Strep Pyogenes but equally I don't worry too much when I've got Strep Throat!

Nectrotising Fasciitis just has a scary ring to it that Streptococus Pyogenes is lacking...

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Sorry but I completely disagree. There is plenty evidence that the proliferation of vaccinations is doing far more harm than good to the immune system.

If by "get your shots" you mean the basic infant vaccines that were already around 30 years ago then fine, but most of the more recent vaccines are purely money spinners for the pharma industry with no benefits and most likely actually harmful for the people that take them.

Also the food that you eat has certainly lots of influence on the strenght of the immune system, I don't think there is any reason to debate such an obvious fact.

How is a vaccine any different from a sub clinical dose of an infective agent?

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I do! Thanks for picking that up. But I must admit I was being lazy and basically just wanted to: 'insert scary sounding bacteria' into the sentence. I wouldn't stick my head in a bowl of Strep Pyogenes but equally I don't worry too much when I've got Strep Throat!

Nectrotising Fasciitis just has a scary ring to it that Streptococus Pyogenes is lacking...

er, do you mean the FLESH EATING BUG ? :rolleyes:

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I thought europeans are generally better immune from most virus/plagues anyway because they happened here hundreds of years ago and the weak died off and their genes were wiped from humanity. Its our non-european immigrant communities that put a strain on health services.

Thats what i heard anyway.

http://www.nature.com/news/2005/050307/full/news050307-15.html

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article424915.ece

Shutting borders would bring only stability, sane liberal values, good health and a foward looking culture. Thats why it'll never happen.

The reptillians wont be happy until the whole world resembles mogadishu and all the drones will work for a peanut or grain of rice.

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I thought europeans are generally better immune from most virus/plagues anyway because they happened here hundreds of years ago and the weak died off and their genes were wiped from humanity. Its our non-european immigrant communities that put a strain on health services.

Thats what i heard anyway.

http://www.nature.com/news/2005/050307/full/news050307-15.html

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article424915.ece

Shutting borders would bring only stability, sane liberal values, good health and a foward looking culture. Thats why it'll never happen.

The reptillians wont be happy until the whole world resembles mogadishu and all the drones will work for a peanut or grain of rice.

Over time most zoonoses become less virulent. It is not a good survival strategy to wipe out your host population

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1I don't know about you lot, but every time I go somewhere hot, I shit my entire insides out for a week!

Next visit I do the same! So much for immunity, but I haven't died yet! :blink:

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1I don't know about you lot, but every time I go somewhere hot, I shit my entire insides out for a week!

Next visit I do the same! So much for immunity, but I haven't died yet! :blink:

Often the change in mineral content of water in a locality can upset the stomach. I grew up in cambridge but when I went to uni the soft water in Manchester played havoc with my insides for a week or two

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Often the change in mineral content of water in a locality can upset the stomach. I grew up in cambridge but when I went to uni the soft water in Manchester played havoc with my insides for a week or two

Yeah, Boddingtons can do that.

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