CrashConnoisseur Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) You'd be better off measuring the EMPLOYMENT rate. British born = about 70% Eastern European = 90%+ No I wouldn't. It would be an entirely false comparison. East Europeans are almost all young, fit, and have specifically moved here to find work. The British born population includes students, full-time mums, housewifes / husbands, carers, disabled, mentally ill, early retired, etc. How does the UK employment rate compare to the average in East Europe? How does the employment rate of East Europeans living in the UK compare with the employment rate of Britons living in East Europe? Those would be fair comparisons. Edited March 8, 2011 by CrashConnoisseur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 No I wouldn't. It would be an entirely false comparison. East Europeans are almost all young, fit, and have specifically moved here to find work. The British born population includes students, full-time mums, housewifes / husbands, carers, disabled, mentally ill, early retired, etc. How does the UK employment rate compare to the average in East Europe? How does the employment rate of East Europeans living in the UK compare with the employment rate of Britons living in East Europe? Those would be fair comparisons. Many come here with only basic English. They have few contacts. They have not lived here for years so don't know how things 'are done'. There is a different culture here. They know little about areas and where to go, where not to go - where to get work, where not to get work. Yes of ocurse they will have forums etc.. on the intenet for advice - but its never going to be as good as being from the place in question. And of all these people who come here for work - just over 5% of them are unemployed ? Personally I think that is ******ing exceptional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Self Employed Youth Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 No I wouldn't. It would be an entirely false comparison. East Europeans are almost all young, fit, and have specifically moved here to find work. The British born population includes students, full-time mums, housewifes / husbands, carers, disabled, mentally ill, early retired, etc. How does the UK employment rate compare to the average in East Europe? How does the employment rate of East Europeans living in the UK compare with the employment rate of Britons living in East Europe? Those would be fair comparisons. In 2006, the largest numbers of immigrants were born in Africa and the Middle East (3% of the working-age population) and the Indian subcontinent (2.5%). Those born in the A8 countries—Czech Republic, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia—made up less than 1% of the working age population, just over 7% of the total immigrant population of working age. However, A8 immigrants account for one in three of new immigrants since 2004 (Bank of England p 394). 34. The overall employment rate of immigrants (68%) is lower than that of UKborn persons (about 75%), but the gap has been declining in recent years. 35. The employment rate of A8 immigrants is over 80%, while that of immigrants born in Bangladesh is only around 50% (Bangladeshi women have an employment rate of about 19%) (ONS p 331). When employed, the average immigrant worker worked one and a half hours per week more in 2006 than the average individual born in the UK (Bank of England, p 395). Immigrants of varying nation states and their relative employment levels. From the report: The Economic Impact of Immigration http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200708/ldselect/ldeconaf/82/82.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Many come here with only basic English. They have few contacts. They have not lived here for years so don't know how things 'are done'. There is a different culture here. They know little about areas and where to go, where not to go - where to get work, where not to get work. Yes of ocurse they will have forums etc.. on the intenet for advice - but its never going to be as good as being from the place in question. And of all these people who come here for work - just over 5% of them are unemployed ? Personally I think that is ******ing exceptional. Friend goes into the job centre last week . There were ten booths and a member of staff behind each one . Friend went into one booth there was a guy in the next booth speaking English . The other eight were filled with a person who had an interpreter with them . So that day in that job centre there was a 20% English speaking unemployment rate and an 80 % foreign rate. But that is just a % for there at that time , however % can be altered to suit people crunching numbers how it suites them to be altered as and when they want them to be altered . What is the saying there are lies , big lies and ****ing percentages. Personally I think 1. The claim that only 5% of these foreign workers are unemployed is ****ing made up 2. Bringing more people into the country at this time is ****ing madness. 3. That non English speaking people can add very little to the work force. 4. It is a **** disgrace that these people have to have an interpreter with them at a cost of £150 p.h. That figure was quoted by a women I was telling this too this week , her mother works in a Doctors Surgery and said this is how much it costs and quite often the person who the interpreter is booked for does not turn up. 5. ****ing madness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_ichikawa Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Sounds like taking away means-testing. In other words, stop penalising people for saving. They could do a lot better.... by turning off the printing presses for once.... THAT would make saving money worthwhile.... Sure sure you'll get your £140 a week, even £140 a day, even £140 an hour. By the time you retire if you found £140 on the street you wouldn't bend down to pick it up as a loaf of bread will be £20 million quid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 Some help please! My dad is in his seventies. I know he worked for over 43 years, which guaranteed him the full state pension of £96 per week. But he was also paying into his private pension with the Legal and General, from his wage as well. I think he then transferred his Legal and General private pension scheme into the government Serps 2 scheme. I was going to mention this article to him. Will he be affected? Ive read through the article, but its a bit vague. Surely they are not suggesting cancelling his serps 2 pension? And just giving him £140 per week, are they? Thanks. I understand it is entirely intended that the enhanced SERPS2 (etc) will be preserved for those who have already paid in it si a very important point - there would be a riot if they cancelled this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milton Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 I understand it is entirely intended that the enhanced SERPS2 (etc) will be preserved for those who have already paid in it si a very important point - there would be a riot if they cancelled this Indeed Si1. Many thanks. That's what I thought. [if you have a link, pop it in. ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alba Posted March 8, 2011 Share Posted March 8, 2011 This is not the Government being generous. Far from it. Read between the lines of the extremely scant information that has come from I.D.S. It is also for future pensioners, not existing pensioners. This is a system designed to save money on a substantial scale, and not from reduced admin. The Government will set a possible figure of £140 pw, and that will be it. No top ups. So the message will be to prepare now by saving, or suffer the consequences of an even lower standard of living. Stand on your own feet and don't bet on the State coming to the rescue. Successive Governments have given out this message, but have generally been unable to compel people to save for their retirement. This is just another scheme and means of achieving this. You have to ask why it is not being rolled out across the board. It is because 1. It cannot be afforded, and 2. They can legitimately say that they gave fair warning of the new system to all future pensioners. They cannot of course do that for existing pensioners, hence no change for them. There is talk of a phasing in. This will take account of those bleeding hearts. nearing retiral. Eventually the existing cohort of pensioners will die off, and voila, you have all pensioners on the new State pension system! This will take some time, but it is part of the long game. In the interim it looks like there is going to be a 3 tier State pension system by the time of the next election. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Friend goes into the job centre last week . There were ten booths and a member of staff behind each one . Friend went into one booth there was a guy in the next booth speaking English . The other eight were filled with a person who had an interpreter with them . So that day in that job centre there was a 20% English speaking unemployment rate and an 80 % foreign rate. But that is just a % for there at that time , however % can be altered to suit people crunching numbers how it suites them to be altered as and when they want them to be altered . What is the saying there are lies , big lies and ****ing percentages. Personally I think 1. The claim that only 5% of these foreign workers are unemployed is ****ing made up 2. Bringing more people into the country at this time is ****ing madness. 3. That non English speaking people can add very little to the work force. 4. It is a **** disgrace that these people have to have an interpreter with them at a cost of £150 p.h. That figure was quoted by a women I was telling this too this week , her mother works in a Doctors Surgery and said this is how much it costs and quite often the person who the interpreter is booked for does not turn up. 5. ****ing madness. Emmm - so what does that tell you...... Not really helping your argument here - are you.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porca misèria Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 I understand it is entirely intended that the enhanced SERPS2 (etc) will be preserved for those who have already paid in it si a very important point - there would be a riot if they cancelled this whatwhatwhat? I thought they killed serps some years ago and substituted some flat-rate thing. All part of the complexity they're now supposedly sweeping away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Emmm - so what does that tell you...... Not really helping your argument here - are you.. It tells me that the Foreign labour or unemployed labour is not ****ing excelent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 The Government will set a possible figure of £140 pw, and that will be it. No top ups. So the message will be to prepare now by saving, or suffer the consequences of an even lower standard of living. Stand on your own feet and don't bet on the State coming to the rescue. But isn't this what we want? (Along with more encouragement to get people to work) How much does the free bus pass, tv licence and heating allowance etc cost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
campervanman Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 The UK has the worst state pension provision in western Europe. This is a first step towards improving that situstion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PricedOutNative Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Shocking how many apparently informed people don't know whast SERPS is and how they could well be ripped off. Those that contracted out of SERPS must be laughing! whatwhatwhat? I thought they killed serps some years ago and substituted some flat-rate thing. All part of the complexity they're now supposedly sweeping away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 It tells me that the Foreign labour or unemployed labour is not ****ing excelent Don't try and sneak out of this one. You said yourself - you went into a place where people look for work - and the vast majority were foreigners. You have painted yourself into a corner with this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitchbux Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 The UK has the worst state pension provision in western Europe. This is a first step towards improving that situstion. Do the other countries in western Europe give out as many 'freebies' and additional payments? Are they comparing apples with pears? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Don't try and sneak out of this one. You said yourself - you went into a place where people look for work - and the vast majority were foreigners. You have painted yourself into a corner with this one. No corner at all . I suggest you read what is in front of you before replying . For a start I did not go into a place looking for work someone else did . My point was that 80% were unable to speak English . Your slant on the subject is how low unemployment is for foreigners. My opinion based on what I am seeing hearing and what is being said , is that your low % figure is completly wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 No corner at all . I suggest you read what is in front of you before replying . For a start I did not go into a place looking for work someone else did . My point was that 80% were unable to speak English . Your slant on the subject is how low unemployment is for foreigners. My opinion based on what I am seeing hearing and what is being said , is that your low % figure is completly wrong. It's not my % figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 It's not my % figure No matter whos it is we all know it is piffel realed out by the HAVE A DIG at the British worker/unemployed brigade . If you think about it , it is a great pity that people beleive it and relate it. We should be looking after are own and enabling as many as possible to gain access to meaningfull employment instead of haveing to pay interperters huge sums to accomodate non English speaking people in the job centers . It's quite simple really if you think about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 No matter whos it is we all know it is piffel realed out by the HAVE A DIG at the British worker/unemployed brigade . If you think about it , it is a great pity that people beleive it and relate it. We should be looking after are own and enabling as many as possible to gain access to meaningfull employment instead of haveing to pay interperters huge sums to accomodate non English speaking people in the job centers . It's quite simple really if you think about it. Why not have a dig at the British worker ? Many of them are complete shit compared to their foreign comparables. Of course many of them are not. However the general work ethic in the UK is not fantastic. And yes I agree - lots of interpreters can be ridiculous. People learning the language should be a given for certain entry requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 And yes I agree - lots of interpreters can be ridiculous. People learning the language should be a given for certain entry requirements. Why not all entry requirements if they want to work here ? Lots of interpreters, it is not a case of can be ridiculous it is totally ridiculous and not just at the job centres but also at the councils, hospitals, schools, housing offices ect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Why not all entry requirements if they want to work here ? Lots of interpreters, it is not a case of can be ridiculous it is totally ridiculous and not just at the job centres but also at the councils, hospitals, schools, housing offices ect. Yep. In many places it is a piss take. However how exactly do us Brits compare when we head off abroad ? We don't need interpreters as we just boldly expect them all to speak English anyway - and arrive in their country speaking our own language - and expect them to instantly understand. We are not exactly saints in all this...we take the complete piss as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Yep. In many places it is a piss take. However how exactly do us Brits compare when we head off abroad ? We don't need interpreters as we just boldly expect them all to speak English anyway - and arrive in their country speaking our own language - and expect them to instantly understand. We are not exactly saints in all this...we take the complete piss as well... Give you an example : Go and live in Spain you will be entitled to health care due the the EU policy. Go and see a Doctor or visit a hospital and you cannot talk Spanish if you want an interpreter you pay QUITE SIMPLE REALLY IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHERWICK Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 No matter whos it is we all know it is piffel realed out by the HAVE A DIG at the British worker/unemployed brigade . If you think about it , it is a great pity that people beleive it and relate it. We should be looking after are own and enabling as many as possible to gain access to meaningfull employment instead of haveing to pay interperters huge sums to accomodate non English speaking people in the job centers . It's quite simple really if you think about it. Are you sure that you're English? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybong Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 April 2007 A Home Office spokesman said migrants from eastern Europe were contributing to the success of the UK economy,... Amazing timing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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