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Cameron Has Lost It

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Speaking to my Mother in Law today.

Some members of our family are facing benefit cuts etc. Neighbours having to work longer for pensions, other facing edundancy from Public Sector jobs.

MiL blames the new government and is convinced that Labour would not have done this.

Thing is, she (and millions like her) have no idea of the debt or deficit, no idea that a Labour government would probably have had to do something similar.

Cameron should have got the message across, he has not even bothered.

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I don't think there is any point. If the economy recovers in 2013/14 then middle england will return the tories to govt, and if not they won't, and that's about it.

And don't forget the 2 Eds in Labour are truly unelectable - some people will always vote labour and that's that.

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And don't forget the 2 Eds in Labour are truly unelectable - some people will always vote labour and that's that.

could we not just give them their own little socialist paradise on lindisfarne or something.

it's close enough to the coast for them to come and shop for ammenities,if they have been arsed to go and work for something to barter with.

..but not quite close enough to be a nuisance!

At least the monks of previous era's were more prone to self sufficiency than whinging about being a harddone-by one-legged transvestite with bipolar and body dysmorpic disorder.

Edited by oracle

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Speaking to my Mother in Law today.

Some members of our family are facing benefit cuts etc. Neighbours having to work longer for pensions, other facing edundancy from Public Sector jobs.

MiL blames the new government and is convinced that Labour would not have done this.

Thing is, she (and millions like her) have no idea of the debt or deficit, no idea that a Labour government would probably have had to do something similar.

Cameron should have got the message across, he has not even bothered.

So true. Many people cannot manage to balance their own books. They think that things like benefits and pensions grow on trees, and dont understand how it is transferred wealth, from those working to those that are not.

Sometimes a complete collapse for an economy is a good thing, shows us how little we know and how ignorant we are. We might be able to make some decent changes to the way things are, go back to rewarding the contributors instead of flaying them alive as we are at present.

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Speaking to my Mother in Law today.

Some members of our family are facing benefit cuts etc. Neighbours having to work longer for pensions, other facing edundancy from Public Sector jobs.

MiL blames the new government and is convinced that Labour would not have done this.

Thing is, she (and millions like her) have no idea of the debt or deficit, no idea that a Labour government would probably have had to do something similar.

Cameron should have got the message across, he has not even bothered.

I think much of what might have been the message has been stifled by the NuLabour supporting BBC.

The BBC has done a good job in culturing the opinion that this whole mess is exclusively the fault of the banks and not due to Gordon Brown's thirteen year's of incompetence in managing the economy.

The Tory's weakness, if anything, is in failing to slay the BBC monster.

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I think much of what might have been the message has been stifled by the NuLabour supporting BBC.

The BBC has done a good job in culturing the opinion that this whole mess is exclusively the fault of the banks and not due to Gordon Brown's thirteen year's of incompetence in managing the economy.

Gordon Brown's reputation has been destroyed in the eyes of non-core-labour-voters, they blame the banks AND Gordon Brown for not regulating them.

I suspect the tories are quite hapy to allow blame to slosh around anybody but themselves. They just need to keep their OWN distance from former labour policies, and banks, so they can deflect the pain for the cming few years onto others.

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Speaking to my Mother in Law today.

Some members of our family are facing benefit cuts etc. Neighbours having to work longer for pensions, other facing edundancy from Public Sector jobs.

MiL blames the new government and is convinced that Labour would not have done this.

Thing is, she (and millions like her) have no idea of the debt or deficit, no idea that a Labour government would probably have had to do something similar.

Cameron should have got the message across, he has not even bothered.

I think he has bothered.

The problem is the standard labour voter just isn't listening.

IMHO this waseasily entirely foreseeable and Cameron is never going to convince them whatever he says or does

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I think he has bothered.

The problem is the standard labour voter just isn't listening.

IMHO this waseasily entirely foreseeable and Cameron is never going to convince them whatever he says or does

yep - this is the core labour vote and does not constitute that much of the electorate, no more than 25-30%

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yep - this is the core labour vote and does not constitute that much of the electorate, no more than 25-30%

Properly concentrated 30% is all it takes to win a majority of seats

tim

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My point is that Cameron was chosen to combat Blair. Time has moved on and ge is now obsolete.

Apparently, a decision was taken years ago by the Conservatives to avoid Yahboo politics.

That is why Cameron never gave Brown the kicking he deserved.

Nowadays, my MIL who does not have a clue about politics and is certainly not a Labour supporter, has been left with the impression that Cameron is 'punishing' people because he is a Tory and is also letting his rich chums get richer.

That nice man from the Labour, Ed Balls says that there is no need for this austerity, and because it suits her she believes him.

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I think his is blameing them regularly. Certainly if you follow PMQs.

The trouble is the Tories did not really talk about how big the problem was at the election. All the main parties (with the media asking no questions) ducked the big issue and debated about £6billion of a ~£175billon deficit. In my opinion the Tories should have been up front, even if it meant losing the 2010 election. Their campaign should have said:

"we need to make £175billion of cuts over 4 years. This means the following jobs will be cut/ benefits cut/ taxes raised etc etc. Or stick with Labour and go bankrupt like Greece/Ireland"

If they lost they could have had a great time in opposition for a few years and watch Labour become unelectable for decades. Massive open goal missed IMHO.

Now they are becoming unpopular for cuts they did not mention at election time (with help from the BBC and especially BBC regional news).

P

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I think his is blameing them regularly. Certainly if you follow PMQs.

The trouble is the Tories did not really talk about how big the problem was at the election. All the main parties (with the media asking no questions) ducked the big issue and debated about £6billion of a ~£175billon deficit. In my opinion the Tories should have been up front, even if it meant losing the 2010 election. Their campaign should have said:

"we need to make £175billion of cuts over 4 years. This means the following jobs will be cut/ benefits cut/ taxes raised etc etc. Or stick with Labour and go bankrupt like Greece/Ireland"

If they lost they could have had a great time in opposition for a few years and watch Labour become unelectable for decades. Massive open goal missed IMHO.

Now they are becoming unpopular for cuts they did not mention at election time (with help from the BBC and especially BBC regional news).

P

Spot on. The £6 billion endlessly mentioned during the election was known to be pissing in the wind. It was really rather annoying to listen to endless debates about why this £6 billion was the difference between austerity and prosperity. We gave more to Ireland in an afternoon with barely a press release.

Cameron is a tube. Unfortunately, we may all have to pay for that.

Edited by cheeznbreed

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I think his is blameing them regularly. Certainly if you follow PMQs.

The trouble is the Tories did not really talk about how big the problem was at the election. All the main parties (with the media asking no questions) ducked the big issue and debated about £6billion of a ~£175billon deficit. In my opinion the Tories should have been up front, even if it meant losing the 2010 election. Their campaign should have said:

"we need to make £175billion of cuts over 4 years. This means the following jobs will be cut/ benefits cut/ taxes raised etc etc. Or stick with Labour and go bankrupt like Greece/Ireland"

If they lost they could have had a great time in opposition for a few years and watch Labour become unelectable for decades. Massive open goal missed IMHO.

Now they are becoming unpopular for cuts they did not mention at election time (with help from the BBC and especially BBC regional news).

P

Similar outcome for Tories when GB "bottled" the 2007 election opportunity. Although I now wonder how deliberate this was as Labour must have known that the economy was about to tank.

Brown's cunning and duplicity have no bounds: let the Tories win the next election, knowing full well the unpopular decisions they would have to make would condemn them (and the Lid-Dems) to oblivion (thereby paving the way for a subsequent Labour return).

In fact the whole of Brown's post election demeanour struck me as a man who had not really been defeated.

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Similar outcome for Tories when GB "bottled" the 2007 election opportunity. Although I now wonder how deliberate this was as Labour must have known that the economy was about to tank.

Brown's cunning and duplicity have no bounds: let the Tories win the next election, knowing full well the unpopular decisions they would have to make would condemn them (and the Lid-Dems) to oblivion (thereby paving the way for a subsequent Labour return).

In fact the whole of Brown's post election demeanour struck me as a man who had not really been defeated.

Exactly.

Cameron is too lightweight, unable to put the boot in.

He could have won the election if he was bolder, as it is, he is hamstrung by the LibDems.

It is not Brown, but Cameron who will do damage to the Conservative Party.

I was at MiL's again and explained to her friend just how big the National Debt is by using that 4,500 mile high stack of £50's as an analogy. She was shocked and had no idea, so the question is why didn't she know, answer is Cameron's fault.

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Similar outcome for Tories when GB "bottled" the 2007 election opportunity. Although I now wonder how deliberate this was as Labour must have known that the economy was about to tank.

Brown's cunning and duplicity have no bounds: let the Tories win the next election, knowing full well the unpopular decisions they would have to make would condemn them (and the Lid-Dems) to oblivion (thereby paving the way for a subsequent Labour return).

In fact the whole of Brown's post election demeanour struck me as a man who had not really been defeated.

I (respectfully) disagree. Any assumptions about Brown's undoubted duplicity are in my view undone by his oft-demonstrated pisspoor judgement, and unwillingness to listen to those who knew better. There's no way he could have seen the benefit of playing that sort of strategy after he'd waited ten years to get his precious stint at PM. The man was desperate to hang on and didn't call the election because it was not clear in his mind that he'd win it.

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I (respectfully) disagree. Any assumptions about Brown's undoubted duplicity are in my view undone by his oft-demonstrated pisspoor judgement, and unwillingness to listen to those who knew better. There's no way he could have seen the benefit of playing that sort of strategy after he'd waited ten years to get his precious stint at PM. The man was desperate to hang on and didn't call the election because it was not clear in his mind that he'd win it.

This is the more likely of the two possibilities.

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Exactly.

Cameron is too lightweight, unable to put the boot in.

Have a look at the election calculator:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8609989.stm

If Brown had won 36.1% of the vote to Cameron's 29.0% then he'd have had a majority of 88 - almost a landslide.

Back in 2005 Bliar got 36.1% to Howard's 33.2% and ended up with a majority of 48; in 1992 Major got 41.9% to Kinnock's 34.4% and would've been in a minority under the current boundaries.

The problem very obviously is not Cameron's weight - 29.0% was meltdown for labour - it's worse than Major got in 1997 and is labour's bedrock who'd vote for a s*** on a stick wearing a red rosette. Cameron could've stuck the boot in to Brown a bit more but that would've likely driven voters towards libdem instead - politically how does that help him?

The very obvious problem is that labour had an inbuilt 100 seat advantage under the current boundaries - no amount of weight or lack of was going to change that.

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I (respectfully) disagree. Any assumptions about Brown's undoubted duplicity are in my view undone by his oft-demonstrated pisspoor judgement, and unwillingness to listen to those who knew better. There's no way he could have seen the benefit of playing that sort of strategy after he'd waited ten years to get his precious stint at PM. The man was desperate to hang on and didn't call the election because it was not clear in his mind that he'd win it.

I guess we will never know the complete truth but I always had the feeling that Brown was a dangerous megalomaniac (with a mentality akin to Stalin and Hitler).

In everything but name, this country effectively operated under a dictatorship for 13 years. I remember, for the first time in my adult life, consciously thanking God that we lived in a democracy and the electorate was (just about) able to get rid of him.

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  • 312 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

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      • down 5% +
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