Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum
HPC=dream

Liar Loans Are Back

Recommended Posts

I saw a couple of mortgage brokers today and I was discussing the problems are facing in getting mortgages at a reasonable rate.

I was told by two different companies that if someone came to see them and could not prove income they would arrange a BTL mortgage even though they knew it was for their main residence :o

I am glad these highly skilled financial experts are doing their bit for first time buyers everywhere :angry:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I saw a couple of mortgage brokers today and I was discussing the problems are facing in getting mortgages at a reasonable rate.

I was told by two different companies that if someone came to see them and could not prove income they would arrange a BTL mortgage even though they knew it was for their main residence :o

I am glad these highly skilled financial experts are doing their bit for first time buyers everywhere :angry:

Write to the FSA regarding contiuning fraud in their "regulated" system, also inform them you will get the letter published in as many papers as possible including sending it to any government departments associated with the FSA, the mortgage market, banking and fraud so that it is a matter of public record.

Edited by OnlyMe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In November I saw a website offering mortgages with "no income verification" so sent a link to the FSA and asked if they were going to investigate and close them down. The FSA replied that their mortgage review was not finalised yet:

"Therefore as the review is still ongoing, firms can still offer various products until a decision made by the FSA has been implemented".

The FSA started looking into how the mortgage markets works in 2005

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know what the solution to this is.

No BTL Mortgage.

No Liar loans.

No speculator/investor/spiv loans.

2.5x verifiable income.

Sorted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In November I saw a website offering mortgages with "no income verification" so sent a link to the FSA and asked if they were going to investigate and close them down. The FSA replied that their mortgage review was not finalised yet:

"Therefore as the review is still ongoing, firms can still offer various products until a decision made by the FSA has been implemented".

The FSA started looking into how the mortgage markets works in 2005

Nice try - but a predictably pathetic and opaque response from a paper tiger of a watchdog.

Our elected regimes and their proxies seem as corrupt as any in the financial services 'industry'.

The control of the country is in the hands of a few - whose interests are in conflict with the masses they pretend to represent. Sadly no solution other than possibly follow the Tunisian/Egyptian model - with an uprising of the people - but even then the respite may only be temporary as corruption of the new government could again take hold at some point - almost seems the natural 'order' of things.

Time for some transparency, super strong regulation - prompt enforcement and punishment that fits - not slap on the wrist trivial fines - or servile appeals to 'not do it again'. There have to be consequences - so far there's only been continuing reward and excess at the top and cuts and misery at the bottom.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In November I saw a website offering mortgages with "no income verification" so sent a link to the FSA and asked if they were going to investigate and close them down. The FSA replied that their mortgage review was not finalised yet:

"Therefore as the review is still ongoing, firms can still offer various products until a decision made by the FSA has been implemented".

The FSA started looking into how the mortgage markets works in 2005

Why do they need to review anything?

It's fraud.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why do they need to review anything?

It's fraud.

You see...........

The ONLY way Mr/Mrs Average could - and STILL CAN - "AFFORD" to buy - is to do SOMETHING dodgy...... Because - there is no way you can pay current prices by open, honest, straightforward means......

THAT is why LIAR LOANS have been - and still remain - ENDEMIC - in one form or another..... :rolleyes:

THERE IS NO OTHER WAY!!!! :rolleyes:

Edited by eric pebble

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why do they need to review anything?

It's fraud.

As investigated by the motley fool, money talk Jan 19th it's very difficult to get FSA, office of fair trading, scam busters etc. to investigate unless you yourself have been defrauded. If you suspect a website / company etc. is perpetrating a fraud they don't seem very interested. As offering to "help" by offering another flavour of liar loans is the sort of fraud for which all the parties involved won't identify themselves as being defrauded (as the parties involved are both committing the fraud) I guess the FSA won't ever investigate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice try - but a predictably pathetic and opaque response from a paper tiger of a watchdog.

Our elected regimes and their proxies seem as corrupt as any in the financial services 'industry'.

The control of the country is in the hands of a few - whose interests are in conflict with the masses they pretend to represent. Sadly no solution other than possibly follow the Tunisian/Egyptian model - with an uprising of the people - but even then the respite may only be temporary as corruption of the new government could again take hold at some point - almost seems the natural 'order' of things.

Time for some transparency, super strong regulation - prompt enforcement and punishment that fits - not slap on the wrist trivial fines - or servile appeals to 'not do it again'. There have to be consequences - so far there's only been continuing reward and excess at the top and cuts and misery at the bottom.

In fairness, the FSA has actually grown a pair of late, hence Cameron's and Shapps' criticisms that their MMR is in danger of going too far the wrong way. If the MMR goes through in its current form, arguably, we'll see a proper HPC and a muzzle on future HPI.

As an aside, the FSA actually fined RBS/Natwest (£2.8 million) for being crap (to use the technical jargon).

However, Jack C on the HPC blog, posted a Mortgage Strategy article the other day that stated mortgage fraud still accounted for 25% of all claims (2009 & 2010). So, yeah, they've got their work cut-out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As an aside, the lawyer handling a transaction with a fraudulent loan is leaving themselves open to a charge of money laundering.

http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/productsandservices/practicenotes/mortgagefraud/2607.article#mf2_1

Mortgage fraud occurs where individuals defraud a financial institution or private lender through the mortgage process.

The definition of fraud in the Fraud Act 2006 covers fraud by false representation and by failure to disclose information where there is a legal duty to disclose. False representations can be made explicitly or implicitly and may occur even where you know only that the representation might be misleading or untrue.

The value of a mortgage obtained through fraud is the proceeds of crime. Under the Proceeds of Crime Act 2002, you risk committing a money laundering offence if you acquire, use, have possession of, enter into an arrangement with respect to, or transfer this criminal property.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I saw a couple of mortgage brokers today and I was discussing the problems are facing in getting mortgages at a reasonable rate.

I was told by two different companies that if someone came to see them and could not prove income they would arrange a BTL mortgage even though they knew it was for their main residence :o

I am glad these highly skilled financial experts are doing their bit for first time buyers everywhere :angry:

Well you could rent it back to yourself :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really? How interesting :unsure::blink:

What's to stop two families buying a house each, then renting to each other for a 'nominal' sum... say £1 per year?#

All the benefits of running the place as a business, a nice large negative income to offset your dayjob tax bracket.

Cushty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's to stop two families buying a house each, then renting to each other for a 'nominal' sum... say £1 per year?#

All the benefits of running the place as a business, a nice large negative income to offset your dayjob tax bracket.

Cushty.

;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I saw a couple of mortgage brokers today and I was discussing the problems are facing in getting mortgages at a reasonable rate.

I was told by two different companies that if someone came to see them and could not prove income they would arrange a BTL mortgage even though they knew it was for their main residence :o

I am glad these highly skilled financial experts are doing their bit for first time buyers everywhere :angry:

Ah! but what they didn't tell you was you required a 50% deposit and proof of rental income to cover 120% of mortgage repayment @7%. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In fairness, the FSA has actually grown a pair of late, hence Cameron's and Shapps' criticisms that their MMR is in danger of going too far the wrong way. If the MMR goes through in its current form, arguably, we'll see a proper HPC and a muzzle on future HPI.

As an aside, the FSA actually fined RBS/Natwest (£2.8 million) for being crap (to use the technical jargon).

However, Jack C on the HPC blog, posted a Mortgage Strategy article the other day that stated mortgage fraud still accounted for 25% of all claims (2009 & 2010). So, yeah, they've got their work cut-out.

Yes - perhaps the FSA are better than they were and like you I hope the MMR goes through undiluted - but the £2.8 million fine on RBS - a token gnat bite - hardly dwarfs Hesters bonus of £2.04 million - moral hazard every where.

This may be a cynical view but I suspect most of the posturing against the banks is no more than window dressing to placate the masses. The punishments are not being applied - the fraud we all know occurred - and very probably still does - has to be paid for via incarcerations, fines and the reclaiming of all ill gotten gains. Perversely the fraud was a money spinner for the government - and - as it was such a large part of the economy - covertly Shapps and Co want it to resume. Your absolutely right the FSA have their work cut out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does not the Lender have to instigate criminal proceedings in these cases by putting the matter in the hands of the Police.

No complaint means no action taken as it is the Lender who has been defrauded. :unsure:

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Plod will be FULL of BTL "investors" - and therefore have NO interest whatsoever in investigating Mortgage Fraud &/LIAR LOANS... :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heard a new one a couple of weeks back. Mate has got in a spot of bother financially but fortunately has met a new partner and moved in there. His mortgage on his own house has been converted to a 'consent to let' IO mortgage at 6.5% with an arrangement fee of £2k which he just tacked onto the mortgage. Instead of financial meltdown he gets to keep his house but rent it out. He didn't tell his mortgage company he only moved round the corner but that his employer is sending him to work in Europe for a year. He's lied and it looks like reckless lending to me - no rental contract as yet so he's already bleeding cash because of the 6.5% rate which is much higher than what he had before. Big name financial institution. A bailed out one.

CTL a new lifeline for people in the doodoo or was this already happening?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heard a new one a couple of weeks back. Mate has got in a spot of bother financially but fortunately has met a new partner and moved in there. His mortgage on his own house has been converted to a 'consent to let' IO mortgage at 6.5% with an arrangement fee of £2k which he just tacked onto the mortgage. Instead of financial meltdown he gets to keep his house but rent it out. He didn't tell his mortgage company he only moved round the corner but that his employer is sending him to work in Europe for a year. He's lied and it looks like reckless lending to me - no rental contract as yet so he's already bleeding cash because of the 6.5% rate which is much higher than what he had before. Big name financial institution. A bailed out one.

CTL a new lifeline for people in the doodoo or was this already happening?

..no LTL 'Lie to Let'...... :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heard a new one a couple of weeks back. Mate has got in a spot of bother financially but fortunately has met a new partner and moved in there. His mortgage on his own house has been converted to a 'consent to let' IO mortgage at 6.5% with an arrangement fee of £2k ...............//....A bailed out one.

CTL a new lifeline for people in the doodoo or was this already happening?

All at the expense of savers with "money" in the bank - and the taxpayers who bailed these schmuck bankers out... :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • 276 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.