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ralphmalph

Who Works In Manufacturing?

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So background is that we have seen JLR adding 1500 jobs for the new car and we are being told that we have to grow manufacturing in the UK to offset the public sector job losses, so I thought lets have a poll and see what is happening. The contect is that if we have unemployment rise then house prices will come under more pressure, whereas if the private sector takes off we may well see house prices stable.

The scenario I can add is that my brother part owns a manufacturing business in the UK, sells worldwide to both large and small businesses including global multinationals and employs about 50 people. Had a family lunch with him yesterday and he has never known business so good, 90% exports to all over the world including India and China. They are expanding the headcout and he can recruit semi-skilled people no problem, but getting skilled turners or machinists (CNC operators intodays speak) is a big problem.

Edited by ralphmalph

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Of those saying things are on the up, I'd be interested to know how the companies would fare if the exchange rates went back to pre-crash levels.. would they be as competitive.

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So background is that we have seen JLR adding 1500 jobs for the new car and we are being told that we have to grow manufacturing in the UK to offset the public sector job losses, so I thought lets have a poll and see what is happening. The contect is that if we have unemployment rise then house prices will come under more pressure, whereas if the private sector takes off we may well see house prices stable.

The scenario I can add is that my brother part owns a manufacturing business in the UK, sells worldwide to both large and small businesses including global multinationals and employs about 50 people. Had a family lunch with him yesterday and he has never known business so good, 90% exports to all over the world including India and China. They are expanding the headcout and he can recruit semi-skilled people no problem, but getting skilled turners or machinists (CNC operators intodays speak) is a big problem.

No one wants to train anyone these days, manufacturing in this country has been running on a shoestring for a few years now and companys have not been able to take on as many aprenticeships as some would like,a lot of the older end of the workforce have not been able to pass on their skills, i think another problem is the pay for skilled personel, there is not the differential as there used to be, eg a unskilled can almost get the same as a skilled person if they start a family with tax credit etc, were as a skilled person starting a family would just be on the pay threshold for any credits and would not get anything in credits, this is one reason a lot of youngsters are not interested in engineering or a skill anymore.

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So background is that we have seen JLR adding 1500 jobs for the new car and we are being told that we have to grow manufacturing in the UK to offset the public sector job losses.

Ralph I'm an engineer in a manufacturing company, and we are currently very busy, probably for a year at least! :huh:

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Alternatively, if you can force a rival business into bankruptcy, by calling in the receivers yourself you can often do deals with the receiver to buy up stock/customer lists at knock down prices.
.....at the risk of being sued by the owners of the original business if they find out what's happened, not to mention being done for fraud and ending up in prison !!!! Edited by Hyperduck Quack Quack

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No one wants to train anyone these days, manufacturing in this country has been running on a shoestring for a few years now and companys have not been able to take on as many aprenticeships as some would like,a lot of the older end of the workforce have not been able to pass on their skills, i think another problem is the pay for skilled personel, there is not the differential as there used to be, eg a unskilled can almost get the same as a skilled person if they start a family with tax credit etc, were as a skilled person starting a family would just be on the pay threshold for any credits and would not get anything in credits, this is one reason a lot of youngsters are not interested in engineering or a skill anymore.

A dumbed down workforce?

When the students were protesting perhaps the government should have placed some massive posters on building in London "look stop moaning about tuition fees, don't bother with uni, you will be better off in an easier lower paid job with tax credits, only mugs try to work hard and better themselves, you will just pay more tax to support those playing the system"

Edited by Redhat Sly

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the liquidators tend to work in the interest of whoever is paying their bill.

The liquidators work in their own interest and their bill is always paid before anyone else. They don't show any preference they rip everyone off.

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i rap frozin chickins in a big factery. we get payed 6.48 a our and there is no sines of the work slacking.

You probably work for Chicken Tycoon - Ranjit Boparan.

He's buying up everything in 2011 - Harry Ramdsdens, Northen Foods....

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No one wants to train anyone these days, manufacturing in this country has been running on a shoestring for a few years now and companys have not been able to take on as many aprenticeships as some would like,a lot of the older end of the workforce have not been able to pass on their skills, i think another problem is the pay for skilled personel, there is not the differential as there used to be, eg a unskilled can almost get the same as a skilled person if they start a family with tax credit etc, were as a skilled person starting a family would just be on the pay threshold for any credits and would not get anything in credits, this is one reason a lot of youngsters are not interested in engineering or a skill anymore.

The problem is welfare not pay levels

A welfare system that started out as a 'safety net' based on humanitarian goals has become 'net equality' based on socialist ideals

Welfare equalisation has removed much of the incentive to train and work hard; those who prosper in this new world do so for the most part by trampling on others (e.g. bankers).

Developing economies such as China and India don't have this problem (because they don't have any welfare) hence they are building a hugely skilled and motivated workforce.

This book explains the problem rather well.

Edited by Sonic the Hedge Fund

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The liquidators work in their own interest and their bill is always paid before anyone else. They don't show any preference they rip everyone off.

Quite, the sort of clever-dickery being suggested is not very clever at all.

You can only issue a winding up petition if you're a creditor (not sure why you'd be a creditor of a rival business).

Deliberately going out of your way to make enemies is foolish.

________

If manufacturing is doing so great, how are they moving goods in material and shipping finished product?

Because road haulage is on it's ar5e.

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The problem is welfare not pay levels

A welfare system that started out as a 'safety net' based on humanitarian goals has become 'net equality' based on socialist ideals

Welfare equalisation has removed much of the incentive to train and work hard; those who prosper in this new world do so for the most part by trampling on others (e.g. bankers).

Developing economies such as China and India don't have this problem (because they don't have any welfare) hence they are building a hugely skilled and motivated workforce.

This book explains the problem rather well.

My reply was trying to get the same point across as what you are saying, When i said pay i should have said income, meaning many unskilled on benifits are on a same income as skilled personel because of benifits.

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To be fair, they could have said that in a bid to knock you down on price, otherwise why buy a business that could be failing or experiencing a reduction in sales/turnover?

In some instances its better to wait until the competition has gone bust and then hoover up their customers.

A nice trick to play, is to get the phone numbers of those rival businesses that have gone bust and have them redirected to your business. Alternatively, if you can force a rival business into bankruptcy, by calling in the receivers yourself you can often do deals with the receiver to buy up stock/customer lists at knock down prices.

Its tough I know possibly unethical but there are no friends in business. :)

Bit late for that. Their MD mentioned it in conversation, two years after they had bought it.

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Developing economies such as China and India don't have this problem (because they don't have any welfare) hence they are building a hugely skilled and motivated workforce.

....and sell most of their products to western countries. Why? Because only countries with welfare provision and a safety net have created the sub species of humanity called 'the consumer'.

But consumers are ecologically sensitive creatures, and if the safety net were removed their behaviour would alter accordingly- they too would no doubt be far more driven to save and produce rather than spend and consume.

One slight problem- where do we then sell all the products of this spartan society?

The Chinese and Indians have at present dysfunctional economies to the degree that they have failed to provide the basic social security required to encourage their citizens to spend and consume.

So we can see that the social protections we created were not in fact antithetical to economic growth, but an essential component of it.

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....and sell most of their products to western countries. Why? Because only countries with welfare provision and a safety net have created the sub species of humanity called 'the consumer'.

But consumers are ecologically sensitive creatures, and if the safety net were removed their behaviour would alter accordingly- they too would no doubt be far more driven to save and produce rather than spend and consume.

One slight problem- where do we then sell all the products of this spartan society?

The Chinese and Indians have at present dysfunctional economies to the degree that they have failed to provide the basic social security required to encourage their citizens to spend and consume.

So we can see that the social protections we created were not in fact antithetical to economic growth, but an essential component of it.

I do not agree with the position that there is a positive correlation between the size of the social safety net and the amount of consumerism in a country.

Japan and the US have much smaller social safety nets than the UK yet they are much larger consumers. The former East Germany had a much larger social safety net in proportional terms than the former West Germany yet it was a much smaller relative consumer.

The ability to consume is a function of wealth. The amount of wealth is probably negatively correlated to the size of the social safety net beyond a certain size of the state relative to the economy.

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Well I was in manufacturing for 20+ years, havn't worked for 5 months and havn't been paid in 9 months so yes definitely going bankrupt and loosing jobs. My job hunt has been severely marred by agents advertising jobs that don't exist or are out of date, also employers pulling jobs and not recruiting anyone after interviews. My local website shows 2000 jobs, there are typically 3 adverts for each job, and >1/2 are out of date, that means <300 actual jobs in N.Ireland.

Its hard for anyone to compete with China, they have been selling at a loss for all the time I have been working. We had a big push to source from EU companies at the start (to comply with EU1 grant requirements), and most of the EU suppliers said they could not buy raw material for the price the Chinese where selling more complex goods at for something simple like insulated wire. We had big volumes, plenty of purchasing power and world wide purchasing. That trend has continued throughout my career, although has been erroded with the reduction of Chinese export tax backs benefits. The increased labour costs and reducing sales in the west has lead China to try and focus on its internal economy which is currently strong, but I think fuelled by Sales to the west. The problem is and always has been that they copy the west, in products and now banking.

The only manufacturing I can see at the moment is more critical stuff that quality control/traceability etc is important. Medical, industrial, aviation etc. Western companies just do not trust the Chinese to supply these and rightly so, unless they are western owned (which has other problems in China, such a Mysterious power outages). A company we used agreed for us to retain AVL control, yet on the first production they broke the rule.

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Can you not use your skills elsewhere or can you diversify into other arenas?

Innovation is the only way to stay ahead in my books, lead the market instead of being led by the market is how I prefer to work so paying attention to trends and abreast of the news in walks of life can lead to new opportunities or avenues for further exploring.

We have advantages over other countries and we have disadvantages over other countries, somewhere there must be an opportunity ready for the taking.

I've tried to get a couple electrical prototypes built over here but been put off by the massive development costs becuase I can see when I'm being ripped off as the stuff wasnt rocket science. I wonder how much is greed that also leads to the demise of a business?

A really horrible side effect of our current system is that no really good ideas have any chance of being commercialised unless everyone between the "inventor" and the "market" can also get paid.

I am a "small state", "rational market" type of person. These sorts of perversions upset me massively.

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  • 284 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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