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Ed Milliband On The Andrew Marr Show

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I caught a few minutes of the Andrew Marr show this morning, he was interviewing Ed Milliband. Anyway, Marr was taking him to task over Labour's overspending while they were in government, and asking Ed to defend the level of debt, and the deficit which was run up under New Labour.

In his defence the new Labour leader came up with an interesting claim. He said that the debt and the deficit were in fact lower when they left government than when they took power in 1997. I assume he was referring to these values as a %age of GDP, not their nominal values. But even so, that does sound like a pretty incredible claim, and not something I would have thought possible.

Any HPC'rs know if there is any truth to what he said?

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UK debt end 1997 : 413,2 G£, i. e. 49,8 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 1998 : 410,2 G£, i. e. 46,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 1999 : 405,7 G£, i. e. 43,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2000 : 400,6 G£, i. e. 41,0 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2001 : 385,5 G£, i. e. 37,7 % of GDP (ONS) (end of conservative spending plans - gordo followed them remember?)

UK debt end 2002 : 402,9 G£, i. e. 37,5 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2003 : 441,1 G£, i. e. 38,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2004 : 487,9 G£, i. e. 40,4 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2005 : 529,4 G£, i. e. 42,3 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2006 : 573,3 G£, i. e. 43,4 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2007 : 618,4 G£, i. e. 44,2 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2008 : 750,3 G£, i. e. 52,0 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt for 2010 - 932 Million roughly 64% GDP (ukpublicspending.co.uk)

So Ed Milliband is talking out of his ****.

There is also the little notion of the direction of travel of that debt too. - the UK was in surplus when they took over.

edit look here linky

source (http://cluaran.free.fr/debt.html)

Edited by LJAR

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UK debt end 1997 : 413,2 G£, i. e. 49,8 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 1998 : 410,2 G£, i. e. 46,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 1999 : 405,7 G£, i. e. 43,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2000 : 400,6 G£, i. e. 41,0 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2001 : 385,5 G£, i. e. 37,7 % of GDP (ONS) (end of conservative spending plans - gordo followed them remember?)

UK debt end 2002 : 402,9 G£, i. e. 37,5 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2003 : 441,1 G£, i. e. 38,7 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2004 : 487,9 G£, i. e. 40,4 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2005 : 529,4 G£, i. e. 42,3 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2006 : 573,3 G£, i. e. 43,4 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2007 : 618,4 G£, i. e. 44,2 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt end 2008 : 750,3 G£, i. e. 52,0 % of GDP (ONS)

UK debt for 2010 - 932 Million roughly 64% GDP (ukpublicspending.co.uk)

So Ed Milliband is talking out of his ****.

There is also the little notion of the direction of travel of that debt too. - the UK was in surplus when they took over.

edit look here linky

source (http://cluaran.free.fr/debt.html)

It's all contained.

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Lies damn lies

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_national_debt_chart.html

Depends on what component of debt he is talking about. But looking at the graph above (middle of page) it's clear he is BSing the public.

And apart from which. What relevance does it have to the plight of britons today? He sounds like a Monty Python sketch....

"Prime Minister, it seems the public are suffering, and we should do something about it"

"What suffering?"

"Well SIr, our youth are being burdened with debts to pay for greedy boomers?"

"Well, we are boomers and are we greedy? "

"Our economy is teetering on collapse because of long term debts that our kids will pay off"

"Our banks have failed "

"Our manufacturing base has disappeared and we are dependent on the kind of useless scum who work in the city"

"And, it looks like Sterllng will collapse when we eventually implement the austerity measure we keep talking about..."

"Oh, that suffering, well noting compared to the suffering during the two great wars my dear old boy (Eaton speak)"

"So really, we are better off than before, are we not."

"I see PM, you are wise and munificent, can you spank me again like you used to at Eaton, and that orange looks tempting"

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Miliband was spouting such an incredible amount of BS, i'm surprised Andrew Marr didn't drown!

He blamed the crisis on the banks failing, when we all know and Marr also said that spending was rising at an exponential rate, shame they didn't even touch on PPP/PPI

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Miliband was spouting such an incredible amount of BS, i'm surprised Andrew Marr didn't drown!

He blamed the crisis on the banks failing, when we all know and Marr also said that spending was rising at an exponential rate, shame they didn't even touch on PPP/PPI

stop bitching about your next PM, simply revere him

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stop bitching about your next PM, simply revere him

I'm prepared to lay bets, that Red Ed will never become PM. Not that the Westminster punch and judy show makes any difference.

I take it Marr didn't challenge Mr Millibean?

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As far as I'm concerned, Labours largest crime wasn't the public debt.

The problem was the mountain of private debt that accumulated under their watch. They thought the public debt was affordable because the GDP created by the expanding private debt allowed them to borrow more and in turn expand the public sector.

The private sector debt created free money for all.. money for government, money into asset values, money into jobs. A socialist's paradise of free money for all to be doled out to grateful citizens by our miracle making heroic leaders of the time.

Of course, with hind sight we know the free money wasn't free, it was borrowed. And we also know that we couldn't afford to pay it back (hence IRs now at 0.5%). Much of the debt had to then be guaranteed by the public purse and money needed to be printed to avoid a crisis of confidence in the markets who feared (quite rightly) that none of this money would ever actually be paid back.

Ed Milliband can sit there and say none of this was Labours fault.. but this all happened under their watch and they were happy to milk the benefits of ten years of borrowed money. His best defence would be "they would have done the same", which is probably true to a greater or lesser extent. It also begs the question, where have all the great leaders gone.. ?

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He made the same daft argument twice:

The economic problems aren't caused by debts...

They were caused by the "financial crisis"

Well Ed, what the fook caused your "financial crisis" if it wasn't too much debt and those debts going bad?

I'm no economist but the man is laughable. Zero credibility.

Edited by Kyoto

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http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jameskirkup/100072186/ed-miliband-a-double-dip-recession-and-the-truth/

"Ed Miliband, a double-dip recession, and the truth"

On television this morning, Andrew Marr put it to Ed Miliband that the Labour leader had suggested that the Government’s economic policies could push Britain back into recession.

The exchange went like this:

ANDREW MARR:

You say they’re going to drive this country into a double-dip recession.

ED MILIBAND:

No, I don’t say that. I’ve never said that.

Which is interesting, because last year, Mr Miliband accused the Coalition of implementing

“harsh cuts to public investment which go faster and deeper than needed and will damage the economy, risking a double-dip recession.”

Those words come from an entry on his website, which is signed “Ed.”

It’s still online, here. http://edmiliband.org/2010/08/18/the-10-errors-that-show-the-coalition-is-taking-britain-backwards/

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As far as I'm concerned, Labours largest crime wasn't the public debt.

The problem was the mountain of private debt that accumulated under their watch. They thought the public debt was affordable because the GDP created by the expanding private debt allowed them to borrow more and in turn expand the public sector.

The private sector debt created free money for all.. money for government, money into asset values, money into jobs. A socialist's paradise of free money for all to be doled out to grateful citizens by our miracle making heroic leaders of the time.

Of course, with hind sight we know the free money wasn't free, it was borrowed. And we also know that we couldn't afford to pay it back (hence IRs now at 0.5%). Much of the debt had to then be guaranteed by the public purse and money needed to be printed to avoid a crisis of confidence in the markets who feared (quite rightly) that none of this money would ever actually be paid back.

Ed Milliband can sit there and say none of this was Labours fault.. but this all happened under their watch and they were happy to milk the benefits of ten years of borrowed money. His best defence would be "they would have done the same", which is probably true to a greater or lesser extent. It also begs the question, where have all the great leaders gone.. ?

Good post.

Just to add one very important point: Brown was not only passive regarding the bubble. He actively removed housing cost from the inflation index in Dec 2003.

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He made the same daft argument twice:

The economic problems aren't caused by debts...

They were caused by the "financial crisis"

Well Ed, what the fook caused your "financial crisis" if it wasn't too much debt and those debts going bad?

I'm no economist but the man is laughable. Zero credibility.

+ 1

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Good post.

Just to add one very important point: Brown was not only passive regarding the bubble. He actively removed housing cost from the inflation index in Dec 2003.

Also important to note that the Labour govt was receiving good tax revenues from the HPI based credit boom which flattered the debt figures (which don't include lots of things they should), but it was completely unsustainable as has been proved to be the case.

Millipede is just another duplicitous Labour scumbag with no connection to the people he purports to represent.

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He's the William Hague of the Labor Party.

BTW - What a stupid anachronistic name for a political party.... straight out of the 18th century.

What England needs is to dump the Scots and Welsh and NI, leave the EU. Only then will the UK be able form an independent trading block. The world will then see the magnificence of the country. And, the USA will rekindle it deep affection for the Brits: perhaps they will start selling us F35s at $200mln a plane (the true cost) after they have destroyed BP in the USA. And fined BAE a few quid (was it $300mln)? After all we really dont care that they cancelled the air tanker contract for illegal reasons (affecting thousands of jobs in the UK) - those jobs are in manufacturing and dont matter. What matters is growing Goldman Sachs business in the City to ensure more toxic debts can be sold to the EU.

I'm prepared to lay bets, that Red Ed will never become PM. Not that the Westminster punch and judy show makes any difference.

I take it Marr didn't challenge Mr Millibean?

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still unable to say sorry, still unable to take responsibility

This is Labour, a retarded collective of *****s. They show no remorse.

i'll vote them in this time round, the com/lib pact have let us all down " we are init together"

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Reading the 2007 budget is certainly interesting. Has any budget got economic predictions so wrong. Reads like total delusion considering what happened afterwards, pure comedy almost.

http://www.harddowdy.com/budget/21_03_07_budget_speech.pdf

I am surprised the conservatives did not put some of this stuff in there election campaign.

"Our first fiscal rule is that over the economic cycle, government current expenditures are paid by tax revenues."

"we will not take risks with or break from the stability essential to our long term economic performance."

"And we will never return to the old boom and bust."

Oh really?

I am surprised Gordon could keep a straight face whilst making this speech. Pure propaganda.

Ed seems to have no idea what he is talking about. Gordon's perpetual growth delusion based on a decade of debt was the real cause of the financial crisis in the UK.

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Also important to note that the Labour govt was receiving good tax revenues from the HPI based credit boom which flattered the debt figures (which don't include lots of things they should), but it was completely unsustainable as has been proved to be the case.

Millipede is just another duplicitous Labour scumbag with no connection to the people he purports to represent.

:lol:

Great post Constable.

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I'm prepared to lay bets, that Red Ed will never become PM. Not that the Westminster punch and judy show makes any difference.

I take it Marr didn't challenge Mr Millibean?

I am still upset that Diane Abbott did not win the leadership vote, her ability to ingore the facts in front of her and to continue to spout ever increasing amounts of made up nonsense is continuing to grow given her performance on Question Time.

There is something about the way that the upper reaches of the Labour party treat everyone like they are morons that is becoming increasingly disturbing. I heard someone the other day blaming Thatcher for the lack of council housing - yes I agree that may not have been the best policy looking back but the fact that NuLab did nothing about it for 13 years in Government is equally telling...

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I am still upset that Diane Abbott did not win the leadership vote, her ability to ingore the facts in front of her and to continue to spout ever increasing amounts of made up nonsense is continuing to grow given her performance on Question Time.

There is something about the way that the upper reaches of the Labour party treat everyone like they are morons that is becoming increasingly disturbing. I heard someone the other day blaming Thatcher for the lack of council housing - yes I agree that may not have been the best policy looking back but the fact that NuLab did nothing about it for 13 years in Government is equally telling...

See also people complaining about the benefit cuts and being morally outraged at the coalition that they are expected to get a job ("how can I get a job when there are no jobs out there?") when they have been unemployed for the last 10 years, right through the 'boom' years.

Edited by Bob Loblaw

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I think it's time we stepped back addressed the misconception that lefties are primarily concerned with politics. When I use the term "politics" what I mean is looking at the world objectively -measuring it if you will- then asking yourself how things can be improved from the societal level, and from that basis carefully formulating policy to hopefully maximise wealth and minimise pain.

What Miliband and co have gotten hold of is clearly something closer to a religion, so they'll happily bend reality at will to make it fit with their worldview.

Hopefully in two hundred years time the public will have the same attitude to socialism as they do currently to Christianity.

Edited by Chef

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I'm prepared to lay bets, that Red Ed will never become PM.

With you there. He is not PM material. He can play a valuable role as a good leader of the opposition but that is all.

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See also people complaining about the benefit cuts and being morally outraged at the coalition that they are expected to get a job ("how can I get a job when there are no jobs out there?") when they have been unemployed for the last 10 years, right through the 'boom' years.

Exactly, and now we have Labour politicians bemoaning the fact that some parts of the UK are so heavily dependent on public sector spending. They were in power for 13 years of a so called boom and could have made progress to encourge 'proper' job creation in these areas. Instead they threw public money at them and left them vunerable to Government cuts - presumably to secure future votes when these ' nasty Tories'' do the neccesary....

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  • 285 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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