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Europe’S Young Grow Agitated Over Future Prospects

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http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/02/world/europe/02youth.html?ref=business

Francesca Esposito, 29 and exquisitely educated, helped win millions of euros in false disability and other lawsuits for her employer, a major Italian state agency. But one day last fall she quit, fed up with how surreal and ultimately sad it is to be young in Italy today.

It galled her that even with her competence and fluency in five languages, it was nearly impossible to land a paying job. Working as an unpaid trainee lawyer was bad enough, she thought, but doing it at Italy’s social security administration seemed too much. She not only worked for free on behalf of the nation’s elderly, who have generally crowded out the young for jobs, but her efforts there did not even apply to her own pension.

“It was absurd,” said Ms. Esposito, a strong-willed woman with a healthy sense of outrage.

The outrage of the young has erupted, sometimes violently, on the streets of Greece and Italy in recent weeks, as students and more radical anarchists protest not only specific austerity measures in flattened economies but a rising reality in Southern Europe: People like Ms. Esposito feel increasingly shut out of their own futures. Experts warn of volatility in state finances and the broader society as the most highly educated generation in the history of the Mediterranean hits one of its worst job markets.

Politicians are slowly beginning to take notice. Italy’s president, Giorgio Napolitano, devoted his year-end message on Friday to “the pervasive malaise among young people,” weeks after protests against budget cuts to the university system brought the issue to the fore.

Giuliano Amato, an economist and former Italian prime minister, was even more blunt. “By now, only a few people refuse to understand that youth protests aren’t a protest against the university reform, but against a general situation in which the older generations have eaten the future of the younger ones,” he recently told Corriere della Sera, Italy’s largest newspaper.

The daughter of a fireman and a high school teacher, Ms. Esposito was the first in her family to graduate from college and the first to study foreign languages. She has an Italian law degree and a master’s from Germany and was an intern at the European Court of Justice in Luxembourg. It has not helped.

“I have every possible certificate,” Ms. Esposito said dryly. “I have everything except a death certificate.”

Even before the economic crisis hit, Southern Europe was not an easy place to forge a career. Low growth and a corrosive lack of meritocracy have long posed challenges to finding a job in Italy, Greece, Spain and Portugal. Today, with the added sting of austerity, more people are left fighting over fewer opportunities. It is a zero-sum game that inevitably pits younger workers struggling to enter the labor market against older ones already occupying precious slots.

As a result, a deep malaise has set in among young people. Some take to the streets in protest; others emigrate to Northern Europe or beyond in an epic brain drain of college graduates. But many more suffer in silence, living in their childhood bedrooms well into adulthood because they cannot afford to move out.

More at the link.

Nice work for free, get no pension whilst the boomers take it all.

On a side note clearly not related to article I wouldn't say no to Esposito she looks very sultry.

Back on topic, it would appear that the young are becoming increasing aware the older generation have spent all the money and expect the young to fund their retirement ensuring they young have nothing when it comes to theirs. Something is going to give and I get a feeling it's going to get very nasty unless the older generation admit the promises they have made themselves can't be kept. So far the elder generation appear unwilling to admit the promises can't be kept.

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Back on topic, it would appear that the young are becoming increasing aware the older generation have spent all the money and expect the young to fund their retirement ensuring they young have nothing when it comes to theirs. Something is going to give and I get a feeling it's going to get very nasty unless the older generation admit the promises they have made themselves can't be kept. So far the elder generation appear unwilling to admit the promises can't be kept.

Yup, as said much of my peer group feel the same way. I am surprised many of them actually work because after expenses of getting to work eating and council tax as well as insurance etc they are seldom left with much and the end of the month. As bikers to each other we'll buy each other tanks of petrol so we can have some collective enjoyment. But almost all of them at the end of the month have less than £50 to last out the month.

And before you say it few of them watch TV or have expensive phones or whatnot.

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Yup, as said much of my peer group feel the same way. I am surprised many of them actually work because after expenses of getting to work eating and council tax as well as insurance etc they are seldom left with much and the end of the month. As bikers to each other we'll buy each other tanks of petrol so we can have some collective enjoyment. But almost all of them at the end of the month have less than £50 to last out the month.

And before you say it few of them watch TV or have expensive phones or whatnot.

Why haven't they MEW'd to afford the above? Clearly they don't understand how the economy works no wonder everything is so screwed. The young have no basic grasp of modern economics. :ph34r:

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Why haven't they MEW'd to afford the above? Clearly they don't understand how the economy works no wonder everything is so screwed. The young have no basic grasp of modern economics. :ph34r:

I didn't know you could MEW rented property of bedsits.

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Back on topic, it would appear that the young are becoming increasing aware the older generation have spent all the money and expect the young to fund their retirement ensuring they young have nothing when it comes to theirs. Something is going to give and I get a feeling it's going to get very nasty unless the older generation admit the promises they have made themselves can't be kept. So far the elder generation appear unwilling to admit the promises can't be kept.

I seriously thought the young would have been allowed to have a bite at the cherry, but it would appear their role is to just to work like dogs and see very little in return, no house, barely any spare money and no prospects of a better future no matter how hard they work. And all so some greedy fookers can keep money they never earned in the first place.

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I seriously thought the young would have been allowed to have a bite at the cherry, but it would appear their role is to just to work like dogs and see very little in return, no house, barely any spare money and no prospects of a better future no matter how hard they work. And all so some greedy fookers can keep money they never earned in the first place.

I have nagged "the young" to get off their rses and do something about it for a long time so I'm pleased that at last some of them are waking up. I'm not so pleased about the poisonous meme that their parents stole their futures.

A quick look at who owns the wealth puts it into perspective, there seems to be no increase in wealth amongst the lower 90% of people, but a massive increase in the top 10%. The latter group, of course, includes the banking sharks.

The plot is to beggar us all, old and young alike (where the feck did half my earned private pension go?), it stepped up massively in the late 90's. Just because my notional wealth has increased, doesn't mean I'm actually any richer.

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In many major western cities unemployment among those 18-25 who are not going to school is around an astonishing 50%. When the ones who finish university get out, they find their prospects dim.

Amongst young adults is exactly where I would expect unemployment to hit hardest. If you look in corporations and governments they downsize mainly by waiting for people to retire, or when people leave for other jobs. Then they simply don't replace them, and re-assign the responsibilities. Or in many cases the job has long since been made obselete.

Sometimes the companies get desperate and actually fire masses of people, but that is rare, compared to simply not replacing people.

The terrible or incredible reality is we just don't need most of these people's labour. To meet the 'material needs of the masses', the electricity, steel, automobiles, agriculture, etc.. takes a fraction of the available workforce. And we can only afford so many diversity consultants and change management agents.

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More at the link.

Nice work for free, get no pension whilst the boomers take it all.

On a side note clearly not related to article I wouldn't say no to Esposito she looks very sultry.

Back on topic, it would appear that the young are becoming increasing aware the older generation have spent all the money and expect the young to fund their retirement ensuring they young have nothing when it comes to theirs. Something is going to give and I get a feeling it's going to get very nasty unless the older generation admit the promises they have made themselves can't be kept. So far the elder generation appear unwilling to admit the promises can't be kept.

I feel most of the elders will never admit what they did. Virtually all believe they 'earned' their pension, no matter how generous. There are a few elders out there who know what is going on and are very concerned for their kids and grandkids, but they don't know what to do.

I have met in business kind old ladies and gentlemen who have used their money to buy their kids and grandkids houses.

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It's the same everywhere. Just think how it feels to be a graduate in USA, where it costs $100k+ to goto uni!

We have been utterly shafted on so many fronts and yet the news concentrates of weathly boomers not being able to find buyers for their over priced property or that property prices are falling and that makes you poorer, the 'you' bit sums up who their news is aimed at, property owning boomers.

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The system is broken!

Time to hit the reset button?

I'm with you on that one. The Boomers have no understanding of what faces kids these days and their bankrupt society offers no solutions either. Government spending on people of state pension age has already soared by nearly £14 billion since the first of the baby boomers started to draw their state pension at the age of 60 in 2005/06. It is expected to have increased by nearly another £4 billion by 2012 when 800,000 Boomers will retire (150,000 more than will retire this year). Add on a few more billion for 'free' bus passes and winter fuel allowances and then, for good measure, load up the youth with debt before they've even started work. The young simply cannot afford to pay for the continuation of the Boomer lifestyle. Time for a radical rethink.

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In many major western cities unemployment among those 18-25 who are not going to school is around an astonishing 50%. When the ones who finish university get out, they find their prospects dim.

Amongst young adults is exactly where I would expect unemployment to hit hardest. If you look in corporations and governments they downsize mainly by waiting for people to retire, or when people leave for other jobs. Then they simply don't replace them, and re-assign the responsibilities. Or in many cases the job has long since been made obselete.

Sometimes the companies get desperate and actually fire masses of people, but that is rare, compared to simply not replacing people.

The terrible or incredible reality is we just don't need most of these people's labour. To meet the 'material needs of the masses', the electricity, steel, automobiles, agriculture, etc.. takes a fraction of the available workforce. And we can only afford so many diversity consultants and change management agents.

We could move to a 4 day work week could we not?

I'm sure that would create a shed load of jobs and it may be the answer we are looking for

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I have nagged "the young" to get off their rses and do something about it for a long time so I'm pleased that at last some of them are waking up. I'm not so pleased about the poisonous meme that their parents stole their futures.

A quick look at who owns the wealth puts it into perspective, there seems to be no increase in wealth amongst the lower 90% of people, but a massive increase in the top 10%. The latter group, of course, includes the banking sharks.

The plot is to beggar us all, old and young alike (where the feck did half my earned private pension go?), it stepped up massively in the late 90's. Just because my notional wealth has increased, doesn't mean I'm actually any richer.

Hang on a minute....

You complain about the poisonous meme that their parent's stole their futures while, in the same breath, castigating the young for not getting off their arses, inplying that their circumstances were their own doing. In this regard, you are no less guilty than anyone else of apportioning easy blame.

The above is all the more pogniant since you obviously are fully aware that the point is, indeed, to beggar us all. The young have every right to be angry. It is also perfectly understandable that such anger is going to be missapplied to some extent. They need the full support of the old. It's difficult enough for them understanding how their futures are so comprehensively f*cked.

If I hear another "the young are feckless", or "the young don't know their arses from their elbows" or "the young never had it so good" I'm gonna fecking blow

Edited by tallguy

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I didn't know you could MEW rented property of bedsits.

Your not thinking this through, this brings a whole new level to liar loans. Borrow money against something you don't even own. You would be sort of short selling the property.

I mean if this sort of trick is good enough for the City is should be good enough for everyone else.

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Hang on a minute....

You complain about the poisonous meme that their parent's steal;stole theior futures while, in the same breath, castigating them for not getting off their arses, inplying that their circumstances were their own doing. In this regard, you are no less guilty than anyone else of apportionng easy blame.

The above is all the more pogniant since you obviously are fully aware that the point is, indeed, to beggar us all. The young have every right to be angry. It is also perfectly understandable that such anger is going to be missapplied to some extent. They need the full support of the old. It's difficult enough for them understanding how their futures are so comprehensively f*cked.

If I hear another "the young are feckless", or "the young don't know their arses from their elbows" or "the young never had it so good" I'm gonna fecking blow

You misunderstand me a little. I never castigated them, I tried to educate them. Most were unaware of what was going on, having no reference point in the past to make the comparison between then and now. It was only since it hit them in the face (increased student fees) that some of them have woken up. It's not a question of getting of their rses, they simply didn't see the train wreck coming. Very, very few of us did. Many still don't.

A point in case: I went to a concert by a singer-songwriter young friend of ours. Every single song was about love and romance. After, I asked him if he had any political views, where would he like society to go? He was totally bemused. Young people don't want to hear that stuff, he said.

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Italy is a bit of a special case AFAIK, though maybe Greece has the same problems.

I've heard from young Italians (most recently just before Christmas, from a young Italian (early 30s) working with Mr B] that whatever your qualifications you don't have much hope of getting a decent (or any) job unless you know somebody. Nepotism is absolutely rife. Also, you are judged at interview, always assuming you can get one in the first place, mostly by your clothes and accessories. The young Italian* I met in Dec. said that their reasoning goes like this; 'Oh, if he can afford designer clothes he must be OK.'

Another young Italian told me a while ago that they will notice even your belt, and if it's not e.g. Armani they basically put you down as worth jack sh*t.

*Same bloke, who recently bought a property in London, also told Mr B a while ago that he and his (Italian) wife plan to bring up their child in the UK, since from a work POV at least you have a reasonable chance of being judged on your merits.

Edited by Mrs Bear

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Isn't it pretty obvious?

The boomers are not gonna get paid their pensions.

For the simple reason they can't be paid. The cupboard might not be quite bare yet and it may be six months, or six years or sixteen but the cupboard is not deep enough for them to get paid.

I have quite a lot of sympathy for all those sociable, bewildered boomers who are just about to enroll in the bowls club but they won't be able to run the camper van on that, let alone chuck money at Michael Ryan.

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Italy is a bit of a special case AFAIK, though maybe Greece has the same problems.

Unfortunately this situation is widespread. Spain has youth unemployment of 42%. The OECD expects youth unemployment rates across the developed world to remain at around 18% in 2011 and 17% in 2012 compared to a current general rate of 8.6%. In New Zealand, Sweden and Luxembourg, the youth-to-adult unemployment ratio is more than four. In Japan, that has suffered almost two decades of economic stagnation, 41% of men aged 35-39 still live with their parents, lacking the financial stability to get married or buy their own home. The pattern is repeated across different cultures and economies in the West.

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I'm with you on that one. The Boomers have no understanding of what faces kids these days and their bankrupt society offers no solutions either. Government spending on people of state pension age has already soared by nearly £14 billion since the first of the baby boomers started to draw their state pension at the age of 60 in 2005/06. It is expected to have increased by nearly anothhttp://er £4 billion by 2012 when 800,000 Boomers will retire (150,000 more than will retire this year). Add on a few more billion for 'free' bus passes and winter fuel allowances and then, for good measure, load up the youth with debt before they've even started work. The young simply cannot afford to pay for the continuation of the Boomer lifestyle. Time for a radical rethink.

FFS the state pension at £ 95.65 is barely more than £30 a week more than JSA at £65.45.

It is hardly a rich reward for people who may have been paying Class 1 NIC for 50 years since the age of 15.

BTW compared to Italy Britain has a far healthier demographic profile

2008-05-21-italy-population-pyramid.jpg

UK Population Pyramid 2009

6.gif

Anyway to find a generation really betrayed by its elders I think those reaching 18 from 1914 onwards probably had more of a case.

Edited by realcrookswearsuits

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I'm with you on that one. The Boomers have no understanding of what faces kids these days and their bankrupt society offers no solutions either. Government spending on people of state pension age has already soared by nearly £14 billion since the first of the baby boomers started to draw their state pension at the age of 60 in 2005/06. It is expected to have increased by nearly another £4 billion by 2012 when 800,000 Boomers will retire (150,000 more than will retire this year). Add on a few more billion for 'free' bus passes and winter fuel allowances and then, for good measure, load up the youth with debt before they've even started work. The young simply cannot afford to pay for the continuation of the Boomer lifestyle. Time for a radical rethink.

Cut the "boomers" bullsh*t as if you are describing some kinds amorphous, coherent group of like-minded people who all share one particular world view and who share one particular position in the socio-economic strata. They don't.

You just wish that they did so you have an easy target for your mindless anger and frustration.

Grow the f*ck up and take a look at the bigger picture you idiot.

Edited by tallguy

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The generations after the second world war had to organise within unions to fight for what they got.

The younger generations took it for granted and expected it to be all handed to them on a plate but it doesnt work like that.

The rich elite are clawing it all back - public services, welfare including well paid jobs and pensions.

You just havent earnt it yet baby!

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The generations after the second world war had to organise within unions to fight for what they got.

The younger generations took it for granted and expected it to be all handed to them on a plate but it doesnt work like that.

The rich elite are clawing it all back - public services, welfare including well paid jobs and pensions.

You just havent earnt it yet baby!

The gnerations after the war formed un unions because, firstly, they were employed in large workforces because of the nature of mass-prodcution. This meant they had the management over a barrel. The reason they were willing to take advantage of the above situation is because they had just spilled their guts in the second world war. Since the seventies, there has been no large-scale industry and so it is far harder for workers to unite. I would argue they would have fared no better than the workers of today if this had been the econonmic conditions they'd had to contend with in the fifties.

Stop with the bigging-up of the generaion following the war as if they were something special.

They weren't

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  • 285 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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