Daft Boy Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 If labour had still been in power then the snow would have all been cleared from all the roads and all airports would be working normally. Thats if you believe the shadow transport minister. You have to admire her gross stupidity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snafu Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 (edited) Couple of points: 1. Finding a snow shovel in this ill equipped country is nigh on impossible (don't get me started on ill-insulated houses and drafty doors and windows. I nearly ordered two from Sweden. 2. Due to people moving houses every other flipping year, people don't often know the people they live right next to, mind the your area of the street! If more people actually KNEW each other, it wouldn't be so difficult gathering people up and shoveling the street. 3 3. The English man has the psyche of "someone else should do it" when it comes to sorting your street out and clear it from snow. Seriously, a bit like "someone else should sort the country out too" and "I can't be arsed voting". And yes this is a criticism of the English. Too bloody comfortable. There isn't even a "small" society in England, so I agree that it will be bloody difficult to create a "big society". I remember reading about all this at uni about how building a working good democracy is not only about the voting system - but having the right democratic culture going through each layer of society. So societies where you have local neighbourhood clubs, bowling clubs and whatever clubs - they tend to have more stable and well functioning countries overall with higher voting averages. My girlfriend's parents street was completely snowed in, girlfriends dad couldn't even get the car out the street. I got the sodding shovel and did it myself. Why can't people just get together? Is it a case of "what would people think?". I suspect it might. Edited December 20, 2010 by Snafu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erranta Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Couple of points: 1. Finding a snow shovel in this ill equipped country is nigh on impossible (don't get me started on ill-insulated houses and drafty doors and windows. I nearly ordered two from Sweden. 2. Due to people moving houses every other flipping year, people don't often know the people they live right next to, mind the your area of the street! If more people actually KNEW each other, it wouldn't be so difficult gathering people up and shoveling the street. 3 3. The English man has the psyche of "someone else should do it" when it comes to sorting your street out and clear it from snow. Seriously, a bit like "someone else should sort the country out too" and "I can't be arsed voting". And yes this is a criticism of the English. Too bloody comfortable. There isn't even a "small" society in England, so I agree that it will be bloody difficult to create a "big society". I remember reading about all this at uni about how building a working good democracy is not only about the voting system - but having the right democratic culture going through each layer of society. So societies where you have local neighbourhood clubs, bowling clubs and whatever clubs - they tend to have more stable and well functioning countries overall with higher voting averages. My girlfriend's parents street was completely snowed in, girlfriends dad couldn't even get the car out the street. I got the sodding shovel and did it myself. Why can't people just get together? Is it a case of "what would people think?". I suspect it might. I stuck an HPC Heads-UP weeks ago on the cold weather thread to buy anything winter/snow related before the UK runs out - coz I know they get in a prescribed amount of container loads from Asia/the manufacturers for the season then that's it! If they tried ordering more - it would be April/May before the stuff arrives! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olebrum Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 nulabour should have bought the millenium dome big enough to cover the UK...Oh, and wasnt it supposed to have collapsed at end of life in 2004??...useless German engineering. The Millenium Sham was a Tory project, NuLabour just carried on with the farce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrB Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 I love your thought process... lots of snow -> government's responsibility -> big society's responsibility -> somebody else's responsibility Grow up and buy a shovel. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 (edited) The English man has the psyche of "someone else should do it" when it comes to sorting your street out and clear it from snow. Seriously, a bit like "someone else should sort the country out too" and "I can't be arsed voting". And yes this is a criticism of the English. The English have already paid council tax in order for somebody else to take care of the job, I understand. I think you'll also find that voting doesn't change anything, either. Not to mention, that people in Norway, Sweden, Iceland (insert 'perfect' country here) also moan about a lot of things. All the time, in fact. For example, the Swedes are pathological about voting for political parties that want to ethnically cleanse them in their own country. They also moan a lot about the weather, high taxes and almost anything and everything else you can think of. Anyway, thanks for another insight into the mind of a self-hater. Edited December 20, 2010 by Brett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the shaping machine Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Perhaps the councils should offer optional "snow insurance": You pay X pounds per metre of pavement each year with your council tax. If it snows they come and clear it within 12 hours, or your money back. How many people would purchase this? How many would take the gamble, save the money, and do it themselves if they really wanted it done? . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Perhaps the councils should offer optional "snow insurance": You pay X pounds per metre of pavement each year with your council tax. If it snows they come and clear it within 12 hours, or your money back. How many people would purchase this? How many would take the gamble, save the money, and do it themselves if they really wanted it done? I was talking more about the streets, but fair enough. Not many would. I am just tired of the 'British are so...", the" English are lazy, ill-disciplined" etc etc. Just really grates after a while. I'm sure many people were out clearing their paths recently in Britain. Maybe some people just didn't bother because they didn't have time. And I'm sure Sky or the BBC ran an obligatory report on how wimpy English people are when it snows, and how we may as well all queue up to be euthanised so as not to be a burden on the state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bogbrush Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Perhaps the councils should offer optional "snow insurance": You pay X pounds per metre of pavement each year with your council tax. If it snows they come and clear it within 12 hours, or your money back. How many people would purchase this? How many would take the gamble, save the money, and do it themselves if they really wanted it done? . I will. Especially as the Council doesn't touch within 500 yards of my house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the shaping machine Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 I was talking more about the streets, but fair enough. Not many would. I wasn't really directly replying to your post, more to the general attitude pushed in the media that "they ought to be doing something". Unfortunately the "something" costs money, and if the people moaning had to pay directly for that service I suspect they might be more willing to get outside with a shovel. It would be an interesting thing to test. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the shaping machine Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 I will. Especially as the Council doesn't touch within 500 yards of my house. I suspect you pay more than your share towards the areas they do clear... . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snafu Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Brett, the uk councils are not equipped to deal with the snow, huge infrastructure investments are needed. Either you accept that or pay more c.tax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammo Posted December 20, 2010 Share Posted December 20, 2010 Couple of points: 1. Finding a snow shovel in this ill equipped country is nigh on impossible (don't get me started on ill-insulated houses and drafty doors and windows. I nearly ordered two from Sweden. 2. Due to people moving houses every other flipping year, people don't often know the people they live right next to, mind the your area of the street! If more people actually KNEW each other, it wouldn't be so difficult gathering people up and shoveling the street. 3 3. The English man has the psyche of "someone else should do it" when it comes to sorting your street out and clear it from snow. Seriously, a bit like "someone else should sort the country out too" and "I can't be arsed voting". And yes this is a criticism of the English. Too bloody comfortable. There isn't even a "small" society in England, so I agree that it will be bloody difficult to create a "big society". I remember reading about all this at uni about how building a working good democracy is not only about the voting system - but having the right democratic culture going through each layer of society. So societies where you have local neighbourhood clubs, bowling clubs and whatever clubs - they tend to have more stable and well functioning countries overall with higher voting averages. My girlfriend's parents street was completely snowed in, girlfriends dad couldn't even get the car out the street. I got the sodding shovel and did it myself. Why can't people just get together? Is it a case of "what would people think?". I suspect it might. Sure you are right in many cases, but.. 1. I used a spade - when the snow is deep and packed, the spade takes up a chunk at a time - the shovel would be good for the few inches for sure, but when it's deep and frozen, a spade is a spade 2. You get to actually meet people you've never seen the faces of before if you actually go outside once in a while! 3. You are right, often times if you ignore it, it'll go away. But then selfishness swings both ways - as the indoors folks realise they themselves aren't able to get out in time for the lottery or whatever. They'll soon chip in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkG Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 Brett, the uk councils are not equipped to deal with the snow, huge infrastructure investments are needed. Either you accept that or pay more c.tax. Or the councils could spend more money on doing their job and less on 'diversity officers' and printing all their paperwork in six languages. Fortunately around here there's a guy with a mini snow-plough who drives around the streets keeping them clear. I guess it's a good excuse to get out of the house . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Spart Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 (edited) Where's The Big Society When You Need It? Down the pub. Watching Britain's Got X-Idols. Edited December 21, 2010 by Dave Spart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sun n sea Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 The English have already paid council tax in order for somebody else to take care of the job. The fatal flaw in the whole Big Society idea...... "look after your own community whilst we spend all your council tax on something more important... chief exec wages, bulging pension pots etc etc" The knob who runs my local council earns a quarter of a million quid per year plus perks so I'm certainly not going to be helping him out anytime soon.... if you can't afford to clear the snow then change your spending priorities you pr!ck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpe Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 In town the roads were salted and gritted but as usual nothing has been done to the pavements, which are treacherous ice and hard-packed snow. Even in the pedestrianised shopping centre, precious little had been done to make it safer underfoot. So - where was the Big Society? If people can't even organise to clear snow in a busy town centre, what chance of there being the will to take over public services? And no, I'm not going to put my money where my mouth is. It's not my job to clear snow in the town centre, specially if I'm not paid. You can usually tell when you are walking past a small family run business as the pavement is clear outside. Walk past any large corporate outlet - snow packed hard as ice making pavements unwalkable. That is the problem with these large corporations - the people working there have no sense of ownership nor do they care about the company other than getting the wage. Was that what Marx called alienation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 It's really simple. "You are the big society." Your society will be as big as you make it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpe Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 It's really simple. "You are the big society." Your society will be as big as you make it. said the master to the slave - in between counting his billions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 said the master to the slave - in between counting his billions You can either look at it like that or that we're all travelling on the same lump of rock going through space and we should probably try to help each other. I can't believe I just wrote that... Must be the frost bite getting to me. I don't actually see anything wrong in helping my neighbours where I can though. My time is something I can freely give and often have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpe Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 (edited) You can either look at it like that or that we're all travelling on the same lump of rock going through space and we should probably try to help each other. I can't believe I just wrote that... Must be the frost bite getting to me. I don't actually see anything wrong in helping my neighbours where I can though. My time is something I can freely give and often have. you are right this is my society - and I think anti social parasitic organisations should be fairly tried and punished if guilty. so most of the corporations that are highly anti social, pay no tax pump the airwaves with psychologically damaging material, impact aggressive foreign policy etc... large banks and their political whores like David Cameroon should be fairly tried and then punished if found guilty (like in Iceland we are starting to see a genuine big society.) edit - can you come and clear snow from around Cirencester - get it done today or are you lieing in your last sentence? Edited December 21, 2010 by sharpe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cptkernow Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 (edited) Co-operatives, which are a form of big society employ 20% more people than multi nationals. Their is a model for this form of social organisation and it is all ready hugely popular and successful. CO OPs Edited December 21, 2010 by Cptkernow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 you are right this is my society - and I think anti social parasitic organisations should be fairly tried and punished if guilty. so most of the corporations that are highly anti social, pay no tax pump the airwaves with psychologically damaging material, impact aggressive foreign policy etc... large banks and their political whores like David Cameroon should be fairly tried and then punished if found guilty (like in Iceland we are starting to see a genuine big society.) edit - can you come and clear snow from around Cirencester - get it done today or are you lieing in your last sentence? It'd take me a long time to walk to Cirencester - if you were closer I might think about it (Like next door but one!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharpe Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 It'd take me a long time to walk to Cirencester - if you were closer I might think about it (Like next door but one!) You said: My time is something I can freely give and often have. I need a multi-tude of jobs doing. Can you PM me please, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarahBell Posted December 21, 2010 Share Posted December 21, 2010 You said: I need a multi-tude of jobs doing. Can you PM me please, thanks. Can you leave the keys for me under the mat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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