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pandabear

Pension Woes Are All Gordons Fault

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Sorry but this griped me, i've been losing pensions since 1998. Long before the recent arguments started

he (Gordon Brown) destroyed the pensions of many by his taxation policies-- he destroyed the hopes of a generation to own a home by actively feeding a boom and bust--I could go on all night.

Actually, Gordon is simply the (willing) whipping boy for the underperformance of the financial companies/ banks/ pension schemes. If anyone can explain to me why "Gordons Pension Tax Grab" - a 10% tax on the growth of the fund, f'ed over everyones pensions i would love to know. Surely we were lied to by these financial companies, who promised "growth", but couldnt maintain these even given a 10% tax (on growth) which was untaxed before. He just took the fund managers bonuses, so they (the fund managers) stoppped working and looked for an easy scapegoat (Gordon). Try reading Cityboy for a closely related explanation to the principles of fund management.

Final Salary Schemes, in the late 90's the press regularly told senior managers to remove their pensions from the company scheme as the law required a contribution which would return an equivalent pension from the new scheme. Thus those who had had large pots, and hence low relative costs could afford to move. The financial companies wanted these large pots so they can take their cut. End result, not enough money to pay existing pensioners, scheme collapses, we workers shafted again for the benefit again of our masters. Strangely our press have forgotten this!

Equitable life, who on earth could decide that the guaranteed pensioners took all, when the others fundholders lost everything. Oh, the judiciary, who were recommended, in the absence of a formal scheme, to invest in the Equitable Life guaranteed scheme. When it all goes tits up, who decides the most important beneficiaries. Obviously they looked after themselves. Non rich, non legal pensioners really dont matter.

As to the current moves to replace RPI increases with CPI, then unless you arent involved in any pension scheme, you really should look at the kids and how they react against tuition fees for your example. According to actuaries, retirement is a long time.

A long time to watch yourself being robbed.

A long time to feel poorer.

A long time to regret not having the balls to say anything when it really matters.

There is very little government can influence in how the banks run without finding themselves unpopular, but lots of bankers telling the government how to be popular. Sadly, we expect government to watch the bankers without influence. But the banks hold all our money....

House prices? OK.

I could go on too, mostly in agreement, but im a socialist, Gordon never was.

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When the Institute of Actuaries call it a "raid" and calculate the impact at 100-150 Billion, I tend to listen:

The total current and future impact of Mr Brown's move — known technically as the abolition of Advanced Corporation Tax (ACT) relief — has been calculated by Terry Arthur, a fellow of the Institute of Actuaries, in a paper written for the professional body. Mr Arthur said: "What happened in 1997 represented an enormous and ongoing raid on the assets of UK company pension schemes. My research shows it would be very hard to justify an impact of less than £100 billion — and even £150 billion may still be a conservative estimate."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1531448/Browns-raid-on-pensions-costs-Britain-100-billion.html

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When the Institute of Actuaries call it a "raid" and calculate the impact at 100-150 Billion, I tend to listen:

....

The removal of a tax advantage is not a raid. Governments can and do change the tax regime. Its sort of like what governments are for if you think about it. The hysterical bleating from the rich is simply that their mega pension funds were being taxed to fund frivolous rubbish like alleviating child poverty, something they couldn't give a monkey's about.

Pensions are unaffordable. You cannot pay 5% of your pay into a fund for 25 years and get back 60% of your salary for 30. The Ponzi nature of the system has fallen foul of the demographics time bomb that was talked about and ignored in the '60s. Those people that are already or shortly to be retired will perhaps be lucky. Those that want their money in the years that follow will be highly disappointed. No amount of tinkering with the tax will change that fact. Making the whole thing tax free will not change that fact.

The bank fraud has bankrupted the country. More tax take is needed (the size of deficit is a shortage of tax primarily not an overspend - though to be fair Brown did overspend) as cutting services will hit the GDP and lower tax take in a viscous circle. VAT has done up but the Tories, true to type, are cutting tax for the rich. Therefore you can expect more tax advantages to be removed.

Pensions are unaffordable. Many people are going to get burned. In the end the taxpayer will bailout the pension Ponzi - if there are any taxpayers left :D:D

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Pensions are unaffordable. Many people are going to get burned. In the end the taxpayer will bailout the pension Ponzi - if there are any taxpayers left :D:D

...but, but my house and BTL portfolio is my pension. :P

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The removal of a tax advantage is not a raid. Governments can and do change the tax regime. Its sort of like what governments are for if you think about it. The hysterical bleating from the rich is simply that their mega pension funds were being taxed to fund frivolous rubbish like alleviating child poverty, something they couldn't give a monkey's about.

Pensions are unaffordable. You cannot pay 5% of your pay into a fund for 25 years and get back 60% of your salary for 30. The Ponzi nature of the system has fallen foul of the demographics time bomb that was talked about and ignored in the '60s. Those people that are already or shortly to be retired will perhaps be lucky. Those that want their money in the years that follow will be highly disappointed. No amount of tinkering with the tax will change that fact. Making the whole thing tax free will not change that fact.

The bank fraud has bankrupted the country. More tax take is needed (the size of deficit is a shortage of tax primarily not an overspend - though to be fair Brown did overspend) as cutting services will hit the GDP and lower tax take in a viscous circle. VAT has done up but the Tories, true to type, are cutting tax for the rich. Therefore you can expect more tax advantages to be removed.

Pensions are unaffordable. Many people are going to get burned. In the end the taxpayer will bailout the pension Ponzi - if there are any taxpayers left :D:D

Well damn me non-frog, but I paid more than 5% over 35 years, and I got an annuity of about 10% of my final salary, and that was the best flat rate annuity I could find at the time (pre-crunch). An index-linked one would have returned me 2% of the fund p.a. The financial non-services industry are seriously taking the pizz.

I think the trouble is there are too many public sector final salary schemes around, both a drain on the public accounts and stopping a lot of people getting angry about the situation.

I think the introduction of NEST might ruffle a few feathers. I do hope so, because pension provision seems to have a worse return than the national lottery. The only safe place for saving has seemed to be, you guessed it, bricks and mortar.

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....

I think the trouble is there are too many public sector final salary schemes around, both a drain on the public accounts and stopping a lot of people getting angry about the situation.

....

These people might get angry if the UK follows the Irish and starts to cut the payout and cut it retrospectively. Meanwhile the taxpayers (all four of you) might get angry at bailing out BT and BA both of whose schemes are bankrupt but guaranteed by the taxpayer (thanks Mrs T you lying tw@t).

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  • 312 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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