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cashinmattress

China #1, United States #2?

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Mao's Great Leap Forward 'killed 45 million in four years'

Chairman Mao, founder of the People's Republic of China, qualifies as the greatest mass murderer in world history.

And the Chinese people still do not know about it.

Very Scary place if you ask me.

The suppression of the worlds worst genocide carried out by the state, cannot be healthy for any nation. Never mind one that was carried out against its own people. And the present totalitarian government is the direct descendant of Mao's.

Following an economic collapse, civil war would seem like one possibility.

No wonder they ban Google!!

Every nation has a dark history. Looking at the recent history of a developed nation using your eyes and experience of a developed nation is not a good comparison.

I'm sure you can Google dark moments of UK history.

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Every nation has a dark history. Looking at the recent history of a developed nation using your eyes and experience of a developed nation is not a good comparison.

I'm sure you can Google dark moments of UK history.

Come off it. :rolleyes:

Edited by Dan1

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Central Asia has lots of oil and gas, it has land borders too. In Turkmenistan they have so much gas, people simply never turn the gas cookers off as it costs matches!

There is a hole in Turkmenistan which has been burning since the 1970s

There is also Taiwan, Siberia which is incredibly rich in oil, gold, coal etc for instance there is a gigantic cube of coal in siberia which took me days to ride past on my bike. I didn't know what it was until I got home and looked it up.

Central Asia and Siberia are also full of Russians and their missiles... including the nuclear tipped ones.

If china does need to slim the population a bit I'm sure Putin will oblige the minute Chinese tanks cross the border.

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Under the catastrophically awful leadership of Blair and Bush, the US and UK have violated many civil liberties and moved away from freedom towards a kind of neo-tatalitarian state, but it's very early days and to compare them with China where 5 million people are doing hard labour in gulags for political crimes is wide of the mark. China is a nightmare and it is not in any liberal democratic minded person's interest to watch it rise.

My view is that a new Reagan is about to pop up and knock it down anyway. This is, after all, America's last chance to do so.

"neo-tata" - You have no idea how true this spellin mistake actually is! :blink:

The Tiananamen "Gate of Heavenly Peace" Student massacre was in proxy-praise to Mass Murderer Mao who sits embalmed in his mao-soleum there!

Edited by erranta

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Off the economic topic, China's lack of animal cruelty laws, Ive always found barbaric. [Farming of Tigers] No bodies like the RSPCA etc.

Hopefully they are going to begin addressing this properly now. They seem to have been making the right noises for the last couple of years.

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Well we'll see. I am old enough to remember predictions that the Soviet Union would overtake the US. Later it was Japan.

Extrapolating current trends doesn't always work.

In 2000 China had just caught up with India. It is now about 4 times the size of India economically. Can it really keep that up? Maybe it can, but I don't think it is in the bag yet.

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Guest The Relaxation Suite

5 million isn't much from a country of 1.4 billion people. Also where did you get those figures? They don't seem to correspond to anything I've seen in the news about China. China is oppressing it's people MUCH less than Western governments, the facts are obvious- China has much lower taxes, much lower costs of living due to less dacronian land planning laws and much cheaper startup costs for smal businesses.

I've lived in China for over a year and never had any trouble from the police despite being a foreigner, so it's far from the totalitarian state you make it out to be. My only gripe about China is the cultural obsession over wealth and money which is the driving force being a hardworking and rather vain culture, but that doesn't seem to be much different to most countries in the world right now.

1. Laogai, which is an abbreviation for the words Reform through Labour (Arbeit Macht Frei, anyone?), are Chinese gulags and they are al over the country. They have been used for over half a century, imported from Soviet gulags, and most estimates suggest about 50 million people have been through them in that time. Current estimates are that between 3 and 5 million people are currently in the gulags for political crimes. Harry Wu is a famous case who spent 19 years in one for criticising the government when he was a student.

2. China is a totalitarian state which heavily suppresses free speech and free association in a way that most Westerners can't imagine. Nevermind the civil liberties erosions in the West, what goes on in China is serious stuff and the real thing.

3. Western businessmen getting drunk on Vodka martinis in Shanghai bars will not be exposed to this, the real China, because it is imperative that money continues to flow into the country for development, but this does not mean it does not happen. As Huxley said, facts do not cease to exist becayse they are ignored.

4. The West is going to pay for ignoring this, just like every other time it has ignored totalitarian states for financial reasons or general apathy.

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Guest The Relaxation Suite

More like Penfolds Grange.

The other outstanding beacon of progress, probably one of my fondest memories, when they dry clean your shirts they actually put the right cufflinks in the cuffs back on it in the hangar. That too me says it all, these are the facts

Their attention to detail is sharpened by the looming presence of hundreds of laogai everywhere.

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Its the challenge all the industrialized nations face.  We all know how to do things like make cars in mass numbers.. but what we haven't figured out is how to get money into the hands of consumers to buy them.  

The Chinese leaders at least state outright the problem is internal demand.  I've read quotes of Wen Jiabao talking about it.  It will be interesting to see if they can create that demand.  So far western nations are failing at creating that demand and some seem to be giving up.  But the Chinese state has much more power in the day to day economy and does not seem beholden to special interests.

The Chinese are shifting to where the US was in the 1950s. Soon the workers will be bagging 25% pay rises.

Fortunately I can ruin this with my Star Trek replicator.  Soon all Labour and Capital will be rendered worthless, and all that will count is matter.

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Guest The Relaxation Suite

In all seriousness though I did find that the Chinese attitude to female mangers was far more sexually balanced than any of the other Asian countries that I have been to. In fact there were a few businesses in Shanghai and Ningbo and these were big heavy manufacturing facilities where a Sheila had the top job and the power to go with it. Another plus.

There are no pluses when dealing with totalitarianism. Eventually, you pay for it one way or the other.

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Guest The Relaxation Suite

So if I was dealing with this monster from the relative safety of my own free sovereign state, how will they eventually get me?

Economically. If Australia continues to sell every single asset to them they must start thinking of them as their landlords.

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:lol: they said the same things about Japan and Communist Russia,

where are they now?

Fact number 11 is particularly laughable.

Did you know that UK industrial output is now higher than it was in the 1950s, despite the fact that fewer people work in manufacturing?

Its all about productivity not jobs.

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Its all about productivity not jobs.

Productivity is in one sense measured by the jobs it eliminates- so it is odd that people talk about improved productivity as a jobs 'creator'.

If anything the whole point of increased productivity is to get rid of jobs by either using better systems, better technology or both.

Presumably a 100% productive process would involve no labour or energy or raw material costs- it would be pure profit.

So why GDP is feted as some kind of indicator of national prosperity is a bit of a mystery- surely the situation of 'Joe Sixpack' the average citizen would be a more relevant measure. ( Unless 'prosperity'= more money for the already well heeled, which increasingly it seems to do.)

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http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-11/china-s-inflation-tops-5-adding-pressure-for-wen-to-raise-interest-rates.html

China's Inflation Tops 5%, Adding Pressure for Wen to Raise Interest Rates
By Bloomberg News - Dec 11, 2010 3:04 AM GMT
Ding Dong, Meri Lee, Ohn Hi, Beijing
China’s inflation accelerated to the fastest pace in 28 months in November, building the case for Premier Wen Jiabao to raise interest rates again.
Consumer prices rose a more-than-forecast 5.1 percent from a year earlier, a statistics bureau report showed in Beijing today. Producer-price inflation was 6.1 percent, higher than any of 28 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News had estimated.

That old fly in the ointment that ruins all things that seem to be too good to be true. Confucius say too much air in balloon too soon and big bang sure to follow.

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  • 315 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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