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Following Hungary And Ireland, France Is Next To Seize Pension Funds - Zh

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http://www.zerohedge.com/article/following-hungary-and-ireland-france-next-seize-pension-funds

If the recent Hungarian "appropriation" of pension funds, and today's laughable Irish bailout courtesy of domestic pension funds sourcing 20% of the "new" money was not enough to convince the world just how bankrupt the entire European experiment has become, enter France. Financial News explains how France has "seized" €36 billion worth of pension assets: "Asset managers will have the chance to get billions of euros in mandates in the next few months for the €36bn Fonds de Réserve pour les Retraites (FRR), the French reserve pension fund, after the French parliament last week passed a law to use its assets to pay off the debts of France’s welfare system. The assets have been transferred into the state’s social debt sinking fund Cades. The FRR will continue to control the assets, but as a third-party manager on behalf of Cades." FN condemns the action as follows: "The move reflects a willingness by governments to use long-term assets to fill short-term deficits, including Ireland’s announcement last week that it would use the country’s €24bn National Pensions Reserve Fund “to support the exchequer’s funding programme” and Hungary’s bid to claw $15bn of private pension funds back to the state system." In other words, with the ECB still unwilling to go into full fiat printing overdrive mode, insolvent governments, France most certainly included, are resorting to whatever piggybanks they can find. Hopefully this is not a harbinger of what Tim Geithner plans to do with the trillions in various 401(k) funds on this side of the Atlantic.

More from FN on how first France, and soon every other socalized pension regime, will continue to plunder a nation's life saving to fund short-term deficits:

The decision has prompted a radical restructuring of the FRR’s investments. The new strategic investment plan, which will be released in the new year, will see a rapid reduction in its 40% allocation to equities and a shift to cash and short-term government bonds, according to a source close to the situation.

There will be a focus on liability-driven investment, where asset managers are told to minimise risk by matching assets closely to liabilities.

The transfer of the FRR’s assets to Cades is controversial. Force Ouvrière, a trade union confederation, accused the government of “provoking the clinical death” of the FRR.

The decision was taken within the context of this year’s pension reform, which provoked riots with its decision to raise the retirement age. The state old-age pension system, the Cnav, is in deficit, and responsibility for financing the deficit rests with Cades.

The government is requiring the FRR to pay €2.1bn a year to Cades to meet this obligation.

In other words, pension capital will now be used by perfectly rational third party managers to bid up sovereign bonds. Brilliant.

An asset manager said: “Clearly, the move creates new opportunities, because the French asset management market will be reshuffled because of the changes.

But it is also a step back because there are very few French capitalised pension schemes, and the experience around the FRR, the richness of the asset management and the opportunities it created will disappear in a few years.”

And elsewhere, in the UK, things in the pension arena are also starting to heat up as the country is preparing to launch an "auto enrolment" feature for workers, whereby up to 11 million will be eligible for automatic enrolment.

Trades Union Congress general secretary Brendan Barber hailed it as an “historic advance”: a minimum pension to go with the UK’s minimum wage. Pensions Minister Steve Webb confirmed last month that all employers would have to enrol staff into a company scheme. As a result, up to 11 million people will be eligible for automatic enrolment in a workplace scheme, with up to eight million of them saving for the first time. However, there is little evidence that employers are ready for it.

And judging by the Hungarian, Irish and French case studies, all monies auto deposited will soon find a new mandate: one of bidding up sovereing European bonds. More from Financial News:

Staff can opt out to avoid mandatory contributions that will eventually account for half of the minimum of 8% of salary, with employers contributing 3% of salary, and 1% coming from tax relief.

It is impossible to predict how many people might opt out, but Colin Tipping, head of institutional wholesale at asset manager BlackRock, points to an 80% take-up at US companies that have introduced auto-enrolment compared with less than half of that before the mechanism was introduced. The latest annual review of New Zealand’s national KiwiSaver scheme has an opt-out rate of 18%.

The European experience is less encouraging. Italy tried to boost private pensions saving in 2007 with reforms to the Trattamento di Fine Rapporto, a fund traditionally paid to workers on leaving an employer.

However, its policy of “silent consent”, which had the money transferred into a pension unless workers objected, saw only about a quarter participate. Tito Boeri, director of the country’s social policy reform group Fondazione Rodolfo Debenedetti, said: “It was a great opportunity to develop private pension schemes here, but to a large extent it failed.”

Our only question: how soon before the US administration takes this hint of what every proper socialist country does with funds apportioned to it by a gullible public and ends up investing trillions in the worst possible asset classes (while in Europe this obviously means sovereign bonds, in the US by and far the proceeds will be used to make further purchases of such equities as Apple, Amazon and Netflix, in whose continued successful ponziness lies the fate of a vast majority of US-based hedge funds, whose LPs may at some point, in the distant future, actually pay domestic income tax).

Pure genius, there clearly is no point in saving, you might as well cash in your entire pension fund and spunk the money on beer, drugs and whores. You'll be penniless but at least you'll be able to look back with a smile on your face as to how you blew your own money rather than raging with anger at what the corrupt politicians and thieving bankers did, although I suppose the politicians and the banker will be blowing the money on drugs, champagne and high class hookers.

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http://www.zerohedge.com/article/following-hungary-and-ireland-france-next-seize-pension-funds

Pure genius, there clearly is no point in saving, you might as well cash in your entire pension fund and spunk the money on beer, drugs and whores. You'll be penniless but at least you'll be able to look back with a smile on your face as to how you blew your own money rather than raging with anger at what the corrupt politicians and thieving bankers did, although I suppose the politicians and the banker will be blowing the money on drugs, champagne and high class hookers.

Didn't Gordon help himself of some UK pension fund when he first became Chancellor?

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Didn't Gordon help himself of some UK pension fund when he first became Chancellor?

He cut tax relief on dividends, but didn;t actually rob the capital.

How come they are not rioting on the streets over this? Using pension funds for bailouts sounds astounding!

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Rioting?? People can't even be bothered to take their cash out of the bank for one day to make our voices heard!

For most, a pension is a far and distant idea. They won't realise the stupidity of their youth until they join the ranks of the newly retired who can't afford much more than baked beans for dinner!

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He cut tax relief on dividends, but didn;t actually rob the capital.

How come they are not rioting on the streets over this? Using pension funds for bailouts sounds astounding!

I remember/Googled it, it was robed from the "privatised utilities" (actually from the shareholders, of course), in 1997, £4.5 billion from a "windfall tax".

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http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=173478

And how you were going to get screwed?

Feel free to use the search bar and type in "Pension", then have a read.

You're hosed America. Severely. Far worse than you think. And there's nothing you can do about it.

I wish it wasn't true, but it will be, because you refuse to stand up and put a stop to this crap.

France is the latest to seize pension assets. They follow Hungary and Ireland. There will be more. And eventually, it will come here - and when it does, you will get hosed.

There is only one way to stop it.

You, the American people, must demand that all of the bad loans that were made by banks be forced back onto them and defaulted. At the same time the government must stand back and let the adjustment take place.

Yes, this will detonate the banks. Yes, this will result in huge losses. Yes, this will result in a short-term dislocation in the economy - a really, really bad one. Yes, it will result in the collapse of home prices, bankruptcy of tens of millions of people and even more unemployment in the short term.

Again, government must do nothing more than providing emergency shelter and food to those who need it in this regard.

Government must also, at the same time, put an immediate stop to the offshoring monster through wage and environmental-parity tariffs.

If, as is often claimed, the reason for firms to offshore production is because people are willing to work harder or smarter than they are in the US, all fine and well. But if they're doing it because they have effective slave labor or can pollute with impunity, thereby having dramatically lower costs through poisoning the earth, that has to stop because those firms are then creating an economic imbalance that not only cannot be maintained but if not stopped will destroy our nation's economy and funding mechanisms.

We all want certain services from our government. We claim we want social services of various sorts, including social security, medicare, welfare and more. But we have to be able to pay for those services, and we can't when the tax base is destroyed by sending our labor overseas in search of slave-like conditions and the ability to poison the planet instead of keeping it, and the tax base it generates, here in this nation.

We have avoided the truth of this matter through borrowing for two decades. We're now coming up against our national credit card's limit. To avoid that The Fed, with the explicit consent of both Congress and President Obama, is intentionally trying to devalue the currency - that is, create "inflation."

But the money is going overseas, and the inflation he's creating is in China. This is due to the fact that money is global and goes where it can earn the best return. It doesn't care what Bernanke wants or what our government wants - money is agnostic.

We can choose only between an orderly process and a disorderly one. We can choose to force the banks to eat their own cooking along with citizens and take them into receivership or we will suffer a disorderly collapse. That which is happening through Europe will come here. We cannot avoid it. We are only holding our place in line and acceleration is now taking place in these matters.

Remember that we started here with Bear Stearns and were told it was all ok after that. Then we had Fannie and Freddie get into trouble, and we were told they were "stabilized" with Paulson's Bazooka. He lied - both they and Lehman collapsed at once.

The point is that he lied - he knew damn well what was going on and so did The Fed. They all knew that Citi, for example, was writing crap paper for more than two years prior to it all blowing up and that 80% of their loans were bad by 2007.

They tried to hide it and failed.

The same thing is happening in Europe right now. The rolling "fails" will continue and intensify until the truth is recognized and the debt that cannot be paid is defaulted. This path cannot be avoided irrespective of what people want or desire.

Our time to act in a responsible fashion as citizens of this nation is running out. Three years ago I sent a fax to all 535 members of Congress urging them to put aside the cash necessary to feed, house and clothe at a basic level up to 1/4 of Americans - in closed military facilities and similar if necessary - for a year or more. I'm talking about three hots and a cot, not "welfare payments" to sustain people in their iPhones and cable TV.

Of course I was ignored and probably considered a nut, but in point of fact nothing has gotten better, and in fact has gotten worse, since I recognized this threat and warned of it and what must be the response.

If you're currently dependent on pension funds of any sort, make other plans because given our government's idiocy and refusal to stop sucking on the wang of people like Blankfein, Lewis and Strumpf you will not have a backstop from the government either.

God helps those who help themselves, and on the path we're on that's all you're going to have left.

Dennigers little rant about this.

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http://www.zerohedge.com/article/following-hungary-and-ireland-france-next-seize-pension-funds

Pure genius, there clearly is no point in saving, you might as well cash in your entire pension fund and spunk the money on beer, drugs and whores. You'll be penniless but at least you'll be able to look back with a smile on your face as to how you blew your own money rather than raging with anger at what the corrupt politicians and thieving bankers did, although I suppose the politicians and the banker will be blowing the money on drugs, champagne and high class hookers.

Exactly. Don't bother saving a fuking penny. Live off the state and blow the lot. I fuking hate these politicians for their short sightedness.

Why is it the prudent hard working in society who get fuked every time?

If or when the proverbial hits the fan in the UK then -

-Gold/ Silver will be made illegal or taxed massively

- Pensions nationalised into confetti worthless government bonds

- ISA's taxed massively

Pure political tossers. You may as well blow the lot on drugs, champagne and hookers.

Edited by ringledman

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http://www.zerohedge.com/article/following-hungary-and-ireland-france-next-seize-pension-funds

Pure genius, there clearly is no point in saving, you might as well cash in your entire pension fund and spunk the money on beer, drugs and whores. You'll be penniless but at least you'll be able to look back with a smile on your face as to how you blew your own money rather than raging with anger at what the corrupt politicians and thieving bankers did, although I suppose the politicians and the banker will be blowing the money on drugs, champagne and high class hookers.

I dont know how to break this fact to you but HMG have been doiing this since World War 2 with your NIC payments. They go into a National Insurance Fund and a lot of it is ploughed by the Debt Management Office into UK government gilts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Insurance_Fund

The problem with the Irish 'rescue package' is that they have essentially been forced to hand over their National Insurance Fund to the IMF and ESFS as 'hostage' to fund the bail out of the bank senior bond holders' (ie they have essentially lost control of the money). This fact has not yet filtered through.to the man on the street in Ireland but when it does there is going to be trouble.

Edited by realcrookswearsuits

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I dont know how to break this fact to you but HMG have been doiing this since World War 2 with your NIC payments. They go into a National Insurance Fund and a lot of it is ploughed by the Debt Management Office into UK government gilts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Insurance_Fund

The problem with the Irish 'rescue package' is that they have essentially been forced to hand over their National Insurance Fund to the IMF and ESFS as 'hostage' to fund the bail out of the bank senior bond holders' (ie they have essentially lost control of the money). This fact has not yet filtered through.to the man on the street in Ireland but when it does there is going to be trouble.

At least we are ahead of the game on this then, the IMF can't afford to hand over the pension fund because we've already done it.

100% of the cash is going to have to come from the IMF unless we do more Enron accounting.

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All these scare stories about confiscation and taxation are nonsense. The state has got us where it wants us - using fiat currency backed by nothing as money. They can print money at will. Theft of your wealth will be low key and painless. ;)

They might come for your stash of food of course. :o

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  • 238 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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