winkie Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I'd agreed with you on almost anything else, but affordable transport infrastructure is almost as condusive to the national good as something like healthcare. If there is an argument I don't use them as they are too expensive, but would like to and would have no objection to tax money going into them (not into the hands of private companies.) From my own personal experience they don't want you to use them.....they can't cope with the rush hour traffic they have already due to short term profit and lack of long term investment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilchardthecat Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I know, and this is a big problem at the moment, but I am expecting the price to recover to about £1.50/litre in January. It's still be cheaper than the train Also they don't let you spend the night on the train. Public transport is dead money, but you can have a nap in a Porsche. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cakehead Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 A question I have about the train fares going up.. where is the money going. To pay shareholders, i.e. wealthy gamblers, a dividend. When I last travelled regularly by train in the 1980s they were hauled by 1950s diesels. Although a little slower than now the system held up and fares were a fraction of current levels. Of course we were fed the usual bunk about rail needing a subsidy and roads being an investment but public money has been pumped in at undreamt of levels since then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtomsilver Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Superunleaded is only £1.269/litre GBP has strengthened against the dollar recently and kept a lid on the price. My calculation if this hadn't of happened prices would now be sitting around the £1.30-1.32 mark. After this for every $10 rise in the price of oil will add 2p a litre. If petrol isn't £1.40+ in the next twelve months I'll be amazed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilchardthecat Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I'd agreed with you on almost anything else, but affordable transport infrastructure is almost as condusive to the national good as something like healthcare. If there is an argument I don't use them as they are too expensive, but would like to and would have no objection to tax money going into them (not into the hands of private companies.) Not if you have a 25 mile commute where the transport options are either 40 minutes in the car 4 busses, 2 hours Bus to station, train to London, walk to other London station, train back out, bus from station to office, 2-3 hours Why the ****** should i subsidide public transport i can't use even if i wanted to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtomsilver Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Being devils advocate here... my Citroen C1 returns me 53mpg and my old Renault Clio 43mpg so I am getting slightly better economy. An offset of circa 20p a litre. This is not an endorsement for the C1 BTW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Monk Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I find it quite bizarre, we wouldn't give Ryanair millions of pounds every year if not enough people used their service for it to be viable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sikejsudjek Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 It will be interesting to see if the train companies can actually raise fares over the next few years. If you can afford it, there will be plenty of empty seats. Apparently they need the money for new rolling stock, which is ironic as : 1) They haven't bought much new stock with the previous increases (FGW are only using 1980's stock round my neck of the woods. All they've ever done is change the paint work and the interiors.) 2) Most people will be priced out of using the train. 3) They already have plenty of spare rolling stock mothballed, but due to the stupidity of the structure of the original privatisation have no incentive to use it. More evidence of a brain dead country run by toffs for the elite. One big parasitic organism that's about to kill itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatsam Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 The rail system in this country is a joke, it is nationalised in all but name yet retains the same perks of a private company like paying it's directors 500k bonuses each year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 oh my god "Regulated fares, which include season tickets and account for around 40% of all tickets, will rise by a maximum of 5.8%, which is July's RPI inflation rate plus 1%. But unregulated fares, which are supposed to cover leisure travel, could soar by up to 10% on some routes. Although steep, the price rises are likely to be lower than those in a year's time, when the annual price rise formula changes to RPI plus 3% across the network. http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Business/Rail-Tickets-To-Rise-In-Price-By-An-Average-Of-62-From-January-2011/Article/201011415823646?lpos=Business_First_Home_Article_Teaser_Region_3&lid=ARTICLE_15823646_Rail_Tickets_To_Rise_In_Price_By_An_Average_Of_6.2%25_From_January_2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
200p Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Conductor: Hello. Train Fair? You: No! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lepista Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Another good reason to rent - means you can move to where the job is, or easy to move elsewhere to get another job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyoto Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) There must be some kind of Laffer Curve at work in a market such as this. I can't imagine there is a penny more profit to be squeezed from some of these train routes. Edited November 23, 2010 by Kyoto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomethingHasToGive Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 I find it quite bizarre, we wouldn't give Ryanair millions of pounds every year if not enough people used their service for it to be viable. Of course we wouldn't... We'd just make aviation fuel not have to pay the same duty as petrol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Monk Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Of course we wouldn't... We'd just make aviation fuel not have to pay the same duty as petrol. But trains do not pay duty on the fuel they use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 2007 - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7116670.stm - 4.8% 2008 - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/nottinghamshire/7167074.stm - around 5% 2009 - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7925599.stm - >6% 2010 - 6.2% Quite a hefty dose of deflation then... I can not remember a year in the last 20 years when train fares did not go up more than inflation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Meh, petrol rose by 50% between Jan 2009 - Jan 2010, no one said much Its very anger inducing seeing a load of tards complaining about a 6.2% rise in rail fares just because we can no longer afford to pay as much of the cost we used to so they can enjoy living in the home counties and work in London. Subsidies for urban areas with no realistic altenative fine, but we shouldnt be encouraging people to commute miles and miles everyday with high speed rail and other expensive pipe dreams. Obviously this would be a lot easier if they WOULD LET HOUSE PRICES FALL ALLOWING PEOPLE WHO WORK IN LONDON TO LIVE IN LONDON. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 The rail system in this country is a joke, it is nationalised in all but name yet retains the same perks of a private company like paying it's directors 500k bonuses each year. Someones got to foot the bill for that tw@t Bransons irritating train adverts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miko Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) Meh, petrol rose by 50% between Jan 2009 - Jan 2010, no one said much Its very anger inducing seeing a load of tards complaining about a 6.2% rise in rail fares just because we can no longer afford to pay as much of the cost we used to so they can enjoy living in the home counties and work in London. Subsidies for urban areas with no realistic altenative fine, but we shouldnt be encouraging people to commute miles and miles everyday with high speed rail and other expensive pipe dreams. Obviously this would be a lot easier if they WOULD LET HOUSE PRICES FALL ALLOWING PEOPLE WHO WORK IN LONDON TO LIVE IN LONDON. You condtidict yourself , the first paragraph you call the people tards , who enjoy living in the home counties and work in London, then in paragraph two you say let house prices fall so they can live in London. So untill house prices fall in London is it their fault that they have to live in the home counties? I think many of them would enjoy both living and working in the home counties , but the jobs are in London . Due to the traveling times , the cost's and the amount of people I don't think prices of houses in London are going to fall enough to allow all those commuters to live in the capital. Edited November 23, 2010 by miko Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Meh, petrol rose by 50% between Jan 2009 - Jan 2010, no one said much Its very anger inducing seeing a load of tards complaining about a 6.2% rise in rail fares just because we can no longer afford to pay as much of the cost we used to so they can enjoy living in the home counties and work in London. Subsidies for urban areas with no realistic altenative fine, but we shouldnt be encouraging people to commute miles and miles everyday with high speed rail and other expensive pipe dreams. Obviously this would be a lot easier if they WOULD LET HOUSE PRICES FALL ALLOWING PEOPLE WHO WORK IN LONDON TO LIVE IN LONDON. How about moving the jobs to the people, not the people to the jobs....mark my words, it won't be long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtomsilver Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Someones got to foot the bill for that tw@t Bransons irritating train adverts. I used the London-Birminghammaimlime before and after Virgin trains took over. Before, if your train was delayed by more than an hour you got most of the fare back. As soon as Virgin trains took over the delays became so much worse and they started cancelling the trains before the hour was up and putting you on the next train, itself delayed. The beauty of this meant that I was no longer able to reclaim that journey lol. Richard Branson is a [insert expletive] great at marketing, smiling, being your friendly entrepreneur then stealing your money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parkwell Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 My solution - privitise the rail network. For real this time. Maybe the govt can seize it back when it all blows up. Or sell it to India. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spaniard Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Why can't we just keep speculation and profit away from the basic essentials in life? A bit of a roof over ones head, affordable energy, and a decent and affordable transport system to get us around our small island aren't much to ask. Not to mention an adequate, publicly issued, debt-free means of exchange. Why must we pay so heavily for our money supply? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Monk Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 Why can't we just keep speculation and profit away from the basic essentials in life? When I was younger, I read "The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists" by Robert Tressell. Robert Tressell was the nom-de-plume of Robert Noonan, a house painter. Although born in Dublin, Tressel settled in England after living in South Africa at the beginning of the twentieth century. He chose the surname Tressell in reference to the trestle table, an important part of his kit as a painter and decorator (though baptised Croker and usually self-styled Noonan). Based on his own experiences of poverty, exploitation, and his terror that he and his daughter Kathleen — whom he was raising alone — would be consigned to the workhouse if he became ill, Tressell embarked on a detailed and scathing analysis of the relationship between working-class people and their employers. The "philanthropists" of the title are the workers who, in Tressell's view, acquiesce in their own exploitation in the interests of their bosses. The main character, Frank Owen, pointed out to his workmates that if capitalists could find a way of capturing oxygen, storing it in gasometers and then selling it back to the working classes, then they would do it, and the working class would acquiesce to it, even as they gasped for their dying breath.. Probably 95% of HPCers are working-class, whether they care to admit it or not. They need to work to survive. Nothing has changed in the 100 years since this book was published. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xiox Posted November 23, 2010 Share Posted November 23, 2010 There's an interesting recent radio programme about the cost of rail travel: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00vy0f6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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