Should We Feel Sorry For Them

[apom]

So should we feel sorry for them..?

Mr Executive flat.. Mewed to the hilt for his flash BMW and his Rolex..

A car that is looking a few years old that he will be paying for.. for the next 25 years.. a Rolex he bought that no one has noticed unless he has pointed it out..

The gloats and the arrogance and the new rich.. the Yuppie replacements.. BTL landlords and Mewers..

All rich in perception.. all spending into debt..

His £300,000 mortage.. For a flat in a half empty block.. sharing the halls with young drunken tennants with no repsect for the place they do not own..

think of your times..

Think of your resolve fading in the early hours.. as you dreamt of a family.. a home.. fantasies which under Gordon Brown became as unrealistic as a childish fantasy to become an Astronaut.. Think of your proud job.. the money you actually worked for.. made insignificant by those who would MEW more then you earnt a year.. Think of your old car they laughed at.. Remember as they ignored you.. sneering at your "Economic Theory" about speculative markets.. Debt bubbles.. The economic forces of the greater Economy that couldn't support these costs and would fail as soon as people stopped shopping the country out of recession on debt..

You were Right.. no one argues now.. You won't face years of negative equity and crippling repayments..

But you have had your own years of heartache..

So should we feel sorry for them..?

Edited September 13, 2005 by apom

[Elizabeth]

I know a young couple who just paid 250K on a home. Not an investment or a MEW proposition. Just a home. Its not a rich persons home. Its actually quite a small home. They want a family - and a life beyond the Council house. For this they are paying around 5x multiple of their income, and that is the dog-eared end of the market. Those are the sorts of people I feel for.

[apom]

I know a young couple who just paid 250K on a home.  Not an investment or a MEW proposition.  Just a home.  Its not a rich persons home.  Its actually quite a small home.  They want a family - and a life beyond the Council house. For this they are paying around 5x multiple of their income, and that is the dog-eared end of the market.  Those are the sorts of people I feel for.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

and I have friends the same..

and bless them....

[Jason]

I would feel [a bit] sorry for a few, those FTBers who bought at the top who believed the hype.

But for the MEWers: screw them! They didn't bother to save enough nuts for the winter!

And to those who tried to rub salt in the wound - Who cares?

Edited September 13, 2005 by Jason

[Guest The dude]

I know a young couple who just paid 250K on a home.  Not an investment or a MEW proposition.  Just a home.  Its not a rich persons home.  Its actually quite a small home.  They want a family - and a life beyond the Council house. For this they are paying around 5x multiple of their income, and that is the dog-eared end of the market.  Those are the sorts of people I feel for.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"Its not a rich persons home. Its actually quite a small home."

They sound bloody rich enough for me! 250K?...crikey.

[Guest Bart of Darkness]

Mr Executive flat.. Mewed to the hilt for his flash BMW and his Rolex..

A car that is looking a few years old that he will be paying for.. for the next 25 years.. a Rolex he bought that no one has noticed unless he has pointed it out..

The gloats and the arrogance and the new rich.. the Yuppie replacements.. BTL landlords and Mewers..

All rich in perception.. all spending into debt..

His £300,000 mortage.. For a flat in a half empty block.. sharing the halls with young drunken tennants with no repsect for the place they do not own..

think of your times..

Think of your resolve fading in the early hours.. as you dreamt of a family.. a home.. fantasies which under Gordon Brown became as unrealistic as a childish fantasy to become an Astronaut.. Think of your proud job.. the money you actually worked for.. made insignificant by those who would MEW more then you earnt a year.. Think of your old car they laughed at.. Remember as they ignored you.. sneering at your "Economic Theory" about speculative markets.. Debt bubbles.. The economic forces of the greater Economy that couldn't support these costs and would fail as soon as people stopped shopping the country out of recession on debt..

Put like that, I do feel a bit sorry for these people.

Still, it's a tough old world!

[Plastic Elastic]

I do feel a bit sorry for some people.

For instance, a friend's parents. Pensioners. Nice, decent people but probably not very savvy when it comes to money (not many people are). I don't know all the details but I think they were on some kind of equity release plan. I think they were hit when the stock market bubble burst, and all of a sudden they found that their assets were losing value, and their IFA didn't bother to tell them.

About one or two years ago, they stretched themselves quite far (also got financal help from their children) and bought a property somewhere up North, probably thinking it was going to be the best possible investment. Now I can see them possibly going into negative equity in the next few years.

There is no chance they will end up in poverty, but I think they're a good example of how you can lose a lot of money if you're not financially savvy enough to recognise the vested interests of your advisors.

Having said, I have absolutely no time for people who thought they could have their quick consumer fix based on MEW, and are now facing a tough time!

[Guest The dude]

I do feel a bit sorry for some people.

For instance, a friend's parents. Pensioners. Nice, decent people but probably not very savvy when it comes to money (not many people are). I don't know all the details but I think they were on some kind of equity release plan. I think they were hit when the stock market bubble burst, and all of a sudden they found that their assets were losing value, and their IFA didn't bother to tell them.

About one or two years ago, they stretched themselves quite far (also got financal help from their children) and bought a property somewhere up North, probably thinking it was going to be the best possible investment. Now I can see them possibly going into negative equity in the next few years.

There is no chance they will end up in poverty, but I think they're a good example of how you can lose a lot of money if you're not financially savvy enough to recognise the vested interests of your advisors.

Having said, I have absolutely no time for people who thought they could have their quick consumer fix based on MEW, and are now facing a tough time!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"About one or two years ago, they stretched themselves quite far (also got financal help from their children)....

I put a lot of emphasis on the Children here who have encouraged their parents (these unfortunate pensioners). to overstretch themselves. I bet these children had pound signs flashing around in their heads. I have no sympathy for these people.

[theChuz]

Guess what.. i dont feel one bit of sympathy for people like this, and if they end up financially ruiend i dont give a damn either.

If you are going to borrow vast sums of money then you should know the rules of engagement. Ignorance is not an excuse, showing them pitty is like acknowledging there was nothing else they could do other than buy, which is wrong.

I've wanted my own place for years, im nearly 27 and live with my mummy in a council house ffs. I earn above average, i earn more than my all my friends who all have 3 bedroom terraces or semi's because they bought 5 years ago.

They are all married/attached with kids now too.

I think that people should have to sit a basic exam to get a mortgage to make sure the person knows what they are doing. My baby sister still dosnt understand about mortgages and shes been a homeowner for 5 years (btw, her 2 up 2 down cost 52K in 2000, its now valued at 115K).

Its like being at school... " if jack told you to jump off a cliff, would you do it" and the nation has proven .. yes they will do it. Boll0x to them all, they have given me nothing, i owe them nothing.

We all make our way in life and if people will not educate themselves to a level where they can make informed decissons then ... tough.

[dipstick]

I'm usually an empathetic old soul even though I'm not fond of people at all, but this lot has even got to me.

Since I've been house hunting I have been treat by the majority of home owners like a dispossessed saddo! People have been smug, money grabbing, arrogant, and quite happy to see me living in rented squalor, presumably because it makes them feel better about themselves, without having to look at the reality of their actually being in debt upto their eyeballs.

To be honest I don't give a shite whatever happens to Group a in the future. In fact the harder and faster they fall the harder I will laugh.

A case of what goes around comes around, I'm afraid.

But then we have Group b, who stepped into this bluddy quagmire, genuinely believing the bs that GB was relieving himself of by the cartload. Lambs to the slaughter.

I have to feel sorry for this bunch. They have never seen high interest rates or property prices plummet, or mortgages offered at 3.5x wages. Plus they have been pushed by another generation of home owners yelling "Come on in the waters fine".

Can't vote on this one. The groups are too diverse.

At least at the end of the day I will have my own home and it will be paid for and not owing anybody anything. It's more than I can say for either of the above.

[apom]

Why didn't I buy...

Thats been asked of me..

I am 32 and I saw the damage done last time..

A close family friend of my parents lost everything last time to negative equity.. over a decade later he is 50 and has no home.

No chance of a home in this lifetime.

I work with a couple of people who were hurt last time and I have seen them warn the young here.. Of what happened only 15 years ago..

They are not listened to.. their opinions derided..

I saw someone cry reading the paper.. the times article.. Not for himself.. But because of what happened to him last time and what is now going to happen to so many.

A lot of us are going to be angry about this... as someone said above.. he earns more then his friends, but lives with his mum..

A friend of mine has been signed of from work as he can't ever see owning a home and it has crushed him..

He is a solicitor.

Gordon brown has created a world where hard work, grifting every day... Studying to better yourself.. all is pointless.

All he has been interested in is the Nieve.. those he can convince that they should borrow to the hilt.. To keep borrowing..

they are the tools of his economy..

Not the strong or the clever.. not the hardworkers or the socially responsible..

His economy is based on the young, failed by his education shystem who leave school with worthless qualifications and head out to get some credit..

Spend, spend, spend...

[kissmyb]

If you buy sensibly then you will have no problem .If you obviously go for the gucci house and are mortgaged to the hilt then it's stupid unless of course you are on a fixed rate and a secure job etc.Many people make mistakes with Credit and loans not just homeowners.I am glad i own my home i feel sorry for renters who pay someone elses mortgage and can't afford a home of their own - so it works both ways

[busta move]

I guess it comes down to the question: do you feel sorry for stupid people or think they deserve what they get?

I've decided that you can break them into two catagories:

1) Stupid people

2) Stupid greedy people

I feel a sorry for the first group (and almost a bit protective over them in the way that one might feel sorry for a small dog with only three legs).

I feel utter contempt for the second group and, whilst it would be wrong for me to delight in anyone's misery, I find it hard to feel any sympathy either.

But having said all that, my vote went for "look to your own future". Looking at what other people are doing got house prices into this mess in the first place.

[El_Pirata]

I am glad i own my home i feel sorry for renters who pay someone elses mortgage and can't afford a home of their own - so it works both ways

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

oh no here we go again...

[busta move]

If you buy sensibly then you will have no problem .If you obviously go for the gucci house and are mortgaged to the hilt then it's stupid unless of course you are on a fixed rate and a secure job etc.Many people make mistakes with Credit and loans not just homeowners.I am glad i own my home i feel sorry for renters who pay someone elses mortgage and can't afford a home of their own - so it works both ways

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It's almost impossilbe to buy sensibly. I have yet to see a sensible price for a property in my area. When they are sensible, I will buy. If I bought a home now, I would be paying someone else's mortgage; my bank manager's and the estate agent's and possibly the guy whose house I bought (depending on if he was selling to rent).

Being able to afford the price is not the same a buying sensibly. Having said that, if you can afford it and are happy to live there for the next 10 years (because moving will be very hard now that prices are dropping) then buying is not financial suicide. It's just a very poor investment. I'd also feel very peeved when I saw how much nicer a house I could have bought three years later with the same money.

[kissmyb]

It's almost impossilbe to buy sensibly. I have yet to see a sensible price for a property in my area. When they are sensible, I will buy.  If I bought a home now, I would be paying someone else's mortgage; my bank manager's and the estate agent's and possibly the guy whose house I bought (depending on if he was selling to rent).

Being able to afford the price is not the same a buying sensibly. Having said that, if you can afford it and are happy to live there for the next 10 years (because moving will be very hard now that prices are dropping) then buying is not financial suicide. It's just a very poor investment. I'd also feel very peeved when I saw how much nicer a house I could have bought three years later with the same money.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And what would you consider a sensible reasonable price to buy at now.We would all like things to cost less but thats life!

I have just bought and sold .I have made a very good investment and sold well !

[HomeAlone]

I feel sorry for them yes, but I would still hope for a market crash or correction, whatever you want to call it.

[Casual Observer]

I have just bought and sold .I have made a very good investment and sold well !

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not even the building societies claim that a house bought today is a good investment!

[Elizabeth]

"Its not a rich persons home.  Its actually quite a small home."

They sound bloody rich enough for me! 250K?...crikey.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Your mistaking 250K for what you can get for it. Someone here has that quote about "knowing the cost of everything and the value of nothing" at the bottom of their posts - was that Oscar Wilde?

Their house should be worth about 120-140K. And I do feel sorry for them because they are nice people who know nothing about economics or the history of housing past the last 10 years. The idea of a HPC just doesn't make sense to them because they have never seen or experienced it.

But what happens will happen.

Yeah, and its mostly the banks money - that doesn't make them rich.

Edited September 14, 2005 by Elizabeth

[right_freds_dead]

If you buy sensibly then you will have no problem .If you obviously go for the gucci house and are mortgaged to the hilt then it's stupid unless of course you are on a fixed rate and a secure job etc.Many people make mistakes with Credit and loans not just homeowners.I am glad i own my home i feel sorry for renters who pay someone elses mortgage and can't afford a home of their own - so it works both ways

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

there is no sensible in teh housing market anymore. prices have tripled for NO REASON other than pure greed and speculation. they are not worth these asking prices. they are worth 2 thirds less. all we are doing is waiting out the hype and watching the collapse of thiis really dumbass pyramid scheme. and a scheme it is.

if i bought a car for £3k three years ago would you pay me £9k for it ?

-you would if speculators had bought everything else available.

thats all thats happened. cheap lending allowed them to gamble, but i am afraid new buyers held on longer. they are finished.

i have no sympathy, but they will simply be bankrupted. this will be a nation of bankrupt youngsters.

**who we can they pay cheaply for sex.

Edited September 14, 2005 by right_freds_dead

[SE1]

They want a family - and a life beyond the Council house.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

For us it was either a family, or move out of a one-bed Ex-LA flat.

We're still in the flat.

[Homebird]

Can't vote on this one.  The groups are too diverse.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This quote reflects why this poll is impossible to vote in.People who MEW aren't just high-living greed-monsters.I also know several people who have MEWed who are neither:

'1) Stupid people

2)Stupid greedy people'

as Busta Move concludes.

I feel distinctly uncomfortable about living my life by a personal philosophy through which I laugh at others' misfortune.You're never far away from being in that position yourself.As the Trevor McDonald prog the other night pointed out, a couple of the people in deep debt/mortgage-wise were in that position despite the fact that only months earlier they'd been well-off, earning lots etc.Reasons for such predicaments include unexpected illness, death of a close family member/partner (no 'laughing' matter for anyone who has been in this position), redundancy.You can plan for some of these to an extent, but it's not for ever...

Edited September 14, 2005 by Homebird

[Ritters]

In essence it's going to be another one of life's lessons to think for yourself instead of beleiving what you are being told by other people.

Love many, trust few, and always paddle your own canoe

[kissmyb]

Not even the building societies claim that a house bought today is a good investment!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I go on my own judgement.The HPC theory has been spread since 1999! Lifes too short to listen to crash merchants! As long as you buy sensibly in any economic condition you will be fine a crash will never happen !How long are you prepared to put your life on hold for dream!

[Elizabeth]

How long are you prepared to put your life on hold for dream!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My dream has always been to own a house, the real question is how long I am prepared to put my dream on hold for a life!

The answer is, until such time as my dream does not promise to turn into a nightmare.