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Cameron Talks To Smiling Faces And Deaf Ears

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http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/david-cameron-warns-china-over-economic-policies-tele-334e147ab68a.html?x=0

David Cameron warns China over economic policies
Andrew "Andy" Porter, 13:37, Wednesday 10 November 2010
David Cameron has warned of that dangerous tidal wave of money moving from one side of the world to the other could bring globalisation into reverse.
The Prime Minister said China needed to understand what was at stake and he urged its leaders to open its markets.
In a speech in Beijing Mr Cameron explained that for the world economy to be able to grow strongly again in particular the struggling Western economies China had to start spending more and open its markets.
In a reference to the low valuation of the yuan, which has helped China's exports and allowed it to build up massive reserves of foreign currency, he said: The truth is that some countries with current account surpluses have been saving too much while others like mine with deficits have been saving too little.
And the result has been a dangerous tidal wave of money going from one side of the globe to the other. We need a more balanced pattern of global demand and supply, a more balanced pattern of global saving and investment.

The problem lies in the West--for China they are onto a good deal and will milk it for as long as we continue to buy their stuff and sell little to them in return. This state of things is most pleasing to the Chinese, most pleasing indeed. :D

Bottom line: Ferged aboud it Dave (and Barak)--they don't care mate.

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Good Lord - Dave gets it. :ph34r:

Let's see if he's got the cojones to do something other than talk about it.

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Good Lord - Dave gets it. :ph34r:

Let's see if he's got the cojones to do something other than talk about it.

A 2 pronged approach:

1. China to buy more of our shit

2. We buy less of theirs.

Is it going to happen?

Of course not. Maybe in a generation when we are relegated to third world status and we have cheap houses to reflect our new status we can then compete with highly paid Chinese and sell them uniquely British goods. As of now we cannot compete because our standard of living as reflected in the world's highest house prices, means we have to earn far more to produce far less. They earn far less and produce far more. Can't compete with them and Dave's pleas will be just like talking to the hand.

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http://uk.finance.ya...7ab68a.html?x=0

David Cameron warns China over economic policies
Andrew "Andy" Porter, 13:37, Wednesday 10 November 2010
David Cameron has warned of that dangerous tidal wave of money moving from one side of the world to the other could bring globalisation into reverse.
The Prime Minister said China needed to understand what was at stake and he urged its leaders to open its markets.
In a speech in Beijing Mr Cameron explained that for the world economy to be able to grow strongly again in particular the struggling Western economies China had to start spending more and open its markets.
In a reference to the low valuation of the yuan, which has helped China's exports and allowed it to build up massive reserves of foreign currency, he said: The truth is that some countries with current account surpluses have been saving too much while others like mine with deficits have been saving too little.
And the result has been a dangerous tidal wave of money going from one side of the globe to the other. We need a more balanced pattern of global demand and supply, a more balanced pattern of global saving and investment.

The problem lies in the West--for China they are onto a good deal and will milk it for as long as we continue to buy their stuff and sell little to them in return. This state of things is most pleasing to the Chinese, most pleasing indeed. :D

Bottom line: Ferged aboud it Dave (and Barak)--they don't care mate.

Just imagine, and perish the thought, but just imagine anyway, that China's intention was world dominance. It has happened before, like Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan, Queen Victoria, Stalin, Mussolini and you-know-who. You can do it the military way but nuclear weapons spoil the game and it is also a lot of work making tanks and aircraft and guns and bullets. You also loose some people. If things go badly you can't stop and say, "Sorry, let's be friends."

So what to do? You could always destroy the world financial system by making cheap tat and buying sfa. It's cheaper than bullets and if things go badly you can always say, "Sorry, let's be friends." But, on the other hand, if things go well, you can buy your opponent with his own money and your costs were relatively cheap. After WW1 we armed ourselves with big guns which we never used. After WW2 we armed ourselves with fast aircraft which have never been used. An enemy will never use a weapon for which you have a good defense for, or a bigger version of. It is obvious from history that if you-know-who had used economics instead of Tiger Tanks he would almost certainly have won but, rather more importantly, could not lose.

Maybe, just maybe, the Chinese are smarter than us.

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Agreed

the west needs to look to its past and see how appalling its treatment of the third world (soon to be first world) has been. Do you really think the Chinese and Indians have forgotten what its like to have their kids in slave factories making matchsticks and clothes for Imperial This and That Trading company.

Time for quid pro quo. And Americans and Brits need to understand the idea of capturing those markets with its corrupt and obscenely greedy banks is never going to happen. Go China go. Tell Obama and Cameron to go f themselves - we would in their position.

A 2 pronged approach:

1. China to buy more of our shit

2. We buy less of theirs.

Is it going to happen?

Of course not. Maybe in a generation when we are relegated to third world status and we have cheap houses to reflect our new status we can then compete with highly paid Chinese and sell them uniquely British goods. As of now we cannot compete because our standard of living as reflected in the world's highest house prices, means we have to earn far more to produce far less. They earn far less and produce far more. Can't compete with them and Dave's pleas will be just like talking to the hand.

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Just imagine, and perish the thought, but just imagine anyway, that China's intention was world dominance. It has happened before, like Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan, Queen Victoria, Stalin, Mussolini and you-know-who. You can do it the military way but nuclear weapons spoil the game and it is also a lot of work making tanks and aircraft and guns and bullets. You also loose some people. If things go badly you can't stop and say, "Sorry, let's be friends."

So what to do? You could always destroy the world financial system by making cheap tat and buying sfa. It's cheaper than bullets and if things go badly you can always say, "Sorry, let's be friends." But, on the other hand, if things go well, you can buy your opponent with his own money and your costs were relatively cheap. After WW1 we armed ourselves with big guns which we never used. After WW2 we armed ourselves with fast aircraft which have never been used. An enemy will never use a weapon for which you have a good defense for, or a bigger version of. It is obvious from history that if you-know-who had used economics instead of Tiger Tanks he would almost certainly have won but, rather more importantly, could not lose.

Maybe, just maybe, the Chinese are smarter than us.

Ermm... Haven't you missed something else in your argument there? If you ignore the wreck the economy part, it also means that the rest of the world has been paying for China to increase its industrial base and the powerful western nationals have had theirs decline as a result. The basis of a war machine is a combination of people and a decent industrial base, so when the rest of the world economy is toast, they can't invade you because you have more tanks and more people.

I'm not sure you are right though, the Chinese economy has also been mismanaged. I've read reports of a Irish style property bubble there, based on the growing chinese middle class being unable to invest money in anything else. The middle classes want a decent nest egg for their old age because healthcare costs are silly there, so have bought up houses if they can afford them. Many of these properties are unlived in rather than rented out for reasons I didn't fathom.

However as the Chinese government has much more capability to do unpopular things due to its single party stateness, they may just be able to deflate it and move on.

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why would teh Chinese buy our Wollworths rubber dogshit, when wollworths moved our production of rubber dogshit to China in the HOPE that we could A, profit by producing cheaper, and B: sell them to us via our own Chinese production.

Its not the chinese..its the UK production that has moved there.

Cameron is suggesting that we make something they want.....

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why would teh Chinese buy our Wollworths rubber dogshit, when wollworths moved our production of rubber dogshit to China in the HOPE that we could A, profit by producing cheaper, and B: sell them to us via our own Chinese production.

Its not the chinese..its the UK production that has moved there.

Cameron is suggesting that we make something they want.....

How about we make these instead of the Chinese who apparently do not appreciate them and wonder why on earth they are so popular here and in the US and nowhere else:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/TJ-Wiseman-Model-Controlled-Machine/dp/B0006L1ILI

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How about we make these instead of the Chinese who apparently do not appreciate them and wonder why on earth they are so popular here and in the US and nowhere else:

http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/B0006L1ILI

Ewgh!...the refurbished one is three times the price....now THATS a messy job!

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Ermm... Haven't you missed something else in your argument there? If you ignore the wreck the economy part, it also means that the rest of the world has been paying for China to increase its industrial base and the powerful western nationals have had theirs decline as a result. The basis of a war machine is a combination of people and a decent industrial base, so when the rest of the world economy is toast, they can't invade you because you have more tanks and more people.

Yes, I thought that was implicit in my point but yes you are right that invading China would be a poor decision! Their financial strategy is also a means of producing a good defense. Mind you, keep in mind that the nuclear option really eliminates war, as we have known it, anyway.

I'm not sure you are right though, the Chinese economy has also been mismanaged. I've read reports of a Irish style property bubble there, based on the growing chinese middle class being unable to invest money in anything else. The middle classes want a decent nest egg for their old age because healthcare costs are silly there, so have bought up houses if they can afford them. Many of these properties are unlived in rather than rented out for reasons I didn't fathom.

According to my friends in China health costs are very reasonable and much of the city housing is owned by expat Chinese who just want a piece of the action and expect to return to China eventually or pass it on to family members. The family system takes care of much of the expense of retirement. Yes there is a housing bubble but if China becomes the centre of industry their bubble has a chance of staying high while ours bursts.

However as the Chinese government has much more capability to do unpopular things due to its single party stateness, they may just be able to deflate it and move on.

They also have the ability to make decisions that make sense rather than pander to a welfare oriented population. Democracy eventually eats itself when more than 50% of the population realise they can vote themselves a pay-rise. If the Chinese government qualifies as a benevolent dictatorship we are toast. They also have a lot of room to make mistakes. Their system has a potential for success, ours has reached its limit. Democracy is a hundred year old experiment. It didn't work. It is simple evolution. If they get it right we can't compete; and they will keep changing till they get it right. We don't have the will to change. We have to lose.

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http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/finance/jeremywarner/100008581/china-may-be-bigger-economy-than-us-within-two-years/

China may be bigger economy than US within two years
By Jeremy Warner Economics Last updated: November 10th, 2010
According to the Conference Board, a highly respected economic research association, China will overtake the US as the world’s biggest economy by 2012, or within two years.

Our new economic masters. Had to happen when you consider 78.43% of all non-food items we buy are Mecho en Chine.

Edited by Realistbear

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The difference between China and the US is that in China the markets are afraid of the government and in the US the markets own the government.

Does anyone imagine for a moment that a Chinese Government would have allowed its industrial base to be outsourced to the US for a quick buck? Not a chance- they would have stomped on that idea from day one.

But in the good old USA the children were running the economy so they just went right ahead and gave it all away. Now all they have left is a printing press and they're not afraid to use it.

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China may be bigger economy than US within two years

And they will have many revolutions by the masses wanting a slice of it, the ComCap Political Commissars will be driven from the peasant areas re grouting back in Beijing. There will be much blood letting as the revolution spreads throughout the Provinces. This Revolution will outstrip Mao`s one in the 60`s. You can`t hold back over a billion of the population indefinitely, all those highly paid government spies who keep the masses in check will be overwhelmed. ;)

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And they will have many revolutions by the masses wanting a slice of it, the ComCap Political Commissars will be driven from the peasant areas re grouting back in Beijing. There will be much blood letting as the revolution spreads throughout the Provinces. This Revolution will outstrip Mao`s one in the 60`s. You can`t hold back over a billion of the population indefinitely, all those highly paid government spies who keep the masses in check will be overwhelmed. ;)

Juicy, but not a chance. tiananmen revisited maybe but thats as far.

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he looks totally out of his depth. i think myself even have come to the conclusion that china can twit anyone in the world right now. he looked like a nervous catwalk model strutting his sad little heart out before nonchalant chinese fashion buyers.

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Just imagine, and perish the thought, but just imagine anyway, that China's intention was world dominance. It has happened before, like Julius Caesar, Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan, Queen Victoria, Stalin, Mussolini and you-know-who.

I wouldn't put Vicky on that list and including Mussolini is an insult to the others.

Seriously though you've named a bunch of people but no nations. The leadership of China are a bunch of suits trying to maintain a system that benefits themselves very well. They won't be rocking the boat. That's not to say the boat won't get rocked anyway.

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China has a demographic time bomb coming along, much bigger than ours.

The West is China's pension.

Anyone think we are going to pay up when the time comes?

What with? Not a chance.

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he looks totally out of his depth. i think myself even have come to the conclusion that china can twit anyone in the world right now. he looked like a nervous catwalk model strutting his sad little heart out before nonchalant chinese fashion buyers.

He sounds like the bankrupt in court explaining that HE has no money because everyone else stopped trading with him.

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  • 145 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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