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Diane Abbott On This Week

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supports housing benefit for people to live in expensive houses as they're probably all ambulance drivers or something

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Yep heard that. She was talking about ambulance drivers etc in London, how can they afford to live there without housing benefit, we'd all go without their services.

The solution, to me, sounds like lower house prices???

Also - no mention of the 3.6% drop at all??

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I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

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Guest UK Debt Slave

I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

You are seriously ill

Seek medical assistance immediately

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I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

You might want to get on the phone to broadmoor, she's 105% nuts!

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She's completely barking. She's got a very odd voice and most peculiar body posturing/movements.

When I see her on the telly I have to stop and stare as if she's some circus freak ... she's just weird.

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No no no, I am right! You hear me, everyone else is wrong, I am the only one who is right, I'm jesus, yes that's right I'm your prophet so listen up bitches! Borrowing £150bn a year isn't a problem, we can do 0% credit transfer every 9 months!

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The same misguided socialism from Abbott as usual, though I do admire the way she sticks to principles - unusual for a Labour politician in recent memory.

Her point was that

- most people on housing benefit are working;

- if we reduce their HB then they will be forced to live further away from Central London, leading to:

- no ambulance drivers or key workers in Central London.

A few points:

- either key workers in Central London are not paid enough, or

- the cost of living is too high, or

- a mixture of both

and

- She misses out the groups of people on HB who don't work at all in her analysis (though she did concede at the end that "round her way there are too many places where no-one works"

but most of all - and the biggest irony:

- of all the people on HB in the country, only some are key workers. The rest work for those "evil corporations" - like in shops, for instance, on low wages.

- and what she misses is the law of supply and demand. At the moment, everyone including those low paid workers pay taxes which are then actually redistributed to those evil corporations (not, actually, the claimants) in the form of wage breaks, while everyone else picks up the difference to enable the standard of living.

So in supply and demand terms, if shops can't hire staff for 10k a year to work in Oxford Circus any more, then they'll need to pay more until they find the level at which people will (and can afford to) work there.

Of course this presupposes an honest immigration policy with some degree of respect for the same low paid workers the last Labour government, of which she was part, trampled all over in a bid to pander to those very same evil corporations.

plus...

- the reason that the working family won't be able to afford a family home in a hovel like Hackney by themselves without HB is precisely because "evil" capitalist landlords would rather take on HB claimants (paid for in part by the same low paid workers taxes) - the market is actually rigged against the very people she would like to see housed thanks to the false market the HB creates.

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I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

Apart from the first three words, I'd concur :)

Though I would say that having travelled up and down this country, most of our larger cities have outlying areas which make you think "shut the windows, lock the doors, don't hang around at the lights" - certainly Manchester, Liverpool and Bristol qualify to name but a few.

I presume that is the case across the world (a phenomenon unique to big cities), though having said that, even the worst parts of Amsterdam as one example don't look like complete no go areas.

There are still the high rise flats, but they're clean and well maintained and have flowers and bird feeders on the balconies, not chavs throwing beer cans, and their move towards a more right wing government started before ours. It must be something about the British as a people and given the timings (it wasn't always quite like this, so segregated), I then infer it must have something to do with a culture of dependency on the welfare state.

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The same misguided socialism from Abbott as usual, though I do admire the way she sticks to principles - unusual for a Labour politician in recent memory.

She sent her son to a private school.

State schools under Labor not good enough for him.

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She sent her son to a private school.

State schools under Labor not good enough for him.

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that.

Something all West Indian women would do, wasn't it?

In which case, scrub that single supporting comment I made in her favour.

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Her point was that

- most people on housing benefit are working;

- if we reduce their HB then they will be forced to live further away from Central London, leading to:

- no ambulance drivers or key workers in Central London.

A few points:

- either key workers in Central London are not paid enough, or

- the cost of living is too high, or

- a mixture of both

Indeed. A constant problem I see in govt is far too much time and money spent treating the symptoms without ever getting to the root cause. Often going hand in hand with their inability to stick to a set of principles or consistent ideology, as you mentioned.

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the reason that the working family won't be able to afford a family home in a hovel like Hackney by themselves without HB is precisely because "evil" capitalist landlords would rather take on HB claimants (paid for in part by the same low paid workers taxes) - the market is actually rigged against the very people she would like to see housed thanks to the false market the HB creates.

4 Bedrooms | 2 Bathrooms | Bayswater | W2 DSS WELCOME Bayswater Date available: 15 Oct £1,000pw

A Large & Bright 3 Bedroom, 2 Bathroom Apartment, In Paddington DSS Consider Paddington Date available: 15 Nov £750pw

And one of my favourites:

ONLY DSS HOUSING BENEFIT TENANTS REQUIRED - HOUSING IN LONDON harrow, kingsbury, brent, barnet Date available: 7 May £207pw

How can anybody but a bankster afford to compete with those prices using wages? The government is the one pricing ordinary people out of rental in London, not the mean old capitalist landlords.

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Indeed. A constant problem I see in govt is far too much time and money spent treating the symptoms without ever getting to the root cause. Often going hand in hand with their inability to stick to a set of principles or consistent ideology, as you mentioned.

yeah, like a denial that salaries are way too high in the public sector.

As for Ambulance driver s in the city...I expect they could be sent in from the Ambulance station located 20 miles away.

they could park up and wait for the call.

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Most people who work in Central London don't live there. They commute in from the 'burbs or the Home Counties. Is there some special reason ambulance drivers can't do this?

Btw if someone is using HB to pay the rent on a £1,000pw house the £26K cap is going to be a bit of a gotcha! :lol: Bring it on!

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I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

I'd be interested in your definition of 'absolute poverty'.

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No they are not, they are all unemployed bus drivers.

I think it was unemployed bus conductors actually. The fiendish London Underground did away with conductors forcing people into a lifetime of benefits and expensive luxury housing in Holland Park. Obviously retraining as something else would be impossible.

I'm an unemployed sedan chair maker.

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Most people who work in Central London don't live there. They commute in from the 'burbs or the Home Counties. Is there some special reason ambulance drivers can't do this?

The crazy thing is, there is plenty of housing in central London which middle class suburbanites wouldn't touch with a barge pole. Rents for flats in rough parts of Paddington are not high because middle class professionals have driven up rents, they are high because the government has driven up its own rents through excessive Housing Benefit payments. Nobody needs to move, the state just needs to cut HB until it starts to resemble what people can afford to pay out of wages.

The state should not be paying more than £400pcm month for a 1 bed flat as this is the most that somebody on minimum wage could afford. There are a lot of people on minimum wage in London. And yet here are the inner London LHA rates for Haringey, (not an especially nice area!): Link

Inner North and West London BRMA 161 - Valid from 01/10/10 to 31/10/10

Shared Acc.

£108.18 pw

(£468.78) pcm

1 Bed

£250.00

(£1083.33)

2 Beds

£330.00

(£1430.00)

3 Beds

£435.00

(£1885.00)

4 Beds

£580.00

(£2513.33)

5 Beds

£700.00

(£3033.33)

How on earth could ordinary families pay those prices from wages? £1.9k per month out of net income for a 3 bedroom flat?! LHA rates in London should be cut by about 60% just for starters.

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I like Abbott but I do find her views on social justice are heavily influenced by living and working in central london where absolute poverty and living hand to mouth rub shoulders with ultra wealth. The social injustace of central London is dreadful. It doesn't translate well to large parts of the UK though.

She is a Clown and not funny, following in the footsteps of her brother Russ in the 1980`s.

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I forgot to watch it last night & have just caught up on iplayer.

I think it's now my current favourite TV prog. It's absolutely fecking hilarious while making excellent points; even though I disagree with Abbott most of the time & never liked Portillo as a politician, the three of the regulars work fantastically well together.

People like Abbott are a necessary evil. She is fundamentally a decent person whose viewpoint has - as with all of us - been massively influenced by her upbringing & environment. We need her point of view to test our own against, to point out why things look different when you're stuck at the bottom of society. Her conclusions may be wrong, but the problems are still valid.

Portillo has the air of a man who has realised he is never going to make it, has re-evaluated his life & decided quiet reflection on the world makes most sense. He's the perfect foil to Diane.

Neil is turning into some strange Homunculus - a version of Gyles Brandreth with less animation & added sarcasm. the way his head nods & sinks into his chest when he's doing a 'turn' is comical in itself. And he is witty; his Babe Station routine made me laugh out loud.

He brings the best out of his guests as well. Starkey's contribution was interesting (& I'd like to have seen his complete video).

Goes to show the Beeb can still make excellent, non-partisan political programmes when it tries.

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The state should not be paying more than £400pcm month for a 1 bed flat as this is the most that somebody on minimum wage could afford. There are a lot of people on minimum wage in London. And yet here are the inner London LHA rates for Haringey, (not an especially nice area!): Link

Somebody on minimum wage could not afford £400 pcm rent for a one bed flat. On top of that they would have to pay council tax, electricity, water, travel to work, food , and if they want the luxury of a tv a lience to watch it. That is without any clothing , trips to the dentist , anything in the flat that might need fixing or replacing. NMW does not cover these cost's after paying £400 out on rent.

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Somebody on minimum wage could not afford £400 pcm rent for a one bed flat. On top of that they would have to pay council tax, electricity, water, travel to work, food , and if they want the luxury of a tv a lience to watch it. That is without any clothing , trips to the dentist , anything in the flat that might need fixing or replacing. NMW does not cover these cost's after paying £400 out on rent.

I largely agree. I think it would be just possible, but you'd be talking bare bones survival. Which is why it is so crazy that the government has set the price floor on 1 bed flat rents at £1083pcm by putting in DSS tenants for that amount. That is more than somebody on minimum wage is likely to make in a whole month, gross. How can shop workers compete with a government with tax raising powers and a printing press? They can't, so many people take the only realistic option and throw themselves on the mercy of the state.

It's like an abusive relationship where one person undermines the other to the point where they don't have the confidence or means to leave and are forced to stay. Eventually the abused can't imagine any other life and sees their abuser as their protector. This is the relationship between the government and the poor in the UK. This is the system that the "progressive" Diane Abbott supports.

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I largely agree. I think it would be just possible, but you'd be talking bare bones survival. Which is why it is so crazy that the government has set the price floor on 1 bed flat rents at £1083pcm by putting in DSS tenants for that amount. That is more than somebody on minimum wage is likely to make in a whole month, gross. How can shop workers compete with a government with tax raising powers and a printing press? They can't, so many people take the only realistic option and throw themselves on the mercy of the state.

It's like an abusive relationship where one person undermines the other to the point where they don't have the confidence or means to leave and are forced to stay. Eventually the abused can't imagine any other life and sees their abuser as their protector. This is the relationship between the government and the poor in the UK. This is the system that the "progressive" Diane Abbott supports.

YES

It is going to take something really radical to change this abusive relationship . We have been in it now for decades and the abuse gets worse all the time .

They need to build enough affordable housing and somehow I can not see that happening . In London now the £250 p.w. for a one bed room flat is not enough rents are going up and up that £250 is going to be £300 very soon. To live in that you would need take home pay £2500 p.m. and that with other bills and living cost's would leave little for a decent life style.

I really do not know how this is all going to play out over the next few years.

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Interesting take on the 44k and above child allowance cut, Portillo said it was announced now because the coming spending review must be horrendous and they wanted to show that the well off are taking pain also.

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  • 150 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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