Fake Offers

[Ski]

Just at the worst possible time, I know, i've finally decided to take a punt on the market. Family situation forces it and it's clearly affordable.

Anyway, i've made an offer (83% of asking) and was responded to by the EA with the "they're already rejected two offers at £X", line where X is somewhat north of my offer.

Are they shitting me ?

[olliegog]

yes - I have encountered the same thing even when offering within 10% of overinflated asking price. They will also persuade you that the other 'offers' are all cash rich proceedable buyers - as if.

[Ski]

yes - I have encountered the same thing even when offering within 10% of overinflated asking price. They will also persuade you that the other 'offers' are all cash rich proceedable buyers - as if.

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

[Alfie Moon]

The chances that they are telling lies is about 99.99%. Amazing how other offers past or present always appear and are always higher than your offer.

My property buying has always employed a tactic that my brother and friends of his developed first in the 1990s house price crash. Basically it involves identifying 5 properties that you really like and then put in offers of 20%-30% below the asking price on all of them at the same time. Don't worry about the rubbish EA's will come with such as 'you barsteward', 'we can't take you seriously as a buyer', 'we have much higher offers than that already rejected by the vendor', etc., etc. Just keep persisting until you get a bite and you will end up with a great property at a great price. This approach works particularly well in a falling market but also works in a normal, stable market as well. In a booming market .... well, just stay out of it. EA's are currently desperate for any buyer they can get their hands on - take full advantage of this, it will save you huge amounts of money.

[Johnny Storm]

Id write a letter to the owner, making your offer and quoting what the EA said. And put something like "although I am unable to increase my offer, please bear me in mind if your existing offers fall through."

Other than that, cant see what else you can do.

Edited September 29, 2010 by Johnny Storm

[JustYield]

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

You could send the vendor a letter politely asking him if he's received your offer.

Next week: how to tie your shoelaces.

[hpc-craig]

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

You can't really and they know it.

I expect they are hoping you are a naïve buyer and will blindly raise your offer above the other 'buyers'.

In the bom times I expect this would've worked on 9/10 buyers which is why many houses went for more than the asking price. Other bidders were totally made up. Even Krusty and Phil are had like this on many epsiodes of LLL. Watch some of the older ones, there is a 'rival bider' almost every week.

[OnlyMe]

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

Be willing to walk about and call their bluff.

[Pent Up]

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

I've had a smiler experience of EAs creating fictitious offers. In my case the EA said "we understand from the vendor that an offer of X has been received through one of the other agents" it was marketed by three. I phoned both other agents to 'enquire' and no offers had been received.

If you're sure that these other offers are false then email them so they email you back so you get it in writing or ask them to put it into writing for you. Then contact the vendor directly and ask them if the are offers false you can report them for to an ombudsmen, can't remeber the details think it's the property ombudsmen?

[FreeFall]

Thanks. Now how do you prove it ?

Why would you want to prove it? You offer up to the amount that the property is worth to you and if you don't get a bite you keep looking. Pretty simple process really - who cares if they're real offers or not - the simple fact is that you're not going to get to buy the place at the price you think it's worth and there's not a whole lot you can do about it.

[Bloo Loo]

yes - I have encountered the same thing even when offering within 10% of overinflated asking price. They will also persuade you that the other 'offers' are all cash rich proceedable buyers - as if.

take comfort..

completions c 49,000.

approvals c 49,500.

there are NO cash buyers.

[OnlyMe]

Why would you want to prove it? You offer up to the amount that the property is worth to you and if you don't get a bite you keep looking. Pretty simple process really - who cares if they're real offers or not - the simple fact is that you're not going to get to buy the place at the price you think it's worth and there's not a whole lot you can do about it.

Yep, you put the offer in and walk away, you let the seller and the agent wonder if they have done the right thing by whatever actions they take. Doesn;t actual mean that you won't get the place at the price you offered, just detach yourself from the decision.

[Guest_James Toney_*]

Just at the worst possible time, I know, i've finally decided to take a punt on the market. Family situation forces it and it's clearly affordable.

Anyway, i've made an offer (83% of asking) and was responded to by the EA with the "they're already rejected two offers at £X", line where X is somewhat north of my offer.

Are they shitting me ?

personally i would keep putting in offers on as many as you can for at least 80% of the asking price. even 75% if there was somewhere you did not like too much,

over the next few months, there will be reductions, and your 80% will start to look good for the EA. seriously i know someone that out an offer in of 25% lower, the EA said there were many more offers some almost the asking price, the EA contacted him about 6 weeks later asking if he wanted to put in a higher offer, why would they do this if they had so many near the asking price, he said he would pay another 5%, although it is not a done deal, but the EA thinks he will get it for that.

keep the low offers in, you will be kicking yourself in 6 months if you dont.

good luck

Edited September 29, 2010 by James Toney

[pablopatito]

Why would you want to prove it? You offer up to the amount that the property is worth to you and if you don't get a bite you keep looking.

Exactly. There's a lot of threads on HPC about how to play games with EAs. Why? EAs are more experienced at playing games than any buyer, so the best way to deal with them is to refuse to play. That way they'll never beat you!

[Bloo Loo]

yep, a quick scan on mouseprice and current asking reveals actual sales are 20% or so lower than asking.

In spite of all the sales hype...people are asking much more than the acheived prices.

This relates to Colchester sub £160k. I looked it up as a friend of ours had her house "valued"...so I did a bit of checking as her "valuation" was 30k MORE than they bought 18 months ago.

[Mrs Bear]

Just at the worst possible time, I know, i've finally decided to take a punt on the market. Family situation forces it and it's clearly affordable.

Anyway, i've made an offer (83% of asking) and was responded to by the EA with the "they're already rejected two offers at £X", line where X is somewhat north of my offer.

Are they shitting me ?

Possibly not. There are still plenty of vendors out there with blinkers on. In this market the average EA with a grain of sense (OK, I know) is not likely to rubbish any reasonable offer without good reason - it's in their interests to make any sale they can.

A rising market's a different matter.

We put in a lowish offer a couple of months ago - the EA not only didn't rubbish it, he told us (without our asking) that there had been only one other offer - for a mite less than ours.

Should he be put in the Guinness Book Of records?

(fallen through now because of absentee freeholder causing all sorts of complications)

[Guest_James Toney_*]

Possibly not. There are still plenty of vendors out there with blinkers on. In this market the average EA with a grain of sense (OK, I know) is not likely to rubbish any reasonable offer without good reason - it's in their interests to make any sale they can.

A rising market's a different matter.

We put in a lowish offer a couple of months ago - the EA not only didn't rubbish it, he told us (without our asking) that there had been only one other offer - for a mite less than ours.

Should he be put in the Guinness Book Of records?

(fallen through now because of absentee freeholder causing all sorts of complications)

great example, keep it up

[ccc]

personally i would keep putting in offers on as many as you can for at least 80% of the asking price. even 75% if there was somewhere you did not like too much,

over the next few months, there will be reductions, and your 80% will start to look good for the EA. seriously i know someone that out an offer in of 25% lower, the EA said there were many more offers some almost the asking price, the EA contacted him about 6 weeks later asking if he wanted to put in a higher offer, why would they do this if they had so many near the asking price, he said he would pay another 5%, although it is not a done deal, but the EA thinks he will get it for that.

keep the low offers in, you will be kicking yourself in 6 months if you dont.

good luck

Why did he offer another 5%

The EA (Vendor) came to HIM, not the other way around. I would have offered 5% less and told them to stop ******ing around or I was off. Why not ? In this market every buyer is in charge. You can do what you want. You may not get the house you want but there are plenty others out there.

[OnlyMe]

Why did he offer another 5%

The EA (Vendor) came to HIM, not the other way around. I would have offered 5% less and told them to stop ******ing around or I was off. Why not ? In this market every buyer is in charge. You can do what you want. You may not get the house you want but there are plenty others out there.

There are going to be a lot more (and better ones). Rememeber the last few years it was BTL and FTB buying shit that asked the real top of the bubble, you don;t want these houses, you don;t want to even live in most of these areas. Most fo the best housing is in the hands of the elderly, a lot needs modernisation but thats where you can buy something worthwhile that is not in a crap area. The elderrly are going to get absolutely stiffed by inflation - think about it 1, 2% interst on savings and basics going up 20%, they will fold in large numbers and be forced to sell. The BOE haven;t thought through their economic dirty process, they could collpase their precious housing market with just QE1 alone as the elderlyhave been holding out for more interest, when they realise that is not coming they know they are ******ed and are going to have to do something about it.

Edited September 29, 2010 by OnlyMe

[Stop The Ride]

Just at the worst possible time, I know, i've finally decided to take a punt on the market. Family situation forces it and it's clearly affordable.

Anyway, i've made an offer (83% of asking) and was responded to by the EA with the "they're already rejected two offers at £X", line where X is somewhat north of my offer.

Are they shitting me ?

It's just a game - play your side. If I've had an offer rejected and am asked to raise it, I always sound non-committal and say that I have some other properties to pursue as they currently appear better value. The trick is IMHO to appear interested in value rather than any particular property.

[Har Fast]

Most fo the best housing is in the hands of the elderly, a lot needs modernisation but thats where you can buy something worthwhile that is not in a crap area. The elderrly are going to get absolutely stiffed by inflation - think about it 1, 2% interst on savings and basics going up 20%, they will fold in large numbers and be forced to sell. The BOE haven;t thought through their economic dirty process, they could collpase their precious housing market with just QE1 alone as the elderlyhave been holding out for more interest, when they realise that is not coming they know they are ******ed and are going to have to do something about it.

Quite. An unforeseen side of Mr. Bean's "savers should spend their capital" quip - for the elderly with few other assets this may well mean selling up and downsizing earlier than they'd anticipated (especially if they were holding out in the hope that the housing market would "recover").

[Speak&Spell]

I thought our EA was feeding us a load of bull about fake offers. Turns out he wasn't. The odd nice locations are still selling at peak 2007 prices.

At the end of the day you can offer -20% off asking prices, but the chances are in desirable areas people won't sell. In 2007 when the last crash happened I kepy my eye on certain areas. The nice houses didn't even come on the market. The sellers decided to ride out the storm. The crap houses came on the market and yes you could get those at a -20% reduction. It's not all plain sailing, that you'll find the exact house you want with a massive reduction. Nice houses that tick people's boxes are sought after. If you want to compromise on this then you might get the bargain you're looking for.

[Damik]

The chances that they are telling lies is about 99.99%. Amazing how other offers past or present always appear and are always higher than your offer.

My property buying has always employed a tactic that my brother and friends of his developed first in the 1990s house price crash. Basically it involves identifying 5 properties that you really like and then put in offers of 20%-30% below the asking price on all of them at the same time. Don't worry about the rubbish EA's will come with such as 'you barsteward', 'we can't take you seriously as a buyer', 'we have much higher offers than that already rejected by the vendor', etc., etc. Just keep persisting until you get a bite and you will end up with a great property at a great price. This approach works particularly well in a falling market but also works in a normal, stable market as well. In a booming market .... well, just stay out of it. EA's are currently desperate for any buyer they can get their hands on - take full advantage of this, it will save you huge amounts of money.

I would also CC all 5 agents about these 5 properties you are interested in ... I think it is called the Dutch auction ...

[OnlyMe]

Quite. An unforeseen side of Mr. Bean's "savers should spend their capital" quip - for the elderly with few other assets this may well mean selling up and downsizing earlier than they'd anticipated (especially if they were holding out in the hope that the housing market would "recover").

They arfe outof touch pigs at thr trough, they have no conception of what an inflation rate in basics or approx 5-10x the received interst rate means to those on a fixed (low) income - it will slaughter them.

Also retirees - their pension pot is not going to be worth a fraction of what they thought it would be when they convert it to an annuity.

Like I've said before it is like an economic dirty protest and the results will be very messy and widespread.

[Damik]

I thought our EA was feeding us a load of bull about fake offers. Turns out he wasn't. The odd nice locations are still selling at peak 2007 prices.

At the end of the day you can offer -20% off asking prices, but the chances are in desirable areas people won't sell. In 2007 when the last crash happened I kepy my eye on certain areas. The nice houses didn't even come on the market. The sellers decided to ride out the storm. The crap houses came on the market and yes you could get those at a -20% reduction. It's not all plain sailing, that you'll find the exact house you want with a massive reduction. Nice houses that tick people's boxes are sought after. If you want to compromise on this then you might get the bargain you're looking for.

surely bank valuators will have different view ....