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dogbox

The Dawn Of Mass Investing.

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Im a keen investor and when not 'working' my business I spend much of my time seeking new opportunities.

It struck me that almost overnight the world is full of new investors from parts of the world not known for thier investing culture.

Im thinking of Indians, Philippinos, Brazilians, South Africans, Russians and so on.

These are ordinary citizens not the old rich / gangsters that dominated makets traditionaly.

All this new wealth seeks a home. In the past a small minority from mainly western nations 'invested'. Now it appears everyones at it.

Now, when looking for land abroad I find Im rubbing shoulders with far more many nationalities than was the case even 5 years ago.

I recieve many real estate publications such as Escape From America. This is new territory. People from all over the wolrd are buying up land from Honduras to Patagonia, Chile to Slovenia.

The question is:

What impact is this unstoppable investment train going to have on SMs and real estate in the next 5 - 10 years (UK and US real estate has matured, although the UK SM will be up 50% by the end of 1996)?

How many of you will let these opportunities bypass you just as u did in 1997 when you thought the UK market had peaked?

Edited by dogbox

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You gotta have plenty of spare money to invest in all that sh*t. We're not all Rockefellers like you pal. We just want to buy an affordable home not a patch of waste ground in bloody Patagonia.

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Not to mention that I'd feel bad about pricing some poor Patagonian out of the Patagonian housing market.

Personally I prefer to invest in companies that actually produce things that people want, rather than screw up other people's lives to make a buck, and force them to live in a ditch or enslave themselves to a bank for decades. And yes, I have a fair amount of money in Asian shares, though I suspect they'll go down at least as hard as the rest of the world when the supply of free money from America comes to an end.

Edited by MarkG

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Inward Patagonian investment will enrich Patagonians.

It will enrich the Patagonians who own land. The rest will be living in ditches.

Of course if you were investing in productive Patagonian companies rather than parasitic property speculation, it would be a different story.

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Not to mention that I'd feel bad about pricing some poor Patagonian out of the Patagonian housing market.

Personally I prefer to invest in companies that actually produce things that people want, rather than screw up other people's lives to make a buck, and force them to live in a ditch or enslave themselves to a bank for decades. And yes, I have a fair amount of money in Asian shares, though I suspect they'll go down at least as hard as the rest of the world when the supply of free money from America comes to an end.

Ethical investments only? I presume that you only invest in companies that make things that people need rather than things people want, as consumption is bad for the environment so should be kept to a minimum.

Why not buy a BTL... assuming you find a tenant then you are clearly providing a product/ service (rented accomodation) that someone wants? Better than living their and doing your bit to keep rental prices high for people who can't afford to buy.

Sorry, when you can prove to me you are whiter than white (ie invest purely in small, ethical companies that produce things like food and basic clothing, distributed locally to minimise the environmental impact of transport) then start lecturing others.

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You gotta have plenty of spare money to invest in all that sh*t. We're not all Rockefellers like you pal. We just want to buy an affordable home not a patch of waste ground in bloody Patagonia.

The point of my thread was to provoke discussion about this new mass investing culture and whether some of us might benefit from international SM and property booms.

Im not Rockerfeller, just someone trying to make the most of his money rather than sittin' marking time.

The point is you make money by taking some time to look beyond the corners of your life. If u do what youve always done, youll get what youve always got.

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Ethical investments only?

No, investments in production only. It's highly unlikely that anyone will have to live in a ditch because of my investments, but there will sure be people who can make a living as a result... people will have to live in ditches if they're priced out of their housing market by foreign money forcing up the price of their land and houses.

How can a Patagonian possibly compete in buying land or houses against swathes of foreigners who make more money in a week than they do in a year and can borrow vast sums of money at interest rates of a few percent?

As I said yesterday, the flow of cheap money from America, the UK and Europe is bouncing around the world like a vast hurricane that trashes economies and then moves on in search of any country that it hasn't already destroyed. I can only hope that many of these 'investors' will be ruined when America is finally forced to push up interest rates to sensible levels.

Edited by MarkG

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Not to mention that I'd feel bad about pricing some poor Patagonian out of the Patagonian housing market.

.............

Many small poor states have used inward real estate investment as the key driver in transforming thier economy from a basket case.

The wealth injected imrpoves poor peoples lives far more than any pathetic DVD or football boots ever will.

Just doing my bit.

Oh, and BTW, Argentina (Patagonia) is gratefull of this investment given thier recent depression. Thanks to investors.

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The point of my thread was to provoke discussion about this new mass investing culture and whether some of us might benefit from international SM

I suppose it depends whether you are on the bottom or the top? :rolleyes:

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No, investments in production only. It's highly unlikely that anyone will have to live in a ditch because of my investments, but there will sure be people who can make a living as a result... people will have to live in ditches if they're priced out of their housing market by foreign money

Mark, take Cape Verde;

Since liberalising thier market and introducing property rights in the late 1990s the GDP has increased 6% pa and rising. They were totally reliant upon aid until this time.

Now roads and hospitals are being built not to mention an international airport, all due to real estate investors.

Now lets take your argument; Firstly what manufacturing company would locate to such islands? There isnt one. But now with the dawn of the real estate boom we ahev a spark and global recognition. Now perhaps companies that make things will consider the cvs.

Lastly I consider most manufacturing output to be far from meaningful. Most of it is junk, needles and polluting, afterall all these plastic bits of shite have to come from mother earth.

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It will enrich the Patagonians who own land. The rest will be living in ditches.

Of course if you were investing in productive Patagonian companies rather than parasitic property speculation, it would be a different story.

Very good point, and something which a lot of people don't grasp.

Investment in property does not contribute to the productive capacity of a nation.

It may result in additional house building, but houses are to all intents and purposes consumption goods. Money going into housing is not investment in a strict economic sense.

This is in contrast to investment in factories or education for example, which results in an accumulation of productive capital.

When you invest in houses in Patagonia, you are essentially providing consumer goods to resident Patagonians. But since you haven't done anything to increase the productive capacity of Patagonia, the long-term demand and ability to pay for houses there won't increase, unless you personally want to go live there.

If you think the economy is going to grow for other reasons (eg it is the next China) then fine - your investment will likely yield you high returns over the long term, since residents there will have higher income.

If your plan relies on increased Patagonian house prices due to the rest of the world also investing in Patagonian houses, sooner or later the speculative scheme will come tumbling down when it becomes clear that actual demand for housing there remains unchanged.

This is also the reason why the current USA borrowing binge to fund housing purchases and construction is a BAD idea - it's more like going out and buying lots of shoes on the credit card than borrowing for your college education, and when the loans get called in, you haven't enhanced your ability to pay them back.

Krugman recently said that Americans make a living by selling each other houses,

paid for with money borrowed from China. Dogbox, a house price boom can't make your country rich, it just seems to in the short run.

Edited by Biriani

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It struck me that almost overnight the world is full of new investors from parts of the world not known for thier investing culture.

Now, when looking for land abroad I find Im rubbing shoulders with far more many nationalities than was the case even 5 years ago.

I recieve many real estate publications such as Escape From America. This is new territory. People from all over the wolrd are buying up land from Honduras to Patagonia, Chile to Slovenia.

Interesting doggy, but are you convinced this isn't just another part of the global property bubble?

If you look at asset booms throughout history you will find that money moves to ever more speculative parts of the same asset class, seeking "value" in exchange for "quality", as "quality" fails to produce adequate returns.

Hence ftse100 shares peaked 9 months before 250s. Hence house prices in the North continued to rise after London peaked.

Are you certain people aren't just buying what "looks" cheap by current bubble standards, and that the only place they can do this is in "Patagonia"?

ftse_vs_250.JPG

post-141-1126121084_thumb.jpg

Edited by Sledgehead

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  • 335 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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