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Tired of Waiting

A Young Couple's Letter To Out Local Paper

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Reading my local paper's website today I found this reader's letter, from a young couple complaining about housing here in the south. The letter is a bit old (1 year), but I'm sure the problem has not changed:

Readers' Letters

September 24 2009

Penalised for deciding not to have kids

"I am keen to discover if there are other young people, like my husband and I, who are constantly penalised by not only the local council but also on a national level because of our decision NOT to have had a baby at the age of 21.

My husband and I first came across this issue with the local council almost two years ago.

We needed housing as we were being turned out of our rented accommodation and returning to our parents wasn't an option because of space.

The local council apparently could not help to house us, nor could they help us with our rent on a private property as... we did not have a baby.

They were helpful, though, and calculated for us how much child benefit we could claim per week if we had one.

I have just completed training as a primary school teacher and work part-time. My husband, who works long hours and supports us both, tried to claim tax credits and found online we would be eligible for a considerable sum.

However, on phoning the helpline we found that tax credits are only paid to those over the age of 24 – unless, of course, you have a baby, in which case we could claim tax credits and child benefit.

It isn't that I don't think people should have children at a young age or without being married first. I just want to know why there is no support for those who don't have children.

Why is it that on a local and national level young couples are being penalised for choosing to not have children young?

Are there other couples, who despite doing everything seemingly the right way around are finding themselves, like us, considering that maybe we should have just had that baby at 19 as originally suggested to us?"

(name and village - near Midhurst, West Sussex)

Edited by Tired of Waiting

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And if they save £40,000 for a deposit on a house rather than spend it on having a 'good time' and they lose their jobs they will have to use the deposit to live off. Better to have a few kids and live of benefits (assuming you can also live without any self respect) rather than work and save.

Help and benefits for the jobless and the feckless, Nothing for the workers and the prudent. Free money for the debtors but nothing for the savers.

Yep. Completely "perverse incentives". Just madness! http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=&q=%22perverse+incentive%22&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B3GGGL_enGB237GB238&ie=UTF-8#sclient=psy&num=10&hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1B3GGGL_enGB237GB238&q=+perverse+incentive&aq=f&aqi=g4g-o1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=e8159fff82331532

.

Edited by Tired of Waiting

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WTC should be extended to the under25s and needs be the only in-work benefit to incentivise low-paid work. Means tested CTC should be available to all with children, or the non means tested CB increased.

Or ban them altogether?

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WTC should be extended to the under25s and needs be the only in-work benefit to incentivise low-paid work. Means tested CTC should be available to all with children, or the non means tested CB increased.

Please translate: WTC, CTC, and CB.

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Isn't the whole benefits system changing next year? Sounds to me as if couples without kids will not be at quite as big a disadvantage. We have to wait until Oct.20th to get a clearer picture. My guess is that it will drive down rents for one thing.

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Working Tax Credits

Child Tax Credits

Child Benefit.

I'm guessing.

I'm never sure that it is a good idea to incentivise (sic) low paid work. It strikes me as an odd way to go about things really. The whole taxation system needs a major simplification and overhaul.

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OOOOO close but no cigar :D

Council tax credit has yet to be introduced. CTB covers the council tax of the unemployed poor. However, many low paid people (working poor) do need to claim this. I await the day where we introduce Tax on a tax-benefit, or tax-credit.

We seem to have some universal benefits, taxes, means tested benefits, tax credits and tax benefits all overlapping. Soon the unemployed will have no time for work, for they will forever be filling out forms. A housing benefit cut will mean they need to reapply for all their other benefits, before claiming for discretionary housing benefits to top up the amount they have lost. The wealth grab will have been pushed pretty much to the max, if not over what is healthy, and the economy will finally be recovering.. We can all get jobs calculating the benefits and taxes of others and all will be well in the world. :S

Edited by Unemployed Youth

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WTC should be extended to the under25s and needs be the only in-work benefit to incentivise low-paid work. Means tested CTC should be available to all with children, or the non means tested CB increased.

All of these tax credits should be abolished and the basic rate of tax reduced. why pay people to take the tax off you and then return it to the people they decide deserve it?

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All of these tax credits should be abolished and the basic rate of tax reduced. why pay people to take the tax off you and then return it to the people they decide deserve it?

Ideally, but as you work, you lose all unemployment benefit, you then begin to lose housing and council tax benefit. you effectively lose 90p in every pound. Working tax credit is there to lower that to something like 70p. I'm all for benefits for all to Xk, 50p in the £ reduction of (cumulative) benefits for each £1 earned. Then a tax free allowance and then a 50% tax rate thereafter. Far far simpler, and it always encourages work.

Edited by Unemployed Youth

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Here are three policies for the Dictatorship of the Clockslingariat:-

1. Married couples with no kids get a higher rate of state pension to make up for the contributions made to educating other peoples kids and their healthcare, plus incentive not to further overcrowd this tiny island.

2. Examination (designed to be ideologically neutral) to be passed before you can vote. Can't be bothered to study for it? Great, you obviously don't deserve to participate.

3.On the plane? On the scales avec votre valise madame, si vous plait! A touch on the obese side Sir? No problem. we can accommodate you for a large premium or less luggage to bring you down to the "with luggage average". Totally fair. Why should I pay the fuel to ferry your lard? It's "green" and right there with a bloody big "nudge" to make you improve your health. No doubt the Etonian scum or Dick Clegg will steal the idea next week.

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Here are three policies for the Dictatorship of the Clockslingariat:-

1. Married couples with no kids get a higher rate of state pension to make up for the contributions made to educating other peoples kids and their healthcare, plus incentive not to further overcrowd this tiny island.

2. Examination (designed to be ideologically neutral) to be passed before you can vote. Can't be bothered to study for it? Great, you obviously don't deserve to participate.

3.On the plane? On the scales avec votre valise madame, si vous plait! A touch on the obese side Sir? No problem. we can accommodate you for a large premium or less luggage to bring you down to the "with luggage average". Totally fair. Why should I pay the fuel to ferry your lard? It's "green" and right there with a bloody big "nudge" to make you improve your health. No doubt the Etonian scum or Dick Clegg will steal the idea next week.

Pensions are paid by the subsequent generation, the people without children should get nothing.

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Sure, just ring 0800 055 66 88. Have an eye test, dental check up and call at the doctors.

So what difference is this to extortion i.e. having a gun held to my head if I do not comply? In that in this case as an evil statist(TM Injin) you do not even have the thin veneer of you get stuff in return for your taxes to hide behind.

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Pensions are paid by the subsequent generation, the people without children should get nothing.

And, lo, the hospitals to deliver them and the schools to educate them and the paramedics and officers of the law to care for them after their drinking deeply of Alcopop in Clubs of the Night were created on the eighth day

And this was done even without the taxation of their fathers or their fathers fathers.

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I have a mate who has always been pretty left-leaning, a real social democrat.

Him and his missus discovered they were expecting last year. They are both on below average incomes (about £16K pa-ish each) and pay income tax, but they managed to buy their own place through savings, a fairly hefty mortgage and help from mum and dad, as there was no way they would get a council house and private rental is very expensive where they are. Money is very tight for them, and they both work full time and have to run a car because there is no public transport around the only house in about 30 miles they could actually afford.

A few months into the pregnancy, they got the forms for child benefit and tax credits. One night, he phones us up apoplectic, really, really angry. Turns out he's discovered that if you are unemployed, or you are a single mum, you get a £700 set up grant to buy the things you need for the baby. His words were along the lines of "you wouldn't believe how much they throw at you anyway if you don't work and are having a kid, but this just takes the piss."

And I can understand why he feels that way. The entire system is now set up to penalise anyone that works and earns below £40k pa, which is nigh on 80 percent of all income earners. These are the people that are paying the tax that funds all these handouts., all this public sector largesse, yet they themselves have to pay private rents or buy private housing, have to pay council tax and a quarter of their income in income tax, but do not qualify for anything, even when they are hand to mouth.

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People without children couples or singles get jack s--t !!

And why the hell should they be entitled to some 'uplift' from my earnings? Bugger me, you save up till you can afford to have kids etc. I'm not saying that producing the next generation of benefit fodder should entitle you to anything either.

Removal of housing benefit and making 'teen mums' live with their parents would soon encourage said parents to bring up their brats better.

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I have a mate who has always been pretty left-leaning, a real social democrat.

Him and his missus discovered they were expecting last year. They are both on below average incomes (about £16K pa-ish each) and pay income tax, but they managed to buy their own place through savings, a fairly hefty mortgage and help from mum and dad, as there was no way they would get a council house and private rental is very expensive where they are. Money is very tight for them, and they both work full time and have to run a car because there is no public transport around the only house in about 30 miles they could actually afford.

A few months into the pregnancy, they got the forms for child benefit and tax credits. One night, he phones us up apoplectic, really, really angry. Turns out he's discovered that if you are unemployed, or you are a single mum, you get a £700 set up grant to buy the things you need for the baby. His words were along the lines of "you wouldn't believe how much they throw at you anyway if you don't work and are having a kid, but this just takes the piss."

And I can understand why he feels that way. The entire system is now set up to penalise anyone that works and earns below £40k pa, which is nigh on 80 percent of all income earners. These are the people that are paying the tax that funds all these handouts., all this public sector largesse, yet they themselves have to pay private rents or buy private housing, have to pay council tax and a quarter of their income in income tax, but do not qualify for anything, even when they are hand to mouth.

Yup. Yummy Mummies. Scum of the earth.

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And, lo, the hospitals to deliver them and the schools to educate them and the paramedics and officers of the law to care for them after their drinking deeply of Alcopop in Clubs of the Night were created on the eighth day

And this was done even without the taxation of their fathers or their fathers fathers.

But by the taxation of their fellow men. Only problem is, some of the fellow men took a lot of this for themselves.

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  • 140 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
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      • Even
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      • up 5%



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