NuBrit Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 If you want the security, you could consider buying a cheap, livable place to ride out the crash in. I have done this and it has worked out very well for me financially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talksalot81 Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 I think it's sellers' delusions rather than prices that are taking longer to kill off. Delusions fed by the financial powers that be. The cost of being delusional is very low at present. Sellers are betting on either a recovery or more intervention before IR rises would force big drops. As I have stated elsewhere, the current ultra low rate scenario just has resulted in an inadequate correction. If rates rise and people are forced to sell, the market won't be able to stand at the level the correction has taken it to. This being the case, it will be entirely the fault of a protectionist attitude. A less protectionish view would have led to a steeper correction which settles at a sustainable level. I fear that the actual scenario simply means huge pain for all if it does not work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride_on Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 At £150,000 mortgage that will cost you £800/month+ rates + repairs etc, forget £150,000 3 bed semi, for that sort of money you can rent a 4 bed detached house. If you think you can afford that level of payment, live it up a bit for a year and watch the prices drop. You are financially better off doing that than buying now, you are just giving the landlord money instead of the bank interest, and it will be cheaper since you won't have to pay rates or repairs, and you don't have the long term risk and you keep your 20% deposit money. If you find it hard going you only have a years contract max, not 25 years. Other half's do take a bit of convincing on the old renting argument, but usually once she sees the house she can rent compared to what you were going to buy it should be an easy win. Also throw in the fact that you are mostly just paying interest, a much smaller amount goes into the equity of the house, but likely you will suffer value loss so at best you are going to lose your deposit in terms of value, worst go into negative equity. Now that is throwing away money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark206000 Posted September 29, 2010 Author Share Posted September 29, 2010 Nobody will shift me before the middle of next year at least ! Can you get 6 month rentals or they all 12 really ? Looks like alot of us are in the same boat getting our ears bent by the other half ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pootle Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 I think you should follow this sound advice from Fraser Houses, snapped from todays Belfast Telegraph homefinder supplement. That's if your definition of living is instant negative equity! I think I'm going to have to poke my flumping eyes out with knitting needles! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinbin Posted September 29, 2010 Share Posted September 29, 2010 Nobody will shift me before the middle of next year at least ! Can you get 6 month rentals or they all 12 really ? Should get 6mths easy enough. First contract for a rental property is commonly 6mths so that if it turned out a bad tenant they can turf them out fairly quickly. After 6mths though they would prob look to get a 12mth contract signed. Will vary between landlords. Just tell them u only want 6mths, should be easy enough to sort. The landlord should be happy to get the income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark206000 Posted January 3, 2011 Author Share Posted January 3, 2011 Well I'm still here ! I've sat tight and didn't buy anything ! Houses I've been looking at have indeed dropped another £10k-£20k since the start of this thread. To be honest i'm actually more nervous about buying a house this year than I would have been last year. Seems everyhing is on a knife edge at the moment. What's everyones plans, waiting till prices reach RV ? I've read some saying they have already, but I've not seen them that's for sure. I can't imagine myself buying in the first half of the way anyway, but I imagine the pressure will be mounting from you know who ! Cheers ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyes wide open Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 still waiting too, i intend to start making cheeky offers from May.... but that may change Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talksalot81 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 I am definitely still waiting. Look at £150k properties in east belfast sort of area; that is about the bottom of the 'nice enough' properties. Fixed rate deals are really the only sensible route at the moment so you are looking at 4+% and something like a 40% deposit. That means £45k deposit and monthly repayments of £600ish. Keeping a sensible rule of thumb of max spend of 30% of take home pay, that needs an income of approx £30k. So a £45k deposit and £30k salary.... to get into an 'acceptable' property.... that still sounds unacceptable to me! These should be acessible to 'normal' people so I think those £150k properties have to drop to 120k.... then we might be about right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BelfastVI Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 I am definitely still waiting. Look at £150k properties in east belfast sort of area; that is about the bottom of the 'nice enough' properties. Fixed rate deals are really the only sensible route at the moment so you are looking at 4+% and something like a 40% deposit. That means £45k deposit and monthly repayments of £600ish. Keeping a sensible rule of thumb of max spend of 30% of take home pay, that needs an income of approx £30k. So a £45k deposit and £30k salary.... to get into an 'acceptable' property.... that still sounds unacceptable to me! These should be acessible to 'normal' people so I think those £150k properties have to drop to 120k.... then we might be about right.how much is it to rent this sort of property? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdiver Posted January 4, 2011 Share Posted January 4, 2011 Mirror, Mirror on the Wall, Who's the Bearest of them all? I used to be. that used to be me - and I still am a bear. - but now I think that with the increase in repossessed properties coming onto the market and the very very very poor consumer/investor confidence: NOW IS THE TIME TO BUY! I think that yields of 10% are possible in NI. Sure, there may be job losses and rent falls - however, if you are thinking of buying somewhere and using it long-term - this should not matter too much. Have your finance sorted out and if possible buy with cash. The sellers will be the banks - not some Paddy Last holding out for the "glories of 2007." Make a ridiculous offer - make an offer that you think the place is worth - be glad to walk away and just as glad to buy. I can't say that prices will keep falling or rise or stagnate - but the difference between what sellers are asking for and what the banks are valuing repossessed properties at is key. Have a look at places online - there are great tools to see how deluded the sellers are. Most of the places I've seen have been listed for months and months and even years in some cases. they will never sell at those prices - NEVER. I plan to buy a few BTL properties over the next few months - I kid you not. It's not just a matter of House Price Index prices - it's a matter of opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj11 Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 maxdiver - Do you have any links for how much repossessed homes are going for? I am sick of this huge price gap between EAs/sellers and buyers and want to see some hard facts on how much homes are selling for. Something like rightmove selling prices for Northern Ireland would be gold, for giving it back to these hot-heads! rant over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxdiver Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 maxdiver - Do you have any links for how much repossessed homes are going for? Call up an estate agent - talk to a senior agent. Ask them if they have any realistically* priced property - tell them what you want (3-bed?, area etc...) Tell them that you have the deposit required, mortgage approval and are looking to buy and ready to move but that most property for sale is over-valued. They will be keen to help and will give you an idea of what is actually at market value and which places that are for sale for say £150k that will sell for say £100k. If they don't have anything - ask to be kept informed of anything that comes up. Estate agents are not VIs for high house prices - they want sales and the ones I've spoken to realise that the market has changed from the glory of 2007. A sale is a sale. If you have the money and are ready to move (no chain for example) this is music to their ears. I will refrain from posting links until I've got word back on some places I'm looking at. Good luck. *you could ask specifically for repossessed or distressed sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikmo Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Gents, who are the main receivers and auctioneers in NI? On the mainland big players like Allsop etc get all the repossessions, distressed etc. but can't seem to find an equivilant for us in NI? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark206000 Posted December 13, 2011 Author Share Posted December 13, 2011 Well just to give all who give me advice on this thread an update and what I've done. Real life buying experiences seem to be few and far between ! We bought 2 months ago, detached bungalow in a nice area in Bangor, will never really need to move. Was on the market for near 3 years. Started off at £290k (thanks propertybee) it's RV is £170k and worked it's way down to £150k in the end. The vendor just wanted rid of it for personal reasons and cut £30k of the price to generate interest and get a bidding war going. He actually got what he wanted, had quite a bit of interest and quite a few bids over asking. We stuck in asking price and waited it out. Had the usual estate agent fluff telling us to up offer etc as they had all these other offers. Went on for about a month then as it works out, for all the other offers none were proceedable all had houses to sell, so it fell back to us and the offer was accepted. We put 20% down, got mortgage with Progressive no problem at all, in fact they were happy to lend up to £190k. I still expect houses to fall another bit. But the timing and the house was right for us, so we took the plunge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guessing_game Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Hi This is my first post on here and I've spent the last month trawling through some of the topics looking for bits and pieces of advice. I'll give you a brief rundown on our position. We put our house (3 bed semi in a nice part of Lisburn) up for sale at the start of November 2011 with the assumption that it would be March/April of 2012 before we would have any genuine interest. We had two valuations, one at £135k (way off the mark) and one at £115k. We went for the second valuation and accepted a bid of £112k within 10 days of it going on the market. We have agreed with the buyer to be out of the property by the end of this month. Now I'm in a situation I didnt expect to be in and may have to rent for 6 months. The problem I'm having is that a particular house I'm looking at (4 bed detached in Lisburn) is on the market for £250k. By my reckoning prices are now 50% of what they were in mid 2007, and this house would have been on the market back then for 375-400. Easy sums tell me this house should now be between 185 and 200k. Also the RV on the house is 160k and I keep reading on here about this being a good indicator of where prices should be at. The agents selling the house we are interested in are the same ones that valued our own house at 135k and I am reluctant to approcah him with what he would, I'm sure consider a derisory offer of around 190k. I have around 75k of a deposit and a mortgage facility up to 130k so I'm not going to sit and wait for the very bottom of the market - the house we move to is the house we'll stay in for the forseeable future and it would take another catastrophic collapse in prices to force me into negative equity, however I don't want to pay way over the odds for a property either. Lastly, we've two kids under 3yo - upping sticks and renting only to have to move again is the last thing we really want to be doing. Any advice out there for a soon to be homeless family!! Regards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realistic NI EA Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Hmmm, difficult one, your EA is also the one you want to buy a house from so to be fair he should be realistic about the true value of the other house if he valued your house at todays prices. I think you need to have a chat with him and explain your quandry. He surely couldn't have the audacity to advise you to sell at todays prices but hold out for a deluded price on the other house. He wants to achieve sales so just ask him for his frank opinion of the value of the other house now. If he says something ridiculous like 230k then forget about trying to buy the place as both he and the vendor will not be talked to below 200k. Can I ask why you put your house on the market in the first place? Was it purely because you wanted to buy this one other house so needed to sell yours first? If that's the case I would have made the EA aware you liked this other house and explained your budget at the point where he valued your house. When 2 possible sales are on the table he would've probably blurted out the bare minimum the other vendors would take to sell their place. If you just want to move to a bigger place then I think this year is ideal for doing that. The larger properties will lose more in value in £ than smaller, cheaper ones so the gap to upgrade will be smaller than it has been for the past 10 years. Look at other properties and narrow it down to a few that you would like to buy, then make offers. You are now a proceedable buyer, rarer than hen's teeth, so use your position to buy your next house at a the right price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guessing_game Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Hmmm, difficult one, your EA is also the one you want to buy a house from so to be fair he should be realistic about the true value of the other house if he valued your house at todays prices. I think you need to have a chat with him and explain your quandry. He surely couldn't have the audacity to advise you to sell at todays prices but hold out for a deluded price on the other house. He wants to achieve sales so just ask him for his frank opinion of the value of the other house now. If he says something ridiculous like 230k then forget about trying to buy the place as both he and the vendor will not be talked to below 200k. Can I ask why you put your house on the market in the first place? Was it purely because you wanted to buy this one other house so needed to sell yours first? If that's the case I would have made the EA aware you liked this other house and explained your budget at the point where he valued your house. When 2 possible sales are on the table he would've probably blurted out the bare minimum the other vendors would take to sell their place. If you just want to move to a bigger place then I think this year is ideal for doing that. The larger properties will lose more in value in £ than smaller, cheaper ones so the gap to upgrade will be smaller than it has been for the past 10 years. Look at other properties and narrow it down to a few that you would like to buy, then make offers. You are now a proceedable buyer, rarer than hen's teeth, so use your position to buy your next house at a the right price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guessing_game Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Hmmm, difficult one, your EA is also the one you want to buy a house from so to be fair he should be realistic about the true value of the other house if he valued your house at todays prices. I think you need to have a chat with him and explain your quandry. He surely couldn't have the audacity to advise you to sell at todays prices but hold out for a deluded price on the other house. He wants to achieve sales so just ask him for his frank opinion of the value of the other house now. If he says something ridiculous like 230k then forget about trying to buy the place as both he and the vendor will not be talked to below 200k. Can I ask why you put your house on the market in the first place? Was it purely because you wanted to buy this one other house so needed to sell yours first? If that's the case I would have made the EA aware you liked this other house and explained your budget at the point where he valued your house. When 2 possible sales are on the table he would've probably blurted out the bare minimum the other vendors would take to sell their place. If you just want to move to a bigger place then I think this year is ideal for doing that. The larger properties will lose more in value in £ than smaller, cheaper ones so the gap to upgrade will be smaller than it has been for the past 10 years. Look at other properties and narrow it down to a few that you would like to buy, then make offers. You are now a proceedable buyer, rarer than hen's teeth, so use your position to buy your next house at a the right price. Cheers for the reply, you've misunderstood the situation. The EA representing the house we are interested in is the one who in my opinion overvalued our own home, I never used his services in the end, and without naming him, the majority of properties that he his selling in the Lisburn area are way of the mark. I just get the impression I'll be getting nowhere with him if I approach him with an offer. As you're in this line of business, is it acceptable to go straight to the vendor and tell them (in the nicest possible way) that their EA is living in the past and make them an offer directly. I have never moved property before and the last thing I would want to do is get off on the wrong foot with the owner of a property that we are interested in. Incidentally this property has been on the market for around 500 days now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guessing_game Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Thanks. I'll have to try something, looks like the renting for six months may be unavoidable though! Heres hoping this year is the year the penny is finally going to drop with EA's and vendors who believe that their properties can't be worth anything less than they paid for them three years ago!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woohoo2 Posted January 1, 2012 Share Posted January 1, 2012 Cheers for the reply, you've misunderstood the situation. The EA representing the house we are interested in is the one who in my opinion overvalued our own home, I never used his services in the end, and without naming him, the majority of properties that he his selling in the Lisburn area are way of the mark. I just get the impression I'll be getting nowhere with him if I approach him with an offer. As you're in this line of business, is it acceptable to go straight to the vendor and tell them (in the nicest possible way) that their EA is living in the past and make them an offer directly. I have never moved property before and the last thing I would want to do is get off on the wrong foot with the owner of a property that we are interested in. Incidentally this property has been on the market for around 500 days now. Hi there, We were in exactly the same sort of position in 2010/2011 and all worked out OK in the end. To sell in this market you have to pounce on any offer that you are willing to take. Another one may not come for months or years. If you are serious about moving then you need to be serious and proactive about getting your house sold. Buying in this market can be much slower however, especially if you have seen somewhere you like and you hope to bring up your family in it - any house just won't do. We ended up renting for 8 months. It really wasn't easy or ideal at all, but then we don't regret it either. It was just the way things went. In our case there was 115k between the original asking price and the eventual price we paid and the estate agent was the most arrogant of the lot so it took some time. Firstly don't worry about offending an agent with a so-called derisory offer. You have nothing to be embarrassed about. Someone willing and able to spend 190k is both rare and worthy of the respect of estate agents. You have accepted a sensible price and that gives you rock solid deposit and a right to call ******** on anyone who tries to spin a high price but is failing to sell at that price. The agent is the one who should be embarrassed with asking prices so far above rateable value. He is the one whose business is probably flat on its back and just about surviving. His asking price is based on nothing but hope and bluster. It may just deliberately be speculatively high in order to make reasonable offers look low. The only rational thing to do is to ignore the asking price completely and offer a sensible price. We did this and our offer was rejected, of course, and for some months nothing happened. It does take something like courage or a brass neck or something to tell an estate agent that you have more confidence in your own valuation of the house than in their made up asking price, but once you develop the thick skin you begin to enjoy it. That's because behind the arrogant facade they are all pretty scared and in a weak negotiating position. You have all the cards. In the end for us, we got tired of waiting and tired of living in rented accommodation, so we went back and said we were ready to offer a higher price than our ideal price, but still not near their previous bottom line either. They jumped at the chance. I don't think it is a sensible option to approach the vendor directly. They hire an agent to do that and an unorthodox approach like that is surely more risky than just giving the agent an honest opinion of what you think the house is worth and what you are willing to pay. He is not that busy so he will be sure to go straight back to them and tell them everything anyway. Just remember that any offer you make is NOT low. £190k is a lot of money. Very few people can raise that sort of money for any purpose nowadays. If anyone tells you it's low then tell them to bid against you with their own money. That always shuts people up. Anyway I hope this is some way useful as it's from someone who has been there before. One thing I'd suggest is to seriously consider short term renting or another short term solution to give you more time. You don't want to get bounced into buying a house quickly for the sake of a couple of months when the change you are making is possibly permanent. The other possibility is to pay a bit over the odds in order to buy quickly and live with that, as long as you got the right house it won't matter that much in the end. Either way though you'll need to get over this idea that the estate agent's asking price is worthy of anything but either laughing out loudly at or ignoring completely. His opinion of you is irrelevant. Be prepared to offend the agent and be prepared for any old crap he talks. Don't forget that you have all the cards and he has none. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest_Belfast Fubar_* Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Firstly don't worry about offending an agent with a so-called derisory offer. You have nothing to be embarrassed about. Someone willing and able to spend 190k is both rare and worthy of the respect of estate agents. 190K for a house in Lisburn shows how far prices still have to fall. It would need to be worthy of feature on MTV Cribs to be worth that in Lisburn (no offence). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lolacarrascal Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 190K for a house in Lisburn shows how far prices still have to fall. A very wide sweeping statement - care to enlighten us with some argument to support that contention. Smell The Fear is exactly right about the potential danger of this forum i.e. perpetuating a particular group mindset without continual checking with reality as to whether the current facts continue to support the historical position. It's so evident on the main board that I rarely even bother to read any of the posts on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guessing_game Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 Woohoo Thanks for that reply. I'll keep you posted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest_Belfast Fubar_* Posted January 2, 2012 Share Posted January 2, 2012 A very wide sweeping statement - care to enlighten us with some argument to support that contention. Just intuition based on working there for 4 years, knowing the place pretty well & what jobs are available there, mates who live there, what you'd get for 190K in Belfast, the miserable Lisburn-Belfast commute, number of for sale signs etc. Gut says that 190K for anything but a very high quality detached house in a nice area is too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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