What Would You Do In This Situation?

[guitarman001]

Last night about 12:20am I heard loud voices so peeked out the window. It was 4 Polish people hanging around outside their BMW - they eventually put the stereo on pretty loud which was distracting if you were trying to sleep. One dirty sod then whipped out his bit to pee on my girlfriend's driver door. Another took it out and peed in the street for all to see. Another Pole came out of the opposite block and received some sort of package (God knows what it was) from the others. Five minutes later they drove away.

This was outside of my girlfriend's flat, not 2 mins from the local police station! My girlfriend and I concurred - we have to get a detached house away from places like this (ex-council). What was I supposed to do? The guys were massive and I'd probably have gotten a kicking - they were only there about 15 minutes so if I called the police they may not have got there on time (despite being down the road..). And what would the police have done if anything? If they knew it was us then I don't want to imagine escalating the situation... I felt pretty trapped by the situation, it was horrible.

Not being anti-Polish (I would say the same of any Brit) but one of my girlfriend's friends has Polish neighbours who constantly boom music into the small hours. Two months ago they left the chip-pan on and the flat was on fire. They're still there, very little is being done! Absolute scumbags. And you know what? The landlord who lets out to them asked why this woman was in such a fit - she had home insurance didn't they? She replied 'and what about my kids?' to which he supposedly shrugged.

Haven't felt like such a mouse in a while - I can see why some people take the hit and move out to nice areas despite the cost.

[CokeSnortingTory]

Why would Poles be acting like Lithuanians?

[Guest Ian Chesterton]

You did the right thing.

[piece of paper]

Last night about 12:20am I heard loud voices so peeked out the window. It was 4 Polish people hanging around outside their BMW - they eventually put the stereo on pretty loud which was distracting if you were trying to sleep. One dirty sod then whipped out his bit to pee on my girlfriend's driver door. Another took it out and peed in the street for all to see. Another Pole came out of the opposite block and received some sort of package (God knows what it was) from the others. Five minutes later they drove away.

This was outside of my girlfriend's flat, not 2 mins from the local police station! My girlfriend and I concurred - we have to get a detached house away from places like this (ex-council). What was I supposed to do? The guys were massive and I'd probably have gotten a kicking - they were only there about 15 minutes so if I called the police they may not have got there on time (despite being down the road..). And what would the police have done if anything? If they knew it was us then I don't want to imagine escalating the situation... I felt pretty trapped by the situation, it was horrible.

Not being anti-Polish (I would say the same of any Brit) but one of my girlfriend's friends has Polish neighbours who constantly boom music into the small hours. Two months ago they left the chip-pan on and the flat was on fire. They're still there, very little is being done! Absolute scumbags. And you know what? The landlord who lets out to them asked why this woman was in such a fit - she had home insurance didn't they? She replied 'and what about my kids?' to which he supposedly shrugged.

Haven't felt like such a mouse in a while - I can see why some people take the hit and move out to nice areas despite the cost.

Seems the wrong time of year but was the lock frozen?

p-o-p

[guitarman001]

They do speak bloody loud! I probably did the right thing by doing nothing as anything else likely would have escalated things - but that in itself is ridiculous.

[Darkman]

Last night about 12:20am I heard loud voices so peeked out the window. It was 4 Polish people hanging around outside their BMW - they eventually put the stereo on pretty loud which was distracting if you were trying to sleep. One dirty sod then whipped out his bit to pee on my girlfriend's driver door.

Well, I can relate to your post on several levels.

The guy taking a p*** on your girlfriends car is the real issue here isn't it? Because you feel you should be protecting your partner, and she may too. You begin to wonder if you looked like a mouse to your girlfriend, which is humiliating. This was probably the worst part for you?

A similar incident happened to me this year. I had very noisy Polish neighbours, but it was actually two (adult) chav yobs who started using our flat wall/windows to kick a football against. It scared my wife and the pressure was obviously on me to sort it. When I opened the window and called out to them, they made it apparent my presence didn't make any difference. And when I told them to "get out of here" they told me to go forth and multiply.

At that point my wife told me not to go outside, because they seemed high and "might kill me" (her words not mine). I don't know if I would have gone outside or not really. The rational option is to call the police. Had one of them started p***ing on my car door, anger might have caused me to do something silly. I don't know.

After I closed the window, and they kicked the ball a few more times, then shuffled off. They probably thought I was calling the cops. I should make it clear I'm not a fighter or a big guy. Add to that being outnumbered, and going outside would have been dumb. My best weapon would have have been extreme anger, which I do have haha.

Anyway, in your case no way should you have gone outside. Outnumbered four to one. Assume they had weapons, and were high/drunk. The most you could have done was shout out the window, but even that could be a silly action in this day and age. They'd know where you live, but not vice versa. Hence the feeling of being trapped. If you start something, you could never just walk away from it and consider it finished.

The irony of my own story is I learnt to appreciate my noisy Polish neighbours. Because while they'd be hanging round outside the communal door, they were effectively free security! I doubt those yobs would have started if they'd been out there like usual. So these situations can turn some previously held assumptions on their head.

And finally your point about paying more for a better area? My thoughts exactly. All this taught me a lesson. It may not be wise to go for the bigger/better property in a tatty area. If you do, you have to accept the potential for anti-social behaviour and conflict. That's the reality. I suspect peace of mind is more important. For this reason, I'm in two minds about where we'll eventually live. They do say "buy the worst property in the best area", and I think that holds true. i don't fancy being looked down on by my new neighbours, but I'd rather that than have violent confrontations on my own doorstep. Life is too short to be at war with people less intelligent than yourself, who have nothing to lose. You *do* have something to lose.

Thanks for reading

[Guest Ian Chesterton]

Have you tried selling your story to the Daily Mail?

[The Generation Game]

This is my kind of thread as I'm suffering from similar (well, same ballpark at least).

My upstairs neighbour plays loud music most evenings and weekends. I've tried to reason with him about insulating his subwoofer. I even invited him downstairs to listen to what I had to listen to and he declined.

A few days ago my fiancee snapped and decided to go and have words with him. He'd had friends around every evening for the past 3 or 4 nights. After 10 minutes of knocking he had still not answered the door.

This lack of courtesy / arrogance made my blood boil and I went upstairs and hammered heavily on his door. After 3 attempts he came and answered the door (well he spoke to me through the door at least - I was incandescent with rage from the knocking not being answered promptly and was physically shaking). I politely asked him to turn the music down, do something about the bass and then swore a bit about it being every evening.

While I fear retribution for my actions, I haven't heard a peep from him since. I still want to move out when my rental agreement expires but, as I can't afford anything in London above a studio - and even then the rent is around the level of housing benefit - so I run the risk the of repeating the process wherever I move to. Can't wait for my PhD to finish so I can leave this town and seek some tranquility (which will probably end up being abroad).

The invention of the speaker has been the bane of my existence for most of the last decade.

[AvidFan]

I find this in general. Not wishing to sound anti-anyone, but where I've lived in the S.E. in neighbourhoods with lots of needs-must integration, the culture is just completely different between British (well, whatever you call British these days) and imigrants. They stay up late, they're loud, they bang doors and clump up and down stairs until the small hours of the morning, they're outside and in the back garden all night, leaving barbies burning at 2:00am - they shout at their kids to make them stop crying... honestly - I've encountered five families in 3 different locations in the last 7 years - Polish, Turkish, Spanish - all seem the same to me. Just noise, noise, noise and no regard for bedtimes or other peoples feelings.

A couple of nights ago, there's a house not more than a few doors down - well - the guy had obviously hired an escort. All I could hear was... well, she was rather noisy.. until about 5:00am (how either of them had that much stamina I'll never know). The rest of the time, she was calling him a "silly boy" - maybe he was asking her if she was tired? Then it started again... and again... and again. Whatever he was doing to her, she either liked it a hell of a lot, or he was doing physical damage.

Never mind. Rant over.

Either buy a detached, buy in a nicer area or rent and know you can leave.

[Frank Hovis]

Guitarman's incident is a great argument for renting.

Oh, and of course you were right not to do anything. They were there 15 minutes and the worst they did was piss on a car.

There may come a time when you have to act or call the police but this was not the time.

[libspero]

Not being anti-Polish (I would say the same of any Brit) but one of my girlfriend's friends has Polish neighbours who constantly boom music into the small hours. Two months ago they left the chip-pan on and the flat was on fire. They're still there, very little is being done! Absolute scumbags. And you know what? The landlord who lets out to them asked why this woman was in such a fit - she had home insurance didn't they? She replied 'and what about my kids?' to which he supposedly shrugged.

If it was "Kate Bush - Babooshka" then I think we have a suspect

[Pole]

Last night about 12:20am I heard loud voices so peeked out the window. It was 4 Polish people hanging around outside their BMW - they eventually put the stereo on pretty loud which was distracting if you were trying to sleep. One dirty sod then whipped out his bit to pee on my girlfriend's driver door. Another took it out and peed in the street for all to see. Another Pole came out of the opposite block and received some sort of package (God knows what it was) from the others. Five minutes later they drove away.

This was outside of my girlfriend's flat, not 2 mins from the local police station! My girlfriend and I concurred - we have to get a detached house away from places like this (ex-council). What was I supposed to do? The guys were massive and I'd probably have gotten a kicking - they were only there about 15 minutes so if I called the police they may not have got there on time (despite being down the road..). And what would the police have done if anything? If they knew it was us then I don't want to imagine escalating the situation... I felt pretty trapped by the situation, it was horrible.

Not being anti-Polish (I would say the same of any Brit) but one of my girlfriend's friends has Polish neighbours who constantly boom music into the small hours. Two months ago they left the chip-pan on and the flat was on fire. They're still there, very little is being done! Absolute scumbags. And you know what? The landlord who lets out to them asked why this woman was in such a fit - she had home insurance didn't they? She replied 'and what about my kids?' to which he supposedly shrugged.

Haven't felt like such a mouse in a while - I can see why some people take the hit and move out to nice areas despite the cost.

Really sorry to hear about all of this. Yep, there's loads of chavs&lowlife amongst Poles - and chavs being chavs have that nasty habit of behaving truly disgracefully.

That's why I'm a great believer in the class system. It's too late to educate them but at least I don't have to mix&live with them.

[Pole]

If it was "Kate Bush - Babooshka" then I think we have a suspect

[guitarman001]

Darkman - yes, part of it of course is that there's the pressure of trying to protect your woman - but also standing up for yourself and what's right, in general. You make lots of excellent points all of which I agree with.

TGG - sorry to hear about your troubles! It seems all too common nowadays, though

We had bad neighbours (back at home - I still live at home you see, but stay over at the girlfriend's on weekends) for YEARS and it was hell on Earth. Honestly it is just the worst thing, having bad neighbours. If/when I buy, I will have a bloody stakeout, especially at weekends, to see what goes on... It truly is ridiculous that people don't have the simple respect of being quiet at night when people are trying to sleep! I was in Paris a few weeks ago and the French couple through te wall were up until 4am making loud buzzing noises - I banged the wall and had to call down to reception twice! I'm more of an intellectual than a fighter (I'm pretty thin!) and just would not cope well in a heated situation. It does make you feel absolutely powerless.

[Kingding]

You did the right thing, at best you would have probably copped some abuse and at worst a good kicking so best to keep schtum unless it's something drastic.

I made the mistake of opening a window where we used to live and telling a load of chavs who were throwing stones at my window exactly what I thought of them, from that day forth the house was marked and the stones became a daily occurance. Eventually we got a brick through the window and the police were called and we were told (after repeatedly confirming my 'ethnic status' whatever the f*ck that might be) that someone would be round. Nobody showed up. The incidents got worse, we moved.

There is nothing worse than living in the vicinity of people who just don't give a shit and I have lived next door to some scummers in my time. The cold hard truth of the matter is that it's actually extremely difficult to get these arseholes under some kind of control if they just don't care and making your life hell probably barely registers in their scuzzy minds.

Chavs also seem to bear a grudge for a long, long time, get yourself noticed and you'll be in it for the long run.

[Sibley's Love Child]

To OP, in that situation I reckon you did right thing; a confrontation would have only served to open a can of wuppass.

Until i'd read this thread (and until moving to Dagenham) I hadn't realise there was so much trouble with Poles & Lithuanians. The irony is that in the 5 years I spent in Elephant & Castle (predominantly Nigerian, Jamaicans and the obligatory trailer-park trash) I haven't encountered the levels of inconsideration and lack of respect that I have in six months here.

Last week I had to confront one of my neigbours (Lithuanian) because he was burning piles of wood in his back garden all evening with smoke billowing into my house (stunk the feckin place out). After a couple of hours I just snapped and went round there; thankfully, although he was a big lumbering mo-fo he duly put out the fire.

To add insult to injury, the missus was out all day and night yesterday so I was looking after the little-man. I put him to bed around 19:30 which happened to coincide with another Lithuanian family on my street cranking up their party in their back garden. Thankfully Archie's room is at the opposite end of the house but you could still hear the bass thumping despite this. I mean, god knows what decibel levels their volume was at but it was simply indecent. By the time i'd had a shower and got changed it was actually louder still and I was absolutely incandescent. It got to about 9pm and I thought 'f*ck it'. Stormed across to their house and banged on their front-door; no answer (not surprising given the noise). Went round to the gate which gave access to their back-garden; still no answer although I could hear someone behind the door which only served to wind me up more. In the end I resorted to scaling their 8 foot fence via a lamp-post. I couldn't believe me eyes, accompanied by this cacophany was this family party (congas and sh*t) all having a lark oblivious to the hell they were making everyone else's evening. In the end I just shouted at the nearest fella to turn the feckin noise down as I had a baby sleeping. That was that thankfully.

What fecks me off the most, aside from these scummers, is that no-one else will do anything and instead suffer in silence. ****** to that.

[guitarman001]

Guys -- thanks for your anecdotals.

Kingding - EXACTLY. The flat would be marked for further abuse and these people don't like to be 'spoken to' - the grudge can last forever and that's the last thing we'd want.

The police are INSANE about ethnicity and pleasing minorities over Brits. My uncle who was a detective in London then moved up here has told me some shocking tales... And they never get anything done, they're useless - which is why I was reluctant to call them.

SLC - wow, can't believe these party people could be so insensitive. If I were to do something like that I'd probably warn the neighbours beforehand! (Not that I would have a loud party going on late!). Reminds me of when our downstairs neighbours boomed music all the time and my dad crawled in through their window to turn their stereo off - risky business but eventually you snap.

Nobody does anything because they all think nobody else will support them. If communities were strong and had proper support that would be great - but our communities are broken. We don't have the same ethics/religion etc and everybody knows things often just get worse. I actually found myself thinking that there is no justice and that what is needed is a proper vigilante group! let's face it a lot of these scumbags just need taught a lesson else they think they can trample all over you - unfortunately the left usually go against this and want rights for the accused. (Here's another story for you - a friend got headbutted outside the ASDA cash machine last week and had his wallet stolen, police have gotten nowehere. Honestly some people say 'where is this crime you speak of' but I ask 'where ISN'T it!?')

Bardon, I considered speaking to the Polish neighbour across the street today but I decided against it. He'd ask whose car was peed on and his mates would know who made the complaint - I wouldn't want my girlfriend to be getting hassle during the week when I'm not there.

It's not just noisy neighbours or threatening foreigners - it just feels like if any indecent/unlawful act is being made then there is no point in doing anything about it most times for fear of getting prosecuted yourself or getting some serious threats from the attackers etc.

I hope more of them don't move in - she wants to sell at some point and lets hope it doesn't devalue the place too much!

Oh to live in a nice little estate.

[indirectapproach]

Ahem, I know someone quite well who when he was about twenty years old used to make a point of pissing on Porsches while drunk, late at night and caught short, if there were any about.

Apparently, he shared this illicit pleasure with a well known published author and a successful city lawyer whose current specialism is IP.

The young ladies would take care of the front while he dealt with the rear.

It's not just chavs that piss on cars you know.

Lets be fair.

[Pole]

If communities were strong and had proper support that would be great - but our communities are broken. We don't have the same ethics/religion etc and everybody knows things often just get worse. I actually found myself thinking that there is no justice and that what is needed is a proper vigilante group! let's face it a lot of these scumbags just need taught a lesson else they think they can trample all over you - unfortunately the left usually go against this and want rights for the accused.

It's got nothing to do with nationality, culture, religion or politics. As I said before, scumbags are everywhere and there's loads of them. Fortunately, the good guys are even more plentiful.

It's just common sense. You want peace&quiet and most of your neighbours want the same. You don't need a vigilante group. Just speak to the male neighbours and then go and confront the scumbags politely but as a group. Show them that this is your street (because it is, isn't it?).

Without growing some balls and standing up for each other, we're totally defenceless.

[Snow Birds]

It's got nothing to do with nationality, culture, religion or politics. As I said before, scumbags are everywhere and there's loads of them. Fortunately, the good guys are even more plentiful.

It's just common sense. You want peace&quiet and most of your neighbours want the same. You don't need a vigilante group. Just speak to the male neighbours and then go and confront the scumbags politely but as a group. Show them that this is your street (because it is, isn't it?).

Without growing some balls and standing up for each other, we're totally defenceless.

Basically a good plan but there has to be a threat or at the very least a percieved one. Your local motor cycle gang would probably help out for a hundred or even for a laugh. Hell's Angels are really good!

[The Ayatollah Buggeri]

In that situation I'd have taken a photo of the car, with number plate visible, through the window, and if possible a video of the package changing hands. Then I'd have sent them to Crimestoppers, anonymously, with a covering note stating the location and explaining that you believe them to be drug dealers.

The BMW was probably stolen and/or had false plates, but you never know - they may have ended up getting some well-deserved grief from the law.

[monty1080]

Tangentially relevant. Last week I was painting the upstairs windows on my house. There were some kids (under 13s ) playing in the street, all local kids. They were throwing stones at each other (stupid, but hey they're kids). I told them to be careful of hitting a car. They ignored me, and a stone hit a car. I said " if a stone hits my car there will be trouble...." hey which was my car, which I stupidly pointed out. Two days later, I come home to see a significant dent scratch combo on my bonnet, not unlike one caused by someone intentionally throwing a stone as hard as they could at your car. Now I don't have a flash car ,in true HPC style I find it ridiculous to beggar yourself to own an X5 or whatever, but it's still mine. Of course I can't prove anything, but Grrrrrrrrr it's made me so angry.

[Speak&Spell]

OP, you did the right thing. Confronting them would have caused even more of an issue. I would have been livid in your position believe me. Urinating on someones car quite frankly takes the mick.

I hate inconsiderate people. My partner and I are currently renting and have had a few issues with neighbours. The upstairs neighbours were blaring their music past 12 at night. I was so livid I went and knocked on their door. They ignored me after constant attempts at getting their attention. When I returned downstairs they had turned the music off. But I haven't always had that reaction.

Our downstairs neighbours have a really annoying child that cries and screams throughout the night. In the past I've had a number of sleepless nights, and I'm one cranky b**** when I haven't slept. I've banged on the floor boards, eventially making the parents take the little runt to the living room, where we're not exposed to this whinginess. You can say it's not the childs fault, but the parents could take him to the living room on every occasion, instead of keeping the kid crying in their bedroom, which is right under us. It's extremely inconsiderate. It's also the parents choice to bring up kids in box like flats. I know I wouldn't do that. It's not fair on the neighbours.

It's a scary prospect knowing that you can buy a house and then you're pretty much stuck with your neighbours, and you don't really know what your neighbours are like until you move in.

[Pole]

It's a scary prospect knowing that you can buy a house flat and then you're pretty much stuck with your neighbours, and you don't really know what your neighbours are like until you move in.

fixed.

We've had the flat vs. house discussion on the Scottish forum (re overpriced Edinburgh flats). And this was one of the many reasons why I think that houses are always much better.

Anyway, people who live in detached houses tend to be more considerate than those who live in flats.

[Pole]

The BMW was probably stolen and/or had false plates, but you never know - they may have ended up getting some well-deserved grief from the law.

That was a quick one, Sherlock.