eurows Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 LATEST HOUSING NEWS Lenders fail to pass on rate cut 'Euromortgage' plan mooted Housing market confidence ebbs Subdued market hits house prices ANALYSIS Housing 'crash' looks remote House prices 'to fall 5% by 2007' Property market set to 'flatline' House price forecasts 2005 Beating a falling housing market Dealing with estate agents A guide to the price surveys The mortgage maze The bbc really piss me off. Look at these headings on the business section http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4196622.stm The heading for housing crash is dated Friday, 10 June, 2005, 04:32 GMT 05:32 UK The other stories are newer but they leave the housing crash looks remote at the top of the list. To make it look like new news. It's really another example of the bbc's biased reporting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Just do like I do on a morning, read the BBC news first of all, it certainly makes you laugh and cheers you up for the rest of the day. I just think of it the same as reading a comic, then onto the serious stuff at other websites. You are well advised on keeping a wide berth of BBC, Channel 4 and ITV news now if you clearly want to see unbiased analysis and news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonnieDarker Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 The frighetning aspect is this drip-drip propaganda does indeed brainwash people. The amount of times I have heard "It is stabilising" said in idle passing from my parents... :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dapperdave Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Sometimes i wonder how all this spin got so ingrained into our lifestyles and if maybe sometimes we are just imagining a lot of it. Then i see bbc news lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libitina Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Whats a 'Euromortgage'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dapperdave Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 That would be the possible mortgages arranged for uk houses but with european interest rates (through european banks?). I think it was first mentioned a few months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
non-FTBer Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Sounds like doubleplusgoodspeak to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Mortages in the UK with European interest rates? My trade is Foreign Currency risk management. I used to get asked on a surprising number of occasions by financial directors of our clients if it was possible to borrow money in Japanese Yen to fund their latest ventures. Why? Because JPY interest rates are the lowest in the western world, base rate being 0.25% Of course it is possible to borrow in a currency that is not native to your business. Additionally of course you suddenly assume a massive foreign exchange exposure between GBP and JPY. Example: You need to borrow GBP 100,000.00 for new machinery for a factory. You borrow JPY 20,100,000 paying 0.3% excluding credit margin, and convert it to sterling at today's rate of 201.00 to the pound giving you your GBP 100,000.00. Then in a years time you need to repay JPY 20,100,000 plus interest meaning a total of JPY 20,160,300. So from GBP you need to find JPY 20,160,300. If you are "lucky" then the GBP/JPY rate of exchange will not have moved over 12 months. If this is the case then you have indeed paid a very low interest cost in comparison with what is available in the UK and you repay GBP 100,300.00 meaning you achieved borrowing costs of 0.3%, well done. If you are "very fortunate indeed" the GBP/JPY will have risen to say 215.00 and then this will cost you GBP 93,768.84 to repay the loan, less notional than you borrowed! If you are "less fortunate" the GBP/JPY rate will have fallen to 180.00 and then this will cost you GBP 112,001.67 to repay the loan, a wapping 'interest' payment of 12%. The borrower is doing nothing but pure speculation, by creating an exposure in a currency/asset that he would not normally use in day to day business. Is it possible to protect yourself against currency movement? Yes of course. If you purchase JPY today but forward dated for delivery in one years time the rate received will be approximately 192.00, meaning you would need to find GBP 105,000 to repay the loan, i.e. the same economic cost of borrowing GBP 100,000 for 1 year. The forward rates offered by banks simply mean the bank buy the JPY today and hold on deposit and calculate the economic cost of forgoing the normal return on GBP in the UK. There is no way round this. It would be the same for the Euro against GBP. It smacks of complete desparation that this alternative is being considered as it would fool the financially illiterate masses even further in todays obsessed debt culture. The only cure for hard drugs is cold turkey. I have worked in currency management for a number of years and I am continually surprised by the money illusion suffered by many in high positions. I used to have a customer who ran the accounts of a large famous name brand who used to do just this type of speculation every year. He had gotten away with it due to low currency fluctuation. One day he will be found out. The problem is that his company rules made no restriction because nothing had gone wrong to date. Amazing. Its Enron with currencies. If this Euro mortgage catches on, don't touch it with a bargepole unless you are paid in Euros. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magictorch Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 1984 Ministry of Information. Need i say any more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zorn Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 If this Euro mortgage catches on, don't touch it with a bargepole unless you are paid in Euros.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Even if you're paid in Euro it's a bit dodgy, because if the euro appreciates significantly against sterling you may find yourself in negative equity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schadenfreude Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 I must be old - I remember an equivalent rise in interest in DM/Franc/USD mortgages back in 89-91 as the more outlandish ways of achieving pseudo-afffordabiliy were marketed. It really is deja-vu all over again..... 45 year/lifetime mortgages Interest only 110% Shared/partner The only real difference I can see is that marketing is a lot more aggresive this time round and the number of providers has exploded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest struthitsruth Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Mortages in the UK with European interest rates? Now that is one interesting and informative post, and the sort I find this website is really good for. Thank you to Gavin, and to libitina who asked the question Webmaster - would this little nugget be useful in the FAQ section at some stage when the Euromortgage becomes flavour of the month ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Once in a lifetime Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Mortages in the UK with European interest rates?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Great post Even I managed to grasp it. Question: 'If' the UK joined the Euro in the near future how wiil that affect our deposits sitting in the Banks. i.e. would speculation leading up to joining the exchange mechanisms alter the value of our present currency (deposits). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bart of Darkness Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Criticism of goodthinkful BBC doupleplusungood, verging crimethink. Housing crisis malreported by oldthinkers, rewrite fullwise. Oldthinkers unbellyfeel "new paradigm". Ignorance is Strength. Or, if you prefer a more down to earth quote from 1984: "We didn't ought to have trusted the buggers". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libitina Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Now that is one interesting and informative post, and the sort I find this website is really good for. Thank you to Gavin, and to libitina who asked the question Webmaster - would this little nugget be useful in the FAQ section at some stage when the Euromortgage becomes flavour of the month ?? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As a complete novice in all of this, I'm not afraid to make myself look stupid by asking dumb questions (as I'm sure some of you have noticed).In my book, if you don't ask you don't learn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Criticism of goodthinkful BBC doupleplusungood, verging crimethink.Housing crisis malreported by oldthinkers, rewrite fullwise. Oldthinkers unbellyfeel "new paradigm". Ignorance is Strength. Or, if you prefer a more down to earth quote from 1984: "We didn't ought to have trusted the buggers". <{POST_SNAPBACK}> BBC duckspeak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malco Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 "My trade is Foreign Currency risk management. " Excellent! While you're here, Gavin, what do you think of my idea of opening a Swiss Franc account and putting some of my savings into it? I am NOT seeking to profit, I merely feel that the CHFr has better prospects than GBP, not least because Switzerland is fundamentally a more competent culture than Britain and it is one of the few countries with little evidence of a bloated housing market. But is there a gremlin somewhere in there that ignorant me is not seeing? Any tips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mushroom Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Two of those old truisms. "He who pays (decides or continues the licence fee) the piper calls the tune". "Don't frighten the horses". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiterabbit Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 Great post  Even I managed to grasp it. Question: 'If' the UK joined the Euro in the near future how wiil that affect our deposits sitting in the Banks. i.e. would speculation leading up to joining the exchange mechanisms alter the value of our present currency (deposits). <{POST_SNAPBACK}> One of the scarey implications of changing currency is the possibilty of the treasury finding out how much money everyone has and back taxing people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gavin Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 "My trade is Foreign Currency risk management. " Excellent! While you're here, Gavin, what do you think of my idea of opening a Swiss Franc account and putting some of my savings into it? I am NOT seeking to profit, I merely feel that the CHFr has better prospects than GBP, not least because Switzerland is fundamentally a more competent culture than Britain and it is one of the few countries with little evidence of a bloated housing market. But is there a gremlin somewhere in there that ignorant me is not seeing? Any tips? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Having been out of the country for a while I am not up to speed on the current fundamental or technical analysis for CHF and its prospects. Generally the CHF has always been labled a 'safe haven' currency for some of the reasons you describe, it is the 'classic' safe haven. You will always see a spike in demand for the Swiss Franc at times of geopolitical uncertainty. If you look at a multi year graph you will see demand following 9/11 and around the invasion of Iraq. The CHF is used by many as a store of wealth, like Gold, like to a certain extent, the USD. I have asked for some up to date detailed analysis specifically for the CHF and will send it to you personally via the internal message system when I get it and maybe paraphrase on here. I would not advise you either way whether putting funds into CHF would be a good idea or not. I would simply say that you must be aware of all the risks. The perculiar problem with currency dealing/speculation/investment is that you have two sides to consider, not just the prospects of CHF but also those of your home currency. Although on the surface it might not appear a great idea, but when I wanted to speculate on currency movement, I found spread betting to be excellant. Why? 1. The prices quoted will be in pounds sterling. (You can speculate pounds per point movement on for example USD/CHF), therefore the relevance of your currency "to bringing profits" home is removed. 2. The rates you receive will be SO much better than you will able to achieve through dealing with a bank. Typically at retail level you will be looking at a 1-5% spread on buying and selling currency, so you can never make money effectively, as you would need to make more than 5% just to break even, very tough on any short term basis. 3. Spread betting is very liquid and you should never have any problems opening or closing trades. 4. There are no admin costs involved in moving money overseas. I do not work for a spread better so please don't think I am saying this for any personal benefit. Its just that spread bettings makes the perfect synthetic trade and is accessible to all. I also see no reason why you couldn't keep a trade open over many months or years. You could also use spread betting to completely hedge a real FX position. For example if you had a some in Euros which you wanted to protect you could do it notionally by doing the equal and opposite trade on a spread bet against GBP. The wife is getting angry so, maybe I will pick up on this tomorrow.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-so Posted August 30, 2005 Share Posted August 30, 2005 I found spread betting to be excellant. Why?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> It is an excellent way to lose your shirt. Do not be fooled by early success - it leads to cockiness and soon they will be on the phone 5 times a day making margin calls! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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