Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Woot

English Spelling 'too Difficult' For Children

Recommended Posts

English spelling 'too difficult' for children

The complexity of the English spelling system is to blame for soaring levels of illiteracy among teenagers, according to a researcher.

What a strange conclusion to draw from the evidence. If the general rules of syntax and grammar have remained fairly constant, yet the levels of illiteracy are 'soaring' then surely there must be further factors involved. However it seems this woman has form and an update of the language is a hobby horse of hers. Nevertheless, surely one should be looking for the others facts involved in the 'soaring levels' in order to find an appropriate solution rather than one that meets one's own preconceptions.

Any linguists on the board with a view?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In many subjects students no longer get marked down for poor grammar or spelling. So there's no motivation to get it right. That's more likely the reason for rising illiteracy, rather than a set of rules that have been fairly constant for decades.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Having been a university academic, there is absolutely no question that exams are getting easier and that school leavers are ever less well equipped. Debating this with my father, his feeling was that it is not that the exams and system is being made intentionally easier. On the contrary, he proposed that those in charge were becoming ever more lazy and they are becoming less capable. The only logical result is that the education system they create, decreases compared to those previous. This then snowballs.

"Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach."

Is this in fact the central dogma of the whole system... and also the key disability?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In many subjects students no longer get marked down for poor grammar or spelling. So there's no motivation to get it right. That's more likely the reason for rising illiteracy, rather than a set of rules that have been fairly constant for decades.

A prescient observation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The complexity has been the same for a very long time. Maybe their teachers are useless, or perhaps the children are thick.

...or maybe it is the researchers that are as thick as pig poopy.

Is amazing what utter bs people come up with. If you think English is bad, try the Chinese writing system, or how about Arabic and its horrendous grammar, missing vowels and changing letters depending on position?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest X-QUORK

I find it hard to take someone seriously if they can't handle such basics as spelling, it really isn't that difficult.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What a strange conclusion ... it seems this woman has form and an update of the language is a hobby horse of hers. Nevertheless, surely one should be looking for the others <nelson> ha ha! </nelson> facts involved in the 'soaring levels' in order to find an appropriate solution rather than one that meets one's own preconceptions.

Any linguists on the board with a view?

IANAL, but.

Heard her on Radio5, bitchslapping the hapless and perfectly 'umble lady presentrix. The poor cow had only tried to get a word in edgeways so the item more closely resembled an "interview", and to stop the ghastly old trout banging on and on about her website addy, and books.

Madame weren't 'avin' none of it. She's some sort of monomaniacal teutonic authoritarian who's obviously fallen foul of our ancient tongue's charmingly wayward orthography. Possibly embarrassed in a professional capacity at some point, and has had it in for us since?

Being a civilised cove, I of course yelled back at the radio "If ye've a problem with English, ya hoor, how the ****** d'ye think ye'd get on with The Gaidhlig !?"

Too hard for children is it b'christ? She wants to take a turn round these boards some time ... :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have carefully scanned this thread for spelling mistakes so that I could quote them and say "Oh, the irony" but unfortunately have to report that there aren't any. Yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have carefully scanned this thread for spelling mistakes so that I could quote them and say "Oh, the irony" but unfortunately have to report that there aren't any. Yet.

So, Dick Nixon is a liar after all?

Check my quote of the OP, line 2, ninth word.

Nothing personal, that's just the sort of guy I am, Dick.

[edit: I can spell OK, but I can't count worth a ****** ...]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Having been a university academic, there is absolutely no question that exams are getting easier and that school leavers are ever less well equipped. Debating this with my father, his feeling was that it is not that the exams and system is being made intentionally easier. On the contrary, he proposed that those in charge were becoming ever more lazy and they are becoming less capable. The only logical result is that the education system they create, decreases compared to those previous. This then snowballs.

"Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach."

Is this in fact the central dogma of the whole system... and also the key disability?

In my view, before going into schools, teachers should spend a year in the 'real world'. That might give them the chance to see that spelling is important, as is grammar. Inability to express yourself properly in English is key to making yourself properly understood.

I find it hard to run 3 miles, can we shorten the mile please?

I find it hard to take someone seriously if they can't handle such basics as spelling, it really isn't that difficult.

:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The complexity has been the same for a very long time. Maybe their teachers are useless, or perhaps the children are thick.

Nope.

I think your view is incorrect.

Really I think the number of illiterate people and or people who have trouble with language is about the same. The difference is that it is significantly more difficult to hide than it was in the past. As people are more exposed to language and the use of language.

Previously army, manual jobs say mining etc required little literacy and would allow people to hide incredibly effectively. Some of my own family in HK are illiterate in Chinese because they worked in factories assembling toys (poorly) which needed no real reading or written skills.

Army for instance people were recruited drilled around a field given rifles and sent off to die in combat overseas. Today they have more equipment and more safety waivers etc to sign and read instructions for therefore they cannot hide in this capacity.

While today to get a manual job you need to sign off safety sheets/time sheets, read new safety bulletins and even in manual jobs you often get pulled into the office to help out with admin or clerical tasks. At ginsters I was sometimes asked to help fill in some of the paperwork. My official job was pie boxer/loader guy. But the manager would sometimes need help filling in admin work so I helped him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest anorthosite

How I despise that (misquoted) aphorism. I'd cheerfully punch George Bernard Shaw in the face for that one.

Some other items from the same source might be popular with HPCers though.

Edit: handy Facebook group.

He who can, does. He who can, but can't be arsed, teaches. He who can't, manages.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Noodle

I find it hard to take someone seriously if they can't handle such basics as spelling, it really isn't that difficult.

Especially with that spell checker I sent you, eh Quorky? ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm freaked out by the number of people on these boards who claim to be coders or whatever you modern kids call it, with 1337 low-level programming skillz who, when asked to clarify their curious runic inscriptions for the benefit of the lower orders of humanity, fall back on that old chestnut "Well 'tis 'cos Oi be dyslexic an' 'at, innit" (The plain implication being that we should both admire their triumph over adversity, and understand that they are in fact undiscovered geniuses with high-function spectrum abilities. Or something like that.)

Sorry chaps. To a dirty old workman like me, it just looks like you're functionally illiterate.

Which begs the question.

How the hang do you get the code right, if you can neither spell, use grammar nor even, it appears, read?

Is there a machine that does that for you?

Or is modern civilisation destined crash and burn at your aphasic hands?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Noodle

I'm freaked out by the number of people on these boards who claim to be coders or whatever you modern kids call it, with 1337 low-level programming skillz who, when asked to clarify their curious runic inscriptions for the benefit of the lower orders of humanity, fall back on that old chestnut "Well 'tis 'cos Oi be dyslexic an' 'at, innit" (The plain implication being that we should both admire their triumph over adversity, and understand that they are in fact undiscovered geniuses with high-function spectrum abilities. Or something like that.)

Sorry chaps. To a dirty old workman like me, it just looks like you're functionally illiterate.

Which begs the question.

How the hang do you get the code right, if you can neither spell, use grammar nor even, it appears, read?

Is there a machine that does that for you?

Or is modern civilisation destined crash and burn at your aphasic hands?

What, you mean like Rain Man?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

English is fracking difficult for many as schools ( some) dont teach the alphabet.

kid next door, when she was 6, could read a bit from some books...but couldnt read the number plate on the car. Her mum said it wasnt a word and therefore she couldnt read it.

they teach the "shape" of the words..

stoopid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Noodle

English is difficult for many as schools as some don't teach the alphabet.

When she was 6, the child next door could read a bit from some books, but couldn't read the number plate on the car. Her mum said it wasn't a word and therefore she couldn't read it.

They [schools] teach the "shape" of the words.

Stupid.

;):P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is that 'text' speak?

dunno, ill ask me mum!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've received a couple of rejection letters after job interviews that looked like they had been written by a ten year old, I've always been half tempted to circle the mistakes in red and send it back but never been arsed.

I'm not fussed about spelling on something like a t'internet forum but piss poor spelling in formal communications grates my cheese. I received a grumpy email from my complete **** of an ex-landlord and it was virtually unreadable, what got me was the twit owned multiple houses, big cars and was essentially a flashy ******* but had the spelling and communication ability of a drunken amoeba.

Since he was being a **** and he wanted a large portion of my money for no reason (which he never got, if I may add) I responded with an email saying that as I found these issues of some importance I would appreciate it if he could do me the common courtesy of sending me a legible, literate email in future rather than something that looked like it had been written after fifteen pints down the pub.

I never got a response to that. <_<

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • 192 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.