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Trainee Pcs To 'work For Free'

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I told you that this is what austerity is really about. Making the least fortunate actual slaves of the usual rentier lot at the top.

It really is a quite disgusting philosophy.

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This is similar to what hilltop was complaining about in the psychiatric profession.

These unpaid extended internships automatically restrict these roles to those people from reasonably affluent backgrounds.

Nobody who has skint parents would consider that route so it is effectively closed to them.

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anything to keep the ponzi alive for the boomers hey?

yes, that is exactly what young PCs working for free is all about.

I can't believe thye're even thinking about this before a pension default or an across the board wage cut,I really can't.The jsutice system will have little integrity left.

its not hard to believe. Its just you libertarians think the world should be fair and than any free market should be fair, and are shocked, shocked when that turns out to be wrong.

the world isn't fair and markets will never be fair or free.

they want to turn the austerity screws now so that the same people who caused the problems can continue to live off the work of everyone else. they should be talking about default, but no, they are talking about making young people who had nothing to do with this mess work for free, and making others work for a pittance.

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We do not need paid full time police officers. Special constables are usually far more intelligent than full time constables and cost very little to employ. I rember when three murderers escaped from a local prison (parkhurst) . They were spotted by a passer by but the wholetime police failed to respond. The were recaptured three days later by an off duty special constable. He was a primary school teacher. Says it all really.

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We do not need paid full time police officers. Special constables are usually far more intelligent than full time constables and cost very little to employ. I rember when three murderers escaped from a local prison (parkhurst) . They were spotted by a passer by but the wholetime police failed to respond. The were recaptured three days later by an off duty special constable. He was a primary school teacher. Says it all really.

One example does not make it the norm.

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We do not need paid full time police officers. Special constables are usually far more intelligent than full time constables and cost very little to employ. I rember when three murderers escaped from a local prison (parkhurst) . They were spotted by a passer by but the wholetime police failed to respond. The were recaptured three days later by an off duty special constable. He was a primary school teacher. Says it all really.

I think we do need full-time plod. Specials are volunteers, and are not paid except expenses! They are howevver trained, and are "proper" constables, unlike PCSOs.

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I thought this thread was about a special offer from Dell.

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One example does not make it the norm.

Please provide a single example that shows the opposite and discredits my post

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I think we do need full-time plod. Specials are volunteers, and are not paid except expenses! They are howevver trained, and are "proper" constables, unlike PCSOs.

Specials are usually on town centre streets on friday and saturday nights. Thats the only time the police ever see any action. The most experienced officers are usually time served specials. Any copper will confirrn that

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This unpaid stuff doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

If short-term money was no object, I think one reasonable way recruit to the police force might be via the equivalent of apprenticeships.

Start 16-year-old school-leavers on, say, £150pw to spend one year in a training school, give them a day release to the local college and maybe a night-class or two, then, increasing their pay by, say, £50 pw each year, for another two or three years working alongside experienced officers in various departments. Perhaps when they're 17 years old, as a bonus teach them to drive and get their driving licenses through the police.

When they're 20, they become proper officers and are assigned to an appropriate department depending upon their choices and aptitudes during their apprenticeships.

Go on -- shoot me down in flames! :)

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Looking at the shape of the average PC around here so long as there's a constant supply of free doughnuts not being paid wont bother them.

And whats with that copper who got shot up north by this Raoul nutcase. He's already got a bravery award. For sitting in his car on the A1, so busy waiting to hassle people for doing 3mph over the speed limit he didnt notice the large man walking towards him with a shotgun.

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I agree entirely,we shoudl default/renegotiate on the detb and the pensions and free this market back up.

of course that means a good portion of existing savings must be destroyed at the same time.

absolutely no way round that one.

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Start 16-year-old school-leavers on, say, £150pw to spend one year in a training school, give them a day release to the local college and maybe a night-class or two, then, increasing their pay by, say, £50 pw each year, for another two or three years working alongside experienced officers in various departments. Perhaps when they're 17 years old, as a bonus teach them to drive and get their driving licenses through the police.

When they're 20, they become proper officers and are assigned to an appropriate department depending upon their choices and aptitudes during their apprenticeships.

Go on -- shoot me down in flames! :)

Currently neighbour's daughter is doing a police starter course at local collge. It's a couple of days a week and she gets EMA of about £30 a week and the course is free.

Would it be so different from a YTS scheme if she had to do some voluntary hours.

I'm pretty certain YTS was paid about 30-40 a week when one of my sisters did one.

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A recent graduate I know spent 6 months this year "interning" (i.e. working for free) at an events organising firm in London with the suggestion that she would be offered a permanent job at the end of it. At the end of the six months she was sacked as there was no money for a salary. The replacement intern is quite possibly already in her desk.

Some people think the young are lazy. Why wouldn't they be? Every price signal in the market is telling them their labour is not required. Unless you are paying down a mortgage, working is little more than a hobby nowadays.

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A recent graduate I know spent 6 months this year "interning" (i.e. working for free) at an events organising firm in London with the suggestion that she would be offered a permanent job at the end of it. At the end of the six months she was sacked as there was no money for a salary. The replacement intern is quite possibly already in her desk.

Some people think the young are lazy. Why wouldn't they be? Every price signal in the market is telling them their labour is not required. Unless you are paying down a mortgage, working is little more than a hobby nowadays.

Not necessarily the plan. I've had a few in like this, though they get paid. If there is a vacancy while they're there and they are good enough then they get it as some have done. They need to get lucky with timing is all.

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Crikey.

I am actually getting really quite seriously concerned about the young. Their futures look so bleak and no one stands up for them. The country is totally sewn up.

I am thinking about whether I should suggest that we develop a "training" scheme at work, maybe for a couple of hours a week, where an interested student could come along and I would teach them how I run my desk and what I do. I wouldn't mind doing a couple of hours unpaid at all if I thought it would help someone to find work later on.

It wouldn't be like an unpaid internship or placement where you do a proper value-added job but just don't get paid, but, instead, more like a "teaching slot". It struck me that when I started work, I didn't know, for example, how to cope with my various inboxes, how to process jobs, tasks and requests, and how to run various projects at the same time in an efficient manner -- and it took me a while before I developed my own system. And I just thought ... well, no one teaches young people this sort of thing, do they? They don't teach them how to go about actually "doing" a job.

Some thing like this wouldn't actually cost my employer any of my paid time because I would do it out of my contract hours, and it would be pretty good PR for our department, and the student wouldn't feel we were taking advantage because he or she wouldn't actually be doing any real work -- they'd just come in for a two hour "lesson" almost.

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I told you that this is what austerity is really about. Making the least fortunate actual slaves of the usual rentier lot at the top.

It really is a quite disgusting philosophy.

Indeed. I have a relative aged 24 - very bright girl with a good degree. She has been working for nothing for a media and communications agency in London for the last 6 months. Just been offered a full time job - 14k.

All one can hope is that youngsters just say 'thanks, but no thanks'

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Not necessarily the plan. I've had a few in like this, though they get paid. If there is a vacancy while they're there and they are good enough then they get it as some have done. They need to get lucky with timing is all.

The key thing here is you still paid them. If an employer (for whatever reason or excuse) won't pay you even a token wage (never mind the going rate) for doing a particular job from day one, it indicates that they have zero intention of doing so in the future. Why would they when there's other fodder queuing up to take your place?

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Indeed. I have a relative aged 24 - very bright girl with a good degree. She has been working for nothing for a media and communications agency in London for the last 6 months. Just been offered a full time job - 14k.

All one can hope is that youngsters just say 'thanks, but no thanks'

In my experience that's exactly what many are doing. I know lots of twentysomethings who have no money but have quit their jobs anyway. Most of the people throughout history who have put themselves through the grinder each day for a bowl of rice and a (rented) roof over their head were called slaves. Somebody who works full time and only makes enough to support themselves today, never mind any dependents or putting something significant aside for retirement, is obviously holding the smelly end of the stick. I think subconsciously many young people know this, though they might find it hard to pinpoint the source of their dissatisfaction.

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In my experience that's exactly what many are doing. I know lots of twentysomethings who have no money but have quit their jobs anyway. Most of the people throughout history who have put themselves through the grinder each day for a bowl of rice and a (rented) roof over their head were called slaves. Somebody who works full time and only makes enough to support themselves today, never mind any dependents or putting something significant aside for retirement, is obviously holding the smelly end of the stick. I think subconsciously many young people know this, though they might find it hard to pinpoint the source of their dissatisfaction.

And what happens when the slaves (a.k.a our own young) revolt?

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IIRC, a recent TV programme on this subject (i.e. unpaid internships) had an employment lawyer stating pretty emphaticically that if the interns were working (as opposed to merely "shadowing" a worker, they were entitled to at least the minimun wage whatever their contract said to the contrary. So the rational response of the internee would seem to be:

1.Do whatever you are asked to the best of your ability; making sure you keep copious notes (quietly!) of what you are doing, and who else would have had to do it if you didn't

2.At the end of your 6 months or whatever ask for a job

3.Job forthcoming - sorted

4.No job - take employer to Industrial Tribunal so at least you get some money out of it and the employer possibly fined

If enough interns did this it would kill the system stone dead.

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yes, that is exactly what young PCs working for free is all about.

its not hard to believe. Its just you libertarians think the world should be fair and than any free market should be fair, and are shocked, shocked when that turns out to be wrong.

the world isn't fair and markets will never be fair or free.

they want to turn the austerity screws now so that the same people who caused the problems can continue to live off the work of everyone else. they should be talking about default, but no, they are talking about making young people who had nothing to do with this mess work for free, and making others work for a pittance.

Presumably sacking one chief constable could pay the normal salary of 20 trainee officers.  Or perhaps an infinite number of work for free pre-trainee coppers.

I know where I'd cut.

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  • 140 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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