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pandabear

Accept Cuts Or We'll Target Pensions, David Cameron Warns Unions

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It should be both.

Patience, the govenment needs to disempower the unions before they go after the unsustainable pensions,

Welcome to the revolution !

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I'm surprised how "nice" the government is being to public sector workers. They could easily impose 5% wage cuts for public sector workers earning more than 30k and 10% less for those earning over 45k. Also reduce maximum pension sizes and limit the time to when they can be claimed. At the moment they just have a freeze, which is quite generous compared to many in the private sector.

Other governments are doing similar things. The public sector workers in the UK still have a good deal in general.

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I'm surprised how "nice" the government is being to public sector workers. They could easily impose 5% wage cuts for public sector workers earning more than 30k and 10% less fr those earning over 45k. Also reduce maximum pension sizes and limit teh time to when they can be claimed.

Other governments are doing similar things. The public sector workers in teh UK still have a good deal in general.

Although I'm with you, personally I would execute 1 in 4 public sector workers and pensioners for treason, think of the immediate saving of wages and pension. But I have to say the boiled frog tactic being currently used will be far more effective at finnishing off the PS for good.

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Pensions are going to have to be tackled.

It's impossible for the problem to be left.

Don't we just need to put in higher employee contributions? And then for the private sector to grow some balls and get their pensions back from the robbing elite that nobbled them away in the first place?

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Don't we just need to put in higher employee contributions? And then for the private sector to grow some balls and get their pensions back from the robbing elite that nobbled them away in the first place?

First - yes

Second point - err, where from, the magic money tree? oh never mind.

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Although I'm with you, personally I would execute 1 in 4 public sector workers and pensioners for treason,

Sopme sort of decimation but it'd be called quadrimation?

Cap PS wages at 80k

Shrink them all in proportion down - and cap pensions at 30k.

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Don't we just need to put in higher employee contributions? And then for the private sector to grow some balls and get their pensions back from the robbing elite that nobbled them away in the first place?

The higher employee contributions paid now will only go to fund the current bunch of retirees. Who's going to pay when it's your turn?

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H-L now think pension contributions might be capped :ph34r:

(not a problem if you have 40 years on high pay, but a pain if you've lived a long time on low pay and are hoping to make up for lost time)

Baring in mind the number of people leaving education with huge debts then if they can afford a house they will be paying out a huge proportion of income on a mortgage it may well be at age 50+ before anyone can afford to pay into a pension. However, I think if a 45k cap is introduced I doubt it is a real problem & will just prevent the super rich from from doing things like placing property as contributions into SIPPS.

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The higher employee contributions paid now will only go to fund the current bunch of retirees. Who's going to pay when it's your turn?

bingo.

I once heard some filthy labour moron on the radio giving this as their explicit reason for importing millions of imigrants. With a completely stable population you could potentially run this kind of scheme. However considering the previous generation (boomers?) have been supporting a smaller generation before them it seems unlikely that the same level of provision can be made for them that they view as fair and normal.

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Camoron is not acting honourably. He has appointed a body to look at the affordability and terms of public sector pensions.

He should not be anticipating what they have to say.

The case for reducing public sector pay by freezing them while inflation is exceeding the Government target is not as clear as Camoron would have us believe. The comparison with the private sector pay must be properly considered . Much of what has been said about cuts in the private sector is anecdotal.

Camoron and Libcon are showing signs of stress and resorting to bullying. The nice Liberals will not take this forever.

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Camoron is not acting honourably. He has appointed a body to look at the affordability and terms of public sector pensions.

He should not be anticipating what they have to say.

The case for reducing public sector pay by freezing them while inflation is exceeding the Government target is not as clear as Camoron would have us believe. The comparison with the private sector pay must be properly considered . Much of what has been said about cuts in the private sector is anecdotal.

Camoron and Libcon are showing signs of stress and resorting to bullying. The nice Liberals will not take this forever.

There is quite a bit of evidence to suggest that many private sector workers have reduced their hours and hence pay to keep their jobs. Many also did take pay freezes and pay cuts. The public sector has without doubt been shielded form pain up until now, through putting unacceptable strain on the private sector. This has to stop, and it looks like this government is at last taking steps in the right direction.

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There is quite a bit of evidence to suggest that many private sector workers have reduced their hours and hence pay to keep their jobs. Many also did take pay freezes and pay cuts. The public sector has without doubt been shielded form pain up until now, through putting unacceptable strain on the private sector. This has to stop, and it looks like this government is at last taking steps in the right direction.

I think they are too. The last government never put much thought into what hard working families actually wanted and indeed if they wanted to pay for it. That train of thought is going to take quite some effort to break.

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Camoron is not acting honourably. He has appointed a body to look at the affordability and terms of public sector pensions.

err - your nasty name-calling shows you are the one without honour

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What a great way to motivate your workforce & increase productivity. If you complain about your pay freeze, we'll also hit your meagre pensions as well.

Still at least they've guaranteed me a £250 pay rise for 2011-12 & 2012-13.

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What a great way to motivate your workforce & increase productivity. If you complain about your pay freeze, we'll also hit your meagre pensions as well.

Still at least they've guaranteed me a £250 pay rise for 2011-12 & 2012-13.

Yep, you're still doing much better than the private sector.

My employer is a very big company. If it were to list on the FTSE tomorrow, it would (I think) come straight in at #2 after Shell. We've had no automatic/cost-of-living payrises at any level from the directors to the cleaners for about 3 years.

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Yep, you're still doing much better than the private sector.

My employer is a very big company. If it were to list on the FTSE tomorrow, it would (I think) come straight in at #2 after Shell. We've had no automatic/cost-of-living payrises at any level from the directors to the cleaners for about 3 years.

I suppose you never had a bonus during the boom either?

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The unions will accept cuts. They always do where I work. There will be much chest beating as the two sides set out their initial positions. Then they will talk and there will be a compromise. Generally where I work the result is no compulsory redundancy but instead a staff reduction scheme through voluntary redundancy (quite popular) and natural wastage. These kind of schemes have taken staffing numbers in my organisation down from approx 20,000 to 12,000 in about 5 years. Pensions will be the same too. I very much doubt the two sides will become entrenched. There will be some compromise. In the 20 years I've been where I am there has only been one short-lived strike.

Generally, my experience is the union recognises the changing needs of the employer and works with it to bring around those changes in the fairest way possible to the remaining workers. If people think unions today are like the early 80s they are reading from the wrong page. That said we could end up back there if unions perceive any cuts to be grossly unfair. I'm not sure the government has the stomach to take them on.

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<br />Pensions are going to have to be tackled.<br /><br />It's impossible for the problem to be left.<br />
<br /><br /><br />

The No.1 "problem" is City Commissions sucked out of Pension funds, which over their 'terms' are taking Trillions of pounds out of them! Nothing is being done about it.

Which is why you get smaller and smaller amounts when 'cashing in' time comes around!

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  • 261 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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