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Sipps Looks Like Being The Trigger

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For the first time in this whole property cycle, there are now strong objections hitting the media to sipps.

I think the government could be in trouble over this one and infact sipps could be the trigger for direct action.People have started to find there voice and sipps is responsible for it.Its hitting every headline on the news channels just now, it realy seems like a step to far.

You can fool some of the people some of the time but you cant fool all the people all the time.

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I must admit as you go through life you become more accepting of how things are - cynical I guess.

But this one really makes my blood boil. A labour government! I really find it hard to believe the labour party's grass roots haven't been up in arms. Maybe they will all be sticking their BTL properties into their SIPPs?

Tony Blair is a hypocrite. A labour prime minisister who is a property speculator. Once upon a time a lamp-post would have beckoned.

Will it make you young guys angry enough to do something - as suggested on other threads? Surely there is only so much sh*t you can take.

You have been priced out of owning your own homes by middle class scumbags who have bought up half the housing stock to rent it to you - forever - and now they are going to get massive tax advantages as well.

I really feel a small riot of some sort is in order.

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I know of a lot of amateur lucky investors who just happened to be in the right place at the right time and do not have one tenth of the knowledge that some of the HPC members have. These same investors are dropping the term "sipps" when the talk about how the market will be saved yet they have not even looked into the scheme enough to realise that Sipps is not for them ( they are the non-tax declaring type landlord who are even dodging basic rates of tax through self employment etc). My point is when truth comes out they will be in for a shock as the government has made no active attempt to debunk the myth in its aim to keep the bandwagon rolling.

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Guest Riser
I know of a lot of amateur lucky investors who just happened to be in the right place at the right time and do not have one tenth of the knowledge that some of the HPC members have. These same investors are dropping the term "sipps" when the talk about how the market will be saved yet they have not even looked into the scheme enough to realise that Sipps is not for them ( they are the non-tax declaring type landlord who are even dodging basic rates of tax through self employment etc). My point is when truth comes out they will be in for a shock as the government has made no active attempt to debunk the myth in its aim to keep the bandwagon rolling.

I was talking to a BTL rellative the other week and she said she was considering moving her properties into a SIPP to take adavntage of the free tax break. She thought the scheme was going to gause another boom in prices next spring.

I pointed out that she would probably have to sell and pay any capital gains she had made on her existing properties before adding them to the SIPP and, once invested, she would be unable to get her money out again. I also told her that she would only be able to purchase further properties by providing 50% of the value from her SIPP and that the property would be owned by the fund managers with their associated fees, and could only be let through a managed agency who again were likely to take 10% of the rent in fees.

She said that couldn't be right otherise what benefit woud it give her and told me she would look into it, I look forward to our next meeting. She is also currently selling a property in Spain, I asked if it was because of the market crashing over there or the gas attacks, she said no, its because it wasn't been used often enough for holidays. B)

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Tax breaks SHOULD favour the rich because they are paying MORE tax in relative and absolute terms to fund a growing bunch of losers

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Tax breaks SHOULD favour the rich because they are paying MORE tax in relative and absolute terms to fund a growing bunch of losers

And the rules of boxing should be revised. After 3 rounds the stronger boxer should be given a machete to finish off his opponent. Its only fair, he's already proven that he deserves it.

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And the rules of boxing should be revised. After 3 rounds the stronger boxer should be given a machete to finish off his opponent. Its only fair, he's already proven that he deserves it.

No, in your world you'd like the stronger boxer to have one hand tied behind his back to give the pathetic loser a chance :o

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Again a dose of Real Politik is required.

We know SIPPS are a bad thing but repeating it endlessly serves no ends.

Labour and every other government had only one aim - stay in power.

If dangling this carrot in front of the housing market can stave off a HPC, or mitigate the effects of one, then its a go-er.

Labours vote depends on home owning middle class (BTL) types.

Saving them from the worst excesses by proping up house prices makes sense in this light.

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SIPPS are the "hook". A hook is needed to make a top in any market. In hindsight, after a top, there will always have been a hook. A hook is the idea or hope that keeps the bulls from selling when they should be selling and draws the last sceptical buyer into the market.

Remember "someone" has to own every single home or house while it goes down in price. Someone has to lose out. Better it be the same bunch of idiots who bought at the top.

Thats how capitalism works. It impoverishes those who lack foresight and enriches those who see better the future. This ensures that the means of production are always controlled by wise people who can plan for the future.

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What happens to the SIPPS property after the death of the investor?

I have been told that, as it is part of a pension, ownership reverst to the state. Is this true?

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What happens to the SIPPS property after the death of the investor?

I have been told that, as it is part of a pension, ownership reverst to the state. Is this true?

Dont think so unless maybe you havent given the name of a beneficiary.

Mine would go to my wife ( this is of course before it is converted to an annuity then it just goes into the pot - however I'm not going to let it get that far :0) ) in the event of my death.

Have to check all tht though.

D :blink:

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I really don't think SIPPS (A Day change next year) are gonna affect property prices.

There is only going to be a very small minority of people that will be able to fund a property by their pension. They amount of loan available is only going to be 50% of the fund value. Some BTL who havent even got a pension think that if they have got 50k in their pension they can get a loan for 50k and buy a property worth 100k. This isn't the case; to be able to get a loan of 50k they will need 100k in their pension fund. there aren't gonna be many people that can afford to get 100k into their pension fund esp when they are used to putiing only 15% deposit down - or sometimes none at all.

The best that the SIPP A DAY argument is going to do is to perhaps keep the scentiment up regarding future house price rises. I think this will all change before Christmas and although the USA has been behind the UK on this one I think scentiment from over there may change quicker than here - especially when the new laws come in forcing consumers to have a repayment vehicle in place for their debt. (What no more interest only mortgages - that will be a killer blow).

Anyway aren't pensions a bad thing (people can already get tax relief on investing in equities).

Edited by lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)

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Guest Time 2 raise Interest Rates

To be honest, I can't see Sipps making that much difference in the near term. Anyone who's got the funds to invest in such pension schemes are clued up enough to know now is not a good time to invest in property. The way I see it, a lot of these people would look into this scheme with great interest and seek the best advice available. There may be a few gullible souls that jump in quick but I feel the majority of the people elligible will hold fire for at least five years or so.

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Most bubbles are fuelled by amatuer, greedy and naive money. SIPPS seems to fulfill this role for the HPC.

Whenever there is a rush into anything, it's always better to head for the exit, and vice versa. Like now, people still don't trust the stock market and think it won't make money whilst property is the 'safe' bet. Oh dear!

On an isuue that was touched by an earlier poster. There is a possibility, albeit slim, that Britain may experience some sort of revoloution from, most probably, the lower orders of society. If it does come to pass it will be bloody as many, like myself, feel that our politicians have been betrayed by politicians since the 60s, with the exception of Maggie. Economic hardship will be the trigger, but immigration is also a factor, as there's no doubting that the government are too far removed from the concerns of the people.

Just in case anyone should scream 'racist', 'Nazi' etc. I should tell you that I'm Jewish myself, and just expressing thoughts which are bubbling underneath the surface outside the metropolitan/liberal elite.

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Tax breaks SHOULD favour the rich because they are paying MORE tax in relative and absolute terms to fund a growing bunch of losers

I disagree.tax breaks should favour those who WORK.full stop.

I trust that all of us when(or if) we voted wanted value for money,so can we all at least be agreed that throwing money at chavs and people who have NO intention of working is wasteful....the buggers should be MADE to work.

I've done what I can to minimise my exposure to this robbery by going self employed,but it ain't fair on the rest of the working population to subsidise these bastards.

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“The Sipp trustee is not just going to let you do your own maintenance, in case something goes wrong and the trustee is sued,” Mr McPhail says. Agents and third-party maintenance will make a hefty dent in your profits. Moreover, such factors make the prospect of putting your principal private residence into a Sipp a great deal less attractive.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/article/...1666787,00.html

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Again a dose of Real Politik is required.

We know SIPPS are a bad thing but repeating it endlessly serves no ends.

Labour and every other government had only one aim - stay in power.

If dangling this carrot in front of the housing market can stave off a HPC, or mitigate the effects of one, then its a go-er.

Labours vote depends on home owning middle class (BTL) types.

Saving them from the worst excesses by proping up house prices makes sense in this light.

True in England...but in Scotland, Labour has to fend off more than the Tories. 8% of its core vote voted for the Scottish Socialist Party last time out. It's never registered in England, but in Scotland, it would take roughly a 10% swing for the majority of MSPs to be pro-independence. Labour faces an election there in 2007. It is in coalition with the Lib-Dems - the protest vote cannot go there. The high oil price makes the SNP's sums add up. Labour will be mid-term in Westminster in 2007. There is a very, very real threat of an SNP majority in 2007. New Labour has always been seen as a necessary evil over the border, and now it is seen as a useless unnecesary evil - and Labour are s**tting it.

If Scotland goes, so does an enormous oil-and-whisky chunk of UK exports. England has a land border with a socialist country. If things are still static by early 2007...watch this space, and prepare for constitutional and economic chaos.

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I disagree.tax breaks should favour those who WORK.full stop.

I trust that all of us when(or if) we voted wanted value for money,so can we all at least be agreed that throwing money at chavs and people who have NO intention of working is wasteful....the buggers should be MADE to work.

I've done what I can to minimise my exposure to this robbery by going self employed,but it ain't fair on the rest of the working population to subsidise these bastards.

First of all, free market govts generally operate with a NAIRU - non-accelerating inflationary rate of unemployment - of about 5%. The thinking is that approaching full employment leads to tighter labour markets so higher wage demands. Glabalisation and flexibility has probably had some effect of this but in principle govts seek to maintain a certain level of unemployment for this reason. Hence there is a good reason for not having everyone work - some people's unemployment is a consequence of govt policy so it's only fair that they get support. If you want everyone working doing things like creating a clean environment (clean hospitals would be a good start) then you'd better forget about "value for money". This is not a personal point, it's just too easy to put forward the sorts of points you're making without noticing that they are inconsistent.

Second, a point not often considered - get everyone in work producing more junk that we don't need and you get more pollution, use of raw materials, oil, global warming, etc etc. This is the profound irony of capitalism that people generally just want to wish away.

To get back to SIPPS - if the govt really believe in a free market then they shouldn't subsidise property in this way, full stop. Why not tax breaks for FTBs to help them build up property assets to fund their retirements?

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  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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