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buzzardo

Guardian - Why Cable Must Stand Firm On Cgt Rise

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The stupid thing is hordes of dumb speculators never make profits, they hold on to their "investments" until the bottom of a crash when no hope is left of ever making a profit. CGT is useless here, the market will take their money.

This will simply discourage the people who want to invest at the bottom when we need it.

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Cable wields exactly ZERO power.

Why all the press about him?

I don't really care whether he wields power, influence, or his doubtless scrawny chopper...

I just think it's great to finally see the MSM coming out, and putting the other side of the story, and we should all be on there placing comments and recommending like-minded comments to get them top of the lists.

As has been said many times over the last couple of days, political researchers in Central Government are all over the MSM comments pages, seeing what "popular opinion" is telling them as well as the more formal lobby groups.

B

PS Thanks to Tennaval for a great find here - I tried to edit my original post to reflect that, but the editor isn't working...

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discourage the people who want to invest at the bottom when we need it.

I don't understand this argument very well.

If I was planning to invest in a business idea, I wouldn't be thinking about the ultimate capital value of the company.. that would be the cream on the cake when you come to sell. I would be much more interested in the huge salary I was going to pay myself as the MD of this hugely profitable business enterprise.

Perhaps you mean it would put people off investing in shares? Would I/my pension fund stop investing in shares because of the CGT.. no, I don't think so. There's a 10k a year allowance anyway which would be enough for most private investors.

Companies investing in shares.. this will hit them, but again, if you are investing for the long term you are going to get most of our return from the dividends.. the only thing it punishes punitively is short term speculation.

Less investment/speculation in housing? Good! perhaps that will help prices return to an affordable level.

What have I missed?

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the market will take their money

The same market with the top investors having off shored their taxable headquarters.

Its just a tax on the wee guys, as per usual, as will the brokers who buy and sell for you.

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I've added a comment and will add more to other Guardian articles that appear over the coming weeks. Indeed it would be good if we targeted all the key national Newspapers.

This really has stirred a hornets nest of feeling across the UK going by the Readers Comments (there are clearly very large numbers of non-HPC'ers adding pro-CGT hike, and anti-BTL comments as well as us HPC'ers). Bankers have gained the status of being the paraih of society - looks like BTL'ers have now visibly gained this status as well. Estate Agents have this status all the time but I wonder if they will end up being targeted for public anger as well at some point?

It is heartening though to see the public engaging with the issues and to see them joining up the dots to see the picture of just how bad boom time house prices are for the economy and hence our lives more generally.

If this was Spain we would be seeing graffiti appearing everywhere expressing anger about BTL'ers, property speculators, boom time house prices, etc and possibly protest marches. Indeed Spain has had such graffiti for a few years now. Here in the UK it does feel as if there is something brewing - it will probably amount to nothing, just heated debates on the web and in the pub and at dinner parties. Interesting times though and as I say, good to see open debate going on in the wider public arena.

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This will simply discourage the people who want to invest at the bottom when we need it.

Then that's even better for the folks that just want a nice place to live.

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First one I've seen in the MSM, supporting the rise.

Some excellent comments on there - just been through and done some recommending myself.

http://www.guardian....pital-gains-tax

Come on folks, the DM aren't posting our comments anymore - let's get over and lobby on the Guardian site instead...

B

A CGT increase will only bring house prices down if announced now, but implemented later, like in April 2011. This will give time for vendors to take their properties to the market, increasing supply, and bringing prices down.

If they implement the rise immediately however, it will have the opposite effect. Many owners will decide to hold on to their properties, and let them instead, reducing supply, and pushing prices up.

.

Edited by Tired of Waiting

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I've posted my comments on there.

Are the MSM using the difference between legitimate business assets and personal investments to distort this issue?

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Then that's even better for the folks that just want a nice place to live.

Landlords are a very important part of the economy and very important for people on low income to find a place to live! Yes we hate idiotic speculators who push prices up to silly levels driven by nothing but greed and narcissism at their own short lived success.

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Taxing property is fine, but levying a 40% tax on profits from stock market investment is wrong, and an incredibly bad idea given the economic climate.

Why do you keep spelling "speculation" as "investment"?

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Why do you keep spelling "speculation" as "investment"?

...investing in companies should be long term and this why tapering would gear and eradicate short term speculators ... :rolleyes:

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Landlords are a very important part of the economy and very important for people on low income to find a place to live! Yes we hate idiotic speculators who push prices up to silly levels driven by nothing but greed and narcissism at their own short lived success.

Don't agree. The poor are looked after by social housing. Those on 'low income' could afford to buy a modest home if prices lower. One of the reasons they were pushed up was surely the BTL 'investors'. Don't know any who see themselves as hosuing providers to the poor!

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Why do you keep spelling "speculation" as "investment"?

Short term speculation is a bet that the rest of the market got a price wrong.

It is a very brave activity indeed!

I am not a speculator, as it is a very high risk activity, and I don't have savings that I can afford to lose - we are just saving for a deposit.

But speculators do a very important job in the economy, adjusting and fine tuning market prices. They are socially useful, despite the negative popular view of it. Those who get it right do get rich. But those who get it wrong lose a lot, and frequently, everything.

( Edit to add: That does not mean I think they shouldn't have to pay CGT. They probably should, as everybody else. But I didn't think properly about that yet. )

Edited by Tired of Waiting

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.....

( Edit to add: That does not mean I think they shouldn't have to pay CGT. They probably should, as everybody else. But I didn't think properly about that yet. )

Fair enough - we agree then :D Perhaps we could have a tax where you pay in advance or after the event. People who speculate as to which horse will win the race will be familiar with this concept.

I wasn't really wanting to discuss the rights and wrongs of speculating, just annoyed that it gets called "investment" and therefore somehow is a public good that shouldn't be taxed.

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  • 150 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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