Mikhail Liebenstein Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Ok, I've absolutely no sympathy for BP or big oil, but contrast the difference in treatment between BP and say Goldman Sachs. Goldman gets its AIG bets paid thanks to a bailout despite having ruined the economy and the lives of many. BP will be hung out to dry and if the oil well keeps leaking as it now looks, then BP could lose tens of Billions not just the Billion originally suggested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supertop Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 But engineering is rather grubby dont you know Much better to wear an expensive suit and toss about with share prices using other peoples money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashinmattress Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Goldman is just as dirty in this environmental catastrophe as BP as they are funding the 'clean-up'. It doesn't matter here, they are all hedging and making money. Media ignores Goldman Sachs’ ties to Corexit dispersant There is a VERY REAL chance of this disaster destroying a major component of the Atlantic food chain. There is going to be a toxic legacy, into the decades and beyond, because of this cowboy policy carried by the majority shareholders in BP. The Gulf of Mexico will see the indigenous fishing industry wiped out, tourism pushed back from the beach resorts, and the wider local economy go straight to hell. Yes, its a shame that its happening in the gulf and to America, but this will be the Yanks only chance to redeem themselves and consider a life no so heavily constrained to petrochemicals and abundant cheap energy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rented Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 There is a VERY REAL chance of this disaster destroying a major component of the Atlantic food chain. Are you talking about the phytoplankton by any chance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pale Rider Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Ok, I've absolutely no sympathy for BP or big oil, but contrast the difference in treatment between BP and say Goldman Sachs. Goldman gets its AIG bets paid thanks to a bailout despite having ruined the economy and the lives of many. BP will be hung out to dry and if the oil well keeps leaking as it now looks, then BP could lose tens of Billions not just the Billion originally suggested. Once BP were a great company to work for, looked after their employees, until Lord Browne got his way. Now they are almost entirely out of Britain.Pulled out of the north sea, sold their british refineries and concentrated on exploration. The refinery I work at was taken over by a highly leveraged outfit called INEOS. Needless to say I withdrew my blessing to the BP business after that. BP's commitment to safety is the minimum required so I am not surprised they leave a trail of bodies and incidents in their wake. They shall reap what they sow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashinmattress Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Are you talking about the phytoplankton by any chance? Every single living thing is being poisoned by the oil leakage and by the dispersant. Here's a short list of fish that are effected: Scamp, greater amberjack, black sea bass, gag, reg barbier, snowy grouper, speckled hind, red snapper, roughtongue bass, red porgy, blue angelfish, blackfin tuna, bank butterflyfish, blackfin snapper, gray snapper, cubbyu, bank se bass, warsaw grouper, porgy, reticluate moray, soapfish, vermilion snapper, yellow tail reeffish, tattler, blue angelfish, grouper, short bigeye, tomate, wrase bass, dwarf goatfish, lizardfish, spotfin butterflyfish, bigeye, doctorfish, damselfish, founder, whitespotted soapfish, almaco jack, blue chromis, sand perch, jacknife fish, squirrelfish, scorpionfish, belted sandfish, puffer, cardinal soldierfish, leopard toadfish, purple reeffish, creole fish, porcup8inefish, moray, lane snapper then there are the crustaceans, the invertebrates, the plankton, the cetaceans, the birds, the insects, mammals, reptiles, you name it Its going to be dire, possible Soylent Green dire for a heck of a lot of folk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Ok, I've absolutely no sympathy for BP or big oil, but contrast the difference in treatment between BP and say Goldman Sachs. Goldman gets its AIG bets paid thanks to a bailout despite having ruined the economy and the lives of many. BP will be hung out to dry and if the oil well keeps leaking as it now looks, then BP could lose tens of Billions not just the Billion originally suggested. Maybe they should have tried buying insurance trather than going the self insurance route, tightwads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Once BP were a great company to work for, looked after their employees, until Lord Browne got his way. Now they are almost entirely out of Britain.Pulled out of the north sea, sold their british refineries and concentrated on exploration. The refinery I work at was taken over by a highly leveraged outfit called INEOS. Yet in the US they are being castigated as "British Petroleum" as if the blown out well is some kind of revenge for the Boston Tea Party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_renting Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 I think another interesting comparison is between BP in the US, and Union Carbide in Bhopal, India. In each case, a large multinational was responsible for a disaster involving a foreign operation using local labour. In each case , the buck stops with the large multinational. In the BP case, US labour operating a rig hired from Switzerland caused the initial disaster. Idications are that both BP and US regulators cut corners. BP has at least accepted responsibility. In Bhopal, Union Carbide was responsible for a leak of methyl isocyanate gas in 1984, killing an estimated 3,700 to 20,000 people and poisoning many more. Union Carbide attempted to escape responsibility and blamed the local operators. The abandoned plant still leaks toxins. The victims were paid paltry compensation. Legal wrangles continued for decades. With the failure of Top Kill I wonder if this is the end of BP, or whether the global insurance industry (read: Lloyds) is about to take a HUGE hit. Anyone here a Lloyds 'name'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crouch Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Ok, I've absolutely no sympathy for BP or big oil, but contrast the difference in treatment between BP and say Goldman Sachs. Goldman gets its AIG bets paid thanks to a bailout despite having ruined the economy and the lives of many. BP will be hung out to dry and if the oil well keeps leaking as it now looks, then BP could lose tens of Billions not just the Billion originally suggested. You sound a little surprised by this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 With the failure of Top Kill I wonder if this is the end of BP, or whether the global insurance industry (read: Lloyds) is about to take a HUGE hit. Anyone here a Lloyds 'name'? Ive got a mate called Tarquin will that do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Pale Rider Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Before this there was the Texas City incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashinmattress Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Now they are almost entirely out of Britain. Almost, except for the Unity platform and Forties pipeline. They make a cut of off every bit of Forties crude as that is the main distribution header for the field, and a lot of the North Sea. Very very lucrative. They sold everything else though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CokeSnortingTory Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Interesting perspective from Dmitry Orlov: http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2010/05/lost-leaders.html I agree with his basic analysis that we are being run by morons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seydel Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 This is shaping up to be the biggest doom event in anyone's living memory. An oil slick of thousands of square miles (plus gases) that thanks to the Gulf Stream will hit Britain and most of Europe. I'm going to buy a small mountain's worth of grub tomorrow 'cause if this plays out the way the mainstream media is desperate not to outline there will be fighting in the supermarket aisles before too much longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Interesting perspective from Dmitry Orlov: http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2010/05/lost-leaders.html I agree with his basic analysis that we are being run by morons. "At some point it becomes clear that there is no oil well—just a large, untidy hole in the sea bottom with hydrocarbons spewing out of it" That's a moronic analysis, the well head and BOP are perfectly intact, and he seems to suggest BP are simply interested in collecting oil simply for the $$$, well that must be some of the most expensively produced oil in history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rented Posted May 30, 2010 Share Posted May 30, 2010 Every single living thing is being poisoned by the oil leakage and by the dispersant. Here's a short list of fish that are effected: Scamp, greater amberjack, black sea bass, gag, reg barbier, snowy grouper, speckled hind, red snapper, roughtongue bass, red porgy, blue angelfish, blackfin tuna, bank butterflyfish, blackfin snapper, gray snapper, cubbyu, bank se bass, warsaw grouper, porgy, reticluate moray, soapfish, vermilion snapper, yellow tail reeffish, tattler, blue angelfish, grouper, short bigeye, tomate, wrase bass, dwarf goatfish, lizardfish, spotfin butterflyfish, bigeye, doctorfish, damselfish, founder, whitespotted soapfish, almaco jack, blue chromis, sand perch, jacknife fish, squirrelfish, scorpionfish, belted sandfish, puffer, cardinal soldierfish, leopard toadfish, purple reeffish, creole fish, porcup8inefish, moray, lane snapper then there are the crustaceans, the invertebrates, the plankton, the cetaceans, the birds, the insects, mammals, reptiles, you name it Its going to be dire, possible Soylent Green dire for a heck of a lot of folk. It's hard conceive of that kind of wholesale damage and poisoning of the wildlife and ecosystems. Then add in hurricanes disturbing the water and it travelling around the world in the gulf stream... I see now that it might continue leaking until August at least (assuming they don't just try and nuke it). Uh oh (I had to look up Soylent Green ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 It's hard conceive of that kind of wholesale damage and poisoning of the wildlife and ecosystems. Then add in hurricanes disturbing the water and it travelling around the world in the gulf stream... I see now that it might continue leaking until August at least (assuming they don't just try and nuke it). Uh oh (I had to look up Soylent Green ) Yeah, because irradiating the gulf would make things so much better I've had quite enough of the armchair generals with two huge SUV's parked outside, the same people who cry like babies when gasoline exceeds $2.50 a gallon. Same goes for a president who drives around in a 20 car motorcade and has a 747 all to himself, then goes into self-righteous rants about the evils of Big Oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayder Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 (edited) i read about this. wasn't the oil spill in the gulf war MUCH bigger than this, yet within a couple years all became normal, fishing resumed etc... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War_oil_spill not to mention that the persian gulf is much narrower than the mexican, meaning that the concentrations were much higher. It was 11M barrels of oil!! shocking stuff. this is puny by comparison. there was also a previous event in the gulf of mexico itself... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ixtoc_I_oil_spill which spilt out 3 million barrels of oil! An average of approximately ten thousand to thirty thousand barrels per day were discharged into the Gulf until it was finally capped on 23 March 1980, nearly 10 months later the BP one, is once again being blown out of proportions! Edited May 31, 2010 by hayder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 i read about this. wasn't the oil spill in the gulf war MUCH bigger than this, yet within a couple years all became normal, fishing resumed etc... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_War_oil_spill not to mention that the persian gulf is much narrower than the mexican, meaning that the concentrations were much higher. It was 11M barrels of oil!! shocking stuff. this is puny by comparison. there was also a previous event in the gulf of mexico itself... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ixtoc_I_oil_spill which spilt out 3 million barrels of oil! An average of approximately ten thousand to thirty thousand barrels per day were discharged into the Gulf until it was finally capped on 23 March 1980, nearly 10 months later the BP one, is once again being blown out of proportions! This is America remember, a litigious nation of spoilt children, fortunately that also means short attention spans, so the sooner BP deal with this the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebenstein Posted May 31, 2010 Author Share Posted May 31, 2010 Yeah, because irradiating the gulf would make things so much better I've had quite enough of the armchair generals with two huge SUV's parked outside, the same people who cry like babies when gasoline exceeds $2.50 a gallon. Same goes for a president who drives around in a 20 car motorcade and has a 747 all to himself, then goes into self-righteous rants about the evils of Big Oil. What we really need is a giant meteor or comet to seal the well, or did the dinosaurs try that one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 I agree with his basic analysis that we are being run by morons. Hardly a ground breaking conclusion We've all know that for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 Didnt they change there name to Beyond Petroleum? Seems quite appropriate now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R K Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 Yet in the US they are being castigated as "British Petroleum" as if the blown out well is some kind of revenge for the Boston Tea Party. Indeed. I wonder who might ultimately benefit from BP being closed out of the Gulf and US waters generally? As ever, cui bono? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyMe Posted May 31, 2010 Share Posted May 31, 2010 What we really need is a giant meteor or comet to seal the well, or did the dinosaurs try that one? What this and the likes of Katrina really show if is there were anything on a monumental scale then basically as an individual you are on your own and in utter denial if you think you can rely on either the state or the corporations that currently exist today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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