Croydon

[gilf]

I currently live in Bromley, Hayes to be exact and have been looking at local prices. Just by chance when looking at places on Rightmove in Orpington and Bromley I opened the area by a few miles which started to include Shirley and to my surprise the closer I got to Croydon the more places I found which were in my budget and more or less what I was looking for.

I have lived most of my life in Eltham, then Sidcup and now Hayes (although spent 3 years down in Ashford in Kent). Croydon seems to have a bit of reputation, however as far as I can tell that is really just a running joke rather than something solid and definable. We went to have a look at a couple of properties and they were exactly what we were looking for decent turn of the century style terrace but with plenty of space in side, good isolation from noise and a decent size garden.

My parents were a little concerned about the prospect of me moving there however that isn't really something I'm too worried about but do want to at least get an idea on what the area is like. I have of course been to Croydon a number of times, but have never lived there and don't really know anybody who has. I have been on UpMyStreet and relative to places I have lived in the past it seems comparable and the the population demographic for the post code suggest it's populated by high income earners (a relative term I'm sure) and highly educated (to degree level) effectively the same as where I live now, Hayes, which while not posh is certainly pleasant.

Also the crime figures stack up relatively well for London and despite the opinion of my parents comes out better in every category on crime when compared to where they live, Eltham (although the better part rather than going towards Kidbrook) which I have always found to be fine in that regard. It is also comparable to where I currently live which is very nice indeed.

What I want is some local opinion on the area, anything would be of use. Let me make it clear that I don't expect it to be perfect which I have no doubt is reflected in the price. The exact area I'm interested in is CR0 6ND so half a mile to the east of East Croydon Station, Addiscombe and Shirley.

I have been on a few visits day and night and from what I can tell it seemed fine to me.

Thanks in advance...

[Eddie_George]

Addiscombe and Shirley are quite nice. No question. It's just the west and north of Croydon that are a little depressing. The town is good for shopping and the transport links to London (Victoria, London Bridge and even St Pancras), Gatwick and Brighton are brilliant. I've lived in worse places that's for sure and the transport links means you can easily escape if need be!

Edited May 24, 2010 by Eddie_George

[gilf]

Addiscombe and Shirley are quite nice. No question. It's just the west and north of Croydon that are a little depressing. The town is good for shopping and the transport links to London (Victoria, London Bridge and even St Pancras), Gatwick and Brighton are brilliant. I've lived in worse places that's for sure and the transport links means you can easily escape if need be!

Thanks Eddie, yes the lesson of living and working in London is that every nice bit is next door to a crap bit. The skill is working out where the line is and keeping the right side of it.

The Transport is a big plus for me, at the moment I work in Wandsworth Common, currently takes and hour and 15, Hayes > Waterloo East > Waterloo > Clapham Common > Wandsworth Common. From East Croydon, which is a 20-30 minute walk away from some of the places we have see it is literally 10 minutes on the train, either direct or a short trip one stop up to Clapham Common and the back again.

Any other opinions....

[gilf]

Addiscombe and Shirley are quite nice. No question. It's just the west and north of Croydon that are a little depressing. The town is good for shopping and the transport links to London (Victoria, London Bridge and even St Pancras), Gatwick and Brighton are brilliant. I've lived in worse places that's for sure and the transport links means you can easily escape if need be!

In terms of the escaping, we are often out somewhere in the country at the weekend doing Archery so not too bothered about what's going on locally. We are not that far from Croydon at the moment and do on occasion pop in to town there.

[Dave Spart]

I lived in Croydon for six months and frankly wouldn't recommend it. (Tavistock Road, East Croydon to be exact).

I felt there was a lot of racial tension in the area and police sirens wail more often that they are silent. The main pedestrianised shopping area was plagued with manic street preachers and there was an 'edge' that made you feel you could be the victim of mugging or intimidation at any time.

The rest of central Croydon is populated with massive dehumanizing 1960's office blocks and Lubyanka-style multi-storey car parks which probably explains why so many people are pi$$ed off.

On the plus side, it's got excellent transport facilities. It has a good tramway system, its just a short train ride to central London and not that far from the the M25 and the two major airports which is great, but that just doesn't make up for the deficiencies.

Discovering the old Croydon Airport was interesting - for an hour or two. There is a giant Chinese takeaway ingredients superstore.

Edited May 24, 2010 by Dave Spart

[Eddie_George]

If you're around Addiscombe "village" you need never go into Croydon town itself. East of the Station (East Croydon) is quite nice to me. You could get the tram to the station, then straight into London. Having said that, I moved to Balham, then to Clapham Junction so there's no comparison (I still work in Croydon). Around here you pay twice the price, but obviously it has more going for it.

I've considered buying in Croydon, but as I'm on this site I know better. I'll make my mind up when the time comes...... For the same price you get a house rather than a flat, it'll depend on what my priorities are at the time. Who knows, I may have had enough of London by then and fancy a place in the country!

[Dave Spart]

gilf - there's a show about archery on the Military History Channel right now if you're not going to watch England v Mexico.

Edited May 24, 2010 by Dave Spart

[plummet expert]

I lived in Croydon for six months and frankly wouldn't recommend it. (Tavistock Road, East Croydon to be exact).

I felt there was a lot of racial tension in the area and police sirens wail more often that they are silent. The main pedestrianised shopping area was plagued with manic street preachers and there was an 'edge' that made you feel you could be the victim of mugging or intimidation at any time.

The rest of central Croydon is populated with massive dehumanizing 1960's office blocks and Lubyanka-style multi-storey car parks which probably explains why so many people are pi$$ed off.

On the plus side, it's got excellent transport facilities. It has a good tramway system, its just a short train ride to central London and not that far from the the M25 and the two major airports which is great, but that just doesn't make up for the deficiencies.

Discovering the old Croydon Airport was interesting - for an hour or two. There is a giant Chinese takeaway ingredients superstore.

Thsi reply is about right. I have family there, but most relatives have moved out. The crime is quite bad. Too many stabbings and shootings and drugs for my liking and they would tell you about it and how it has deteriorated. But the addiscombe side is the better bit and just about walkable to the station. You pays your money and takes your choice. Mine is to wait until the HPC brings the prices down to something near reason.

[Emy74]

I have lived in the area most of my life. I agree with North and West Croydon, Addington etc being the no go areas and the basis of alot of Croydons reputation. Many parts of Shirley are nice. I would say Addiscombe is not as nice. To the South of Croydon Coulsdon some parts of Purley are probably nicer. For me town centre is full of Chavs and a few gangs but nothing more than the average shopping centre in London and it depends what your used to. If you are from the countryside you may be intimidated but if you from a city it going to be not alot difference to what anyone is used.

The rail links are very good to London Bridge and Victoria.

[gilf]

Cant stand Croydon,went there to get some tyres spend an hour in the one way system,all that neck of the woods I dont like,orpington full of pikies,bromley toff wanna bees X5 driving twats,I lived in Sidcup,then bexley then SE London,then moved to Devon,when i go back to visit feel like im in a foreign lawless country

Thanks for all the input so far, much appreciated.

With regards to crime, I have checked the areas where I have been looking and they are not significantly worse than where I live currently and better than where I have lived in the past. I have no doubt the area comes with risks in that regard but I have lived in London pretty much all of my life so it's no serious concern to me.

[abidxxx]

My friend, dismiss everything you have read so far, I am the definitive answer to your question about Croydon. And that is Croydon is the best place in the World and Croydon is the worst place in the World. Let me explain...There is a great shopping centre, with department stores like Allders, House of Fraser, plenty of banks, takeaways, restaurants but if you look anyone in the eye whilst shopping you may get your head split open, recall this is the place where recently two community police officers were attacked and bitten by a mob of delinquents for daring to ask them not to litter the high street. The population is a mixture of white working class, who are a mixture of decent hard working people through to semi-criminal chavs constantly drunk or on drugs. Croydon has record teenage pregnancies, it has lots of police (it needs it). There is a nice park, but its close to Croydon college where students have been raped, risk the park at your peril after dark, even in the daytime its intimidating with gangs of afro-Caribbean youths roaming around. There are miles of subways where behind each turn maybe lurking your next assailant, its impossible to cross roads and trust me no one is going to stop for you at a zebra crossing. The bus drivers will run you down, nobody is stupid enough to cycle around Croydon except the drug pushers who mostly use pavements. It is true Croydon has excellent links into London, but by the time the train gets to East Croydon its standing room only and you still have to stop at Clapham Junction or Norwood Junction where more people will cram on, squashing you up against some unpleasant trout (there are no attractive women in Croydon, Kate Moss was an exception to the rule), making you wish you were never born. There is something edgy and nasty about Croydon, if you are non-white, white people will ignore you or ask if you speak English since it is a common belief that all coloured people are foreigners, (they may be working class chavs but they still like to believe they are better than 'foreigners'). The houses, now that's where Croydon excels, unfortunately only in how BAD houses are here, terrible ugly charmless flat conversions, expensive overpriced pokey houses, new build crap, no gardens, no parking (with the most earnest traffic enforcement in the known universe to boot). The immigration centre for most of London is in Croydon and people come here, register and generally hang around till they get deported. Its rough my friend, really rough. I genuinely believe there are some good solid salt of the earth nice people here, but Croydon is also where a large portion of the scum that can't find anywhere else to leech have ended up and their number is increasing. People are depressed, defensive, miserable and indifferent here. It has every negative aspect of London and not a single positive, not any more. I have not once in my 3 years living here been out and not heard a police siren. I can only advise you of this, there are far far better places than Croydon, seek them out and forget this place, it is a rotting shadow of what once may have been a typical English town turned into a typical rotting English town. The dentists are rubbish the doctors are rubbish, go to a surgery and you're lucky if the doctor turns up, if they do it'll be a locum on a day rate who is filling in and who you will never ever see again. The hospital is rubbish, the schools are really rubbish, as mentioned the roads are rubbish (really rubbish). I lived and worked in Croydon so was 'lucky' enough to mix with the local population. The average local Croydon person lives to get pissed, most x-factor hopefuls come from Croydon, the level of aspiration is to save enough money to have a holiday in Ibiza where they can get 'properly' pissed and be back to work with a 'healthy' tan. There is no real sophistication in Croydon, its a place where you can envision returning to the 70's very easily emphasised by working men's (drinking) clubs, ropey girls in short skirts, white high heels, faces like mutton, pissing in the street, vomit on the pavements, England flags waving from car aerials . Greggs on the high street, drunk beggars asking for 50p for a 'cup of tea'. Come to Croydon, keep your head down, ignore everyone and you'll fit in just fine.

[Potwalloper]

M..

....e.

Did you deliberately delete the paragraphs?

[SHERWICK]

working men's (drinking) clubs, ropey girls in short skirts, white high heels, faces like mutton, pissing in the street, vomit on the pavements, England flags waving from car aerials . Greggs on the high street, drunk beggars asking for 50p for a 'cup of tea'. Come to Croydon, keep your head down, ignore everyone and you'll fit in just fine.

Yeah but to be fair, that describe most of the UK, innit!

[monty1080]

My friend, dismiss everything you have read so far, I am the definitive answer to your question about Croydon. And that is Croydon is the best place in the World and Croydon is the worst place in the World. Let me explain...There is a great shopping centre, with department stores like Allders, House of Fraser, plenty of banks, takeaways, restaurants but if you look anyone in the eye whilst shopping you may get your head split open, recall this is the place where recently two community police officers were attacked and bitten by a mob of delinquents for daring to ask them not to litter the high street. The population is a mixture of white working class, who are a mixture of decent hard working people through to semi-criminal chavs constantly drunk or on drugs. Croydon has record teenage pregnancies, it has lots of police (it needs it). There is a nice park, but its close to Croydon college where students have been raped, risk the park at your peril after dark, even in the daytime its intimidating with gangs of afro-Caribbean youths roaming around. There are miles of subways where behind each turn maybe lurking your next assailant, its impossible to cross roads and trust me no one is going to stop for you at a zebra crossing. The bus drivers will run you down, nobody is stupid enough to cycle around Croydon except the drug pushers who mostly use pavements. It is true Croydon has excellent links into London, but by the time the train gets to East Croydon its standing room only and you still have to stop at Clapham Junction or Norwood Junction where more people will cram on, squashing you up against some unpleasant trout (there are no attractive women in Croydon,  Kate Moss was an exception to the rule), making you wish you were never born. There is something edgy and nasty about Croydon, if you are non-white, white people will ignore you or ask if you speak English since it is a common belief that all coloured people are foreigners, (they may be working class chavs but they still like to believe they are better than 'foreigners'). The houses, now that's where Croydon excels, unfortunately only in how BAD houses are here, terrible ugly charmless flat conversions, expensive overpriced pokey houses, new build crap, no gardens, no parking (with the most earnest traffic enforcement in the known universe to boot). The immigration centre for most of London is in Croydon and people come here, register and generally hang around till they get deported. Its rough my friend, really rough. I genuinely believe there are some good solid salt of the earth nice people here, but Croydon is also where a large portion of the scum that can't find anywhere else to leech have ended up and their number is increasing. People are depressed, defensive, miserable and indifferent here. It has every negative aspect of London and not a single positive, not any more. I have not once in my 3 years living here been out and not heard a police siren. I can only advise you of this, there are far far better places than Croydon, seek them out and forget this place, it is a rotting shadow of what once may have been a typical English town turned into a typical rotting English town. The dentists are rubbish the doctors are rubbish, go to a surgery and you're lucky if the doctor turns up, if they do it'll be a locum on a day rate who is filling in and who you will never ever see again. The hospital is rubbish, the schools are really rubbish, as mentioned the roads are rubbish (really rubbish). I lived and worked in Croydon so was 'lucky' enough to mix with the local population. The average local Croydon person lives to get pissed, most x-factor hopefuls come from Croydon, the level of aspiration is to save enough money to have a holiday in Ibiza where they can get 'properly' pissed and be back to work with a 'healthy' tan. There is no real sophistication in Croydon, its a place where you can envision returning to the 70's very easily emphasised by working men's (drinking) clubs, ropey girls in short skirts, white high heels, faces like mutton, pissing in the street, vomit on the pavements, England flags waving from car aerials . Greggs on the high street, drunk beggars asking for 50p for a 'cup of tea'. Come to Croydon, keep your head down, ignore everyone and you'll fit in just fine.

Such a shame, I was brought up in Purley during the 70s and Croydon was just the place where we went shopping and to the Cinema and also (if we were really lucky) McDonalds in the Whitgift Centre as it was one of the only ones in the UK at the time. Sad to hear it has gone downhill so badly. As I remember it was a Town, so therefore a little rough, we felt slightly superior coming from the more 'exclusive' Purley : )

[gilf]

abidxxx - Thanks for that wonderful insight.

Circumstances have changed and I won't be moving in the short term.

To be honest having grown up on the mean streets of London nothing you said has me particularly worried, but maybe something smaller somewhere else might be for the best.

Thanks to all who took the time to reply.

[Kong]

abidxxx - Thanks for that wonderful insight.

I would take abidxxx’s apocalyptic rabble with a large pinch of salt and frankly am surprised that you would take something written in such a tone at face value so I am assuming irony in this statement.

Croydon is very large area - poorer and urban to the north and west, and more open, leafy and suburban to the south and east. Like ANY borough in Greater London some of the suburbs have social problems but to single Croydon out as being worse than any other is without foundation.

I live in Croydon (Addiscombe) with my wife and it is a nice place to live. Lower Addiscombe road may lack trendy bars and restaurants but it has a good butcher, green grocer and fishmonger. There is certainly nothing “edgy and nasty” about where I live - leafy and neighbourly perhaps a bit suburban for some (perhaps for me a few years ago).

I am from London and have lived in more ‘desirable’ areas in the past but I am more than happy with the trade off of a fantastic large house that we couldn’t afford in other areas.

[skomer]

I would take abidxxx’s apocalyptic rabble with a large pinch of salt and frankly am surprised that you would take something written in such a tone at face value so I am assuming irony in this statement.

Croydon is very large area - poorer and urban to the north and west, and more open, leafy and suburban to the south and east. Like ANY borough in Greater London some of the suburbs have social problems but to single Croydon out as being worse than any other is without foundation.

I live in Croydon (Addiscombe) with my wife and it is a nice place to live. Lower Addiscombe road may lack trendy bars and restaurants but it has a good butcher, green grocer and fishmonger. There is certainly nothing “edgy and nasty” about where I live - leafy and neighbourly perhaps a bit suburban for some (perhaps for me a few years ago).

I am from London and have lived in more ‘desirable’ areas in the past but I am more than happy with the trade off of a fantastic large house that we couldn’t afford in other areas.

I disagree, Addington Village is a pleasant enough place, but abidxxx's views reflect my own observations too. I have known Croydon for a long time and over that period it has been one of decline without exception - its no wonder people there are disillusioned and have hard attitudes. Worsening crime rates, worse employment prospects unless you count out of town retail and the Home Office, LA schools a bit ropey, poor planning decisions. The only bright spots are the transport connections to get you somewhere else and the leafier outer suburbs like Sanderstead, Shirley, Selsdon, Riddlesdown and some (but not all) of the Purley area.

If you compare serious crimes (figures from upmystreet.com) between say Sutton and Croydon you can see that it is alot worse. Violence against the person 20.5 (UK average 15.0) in Sutton its 14.3, sexual offences 1.2 (UK average 0.9) in Sutton its 1.0, Robbery 4.0 (UK average 1.0) in Sutton 1.9 etc etc

So robbery is 4x UK average, Serious Crimes 36% higher than UK average and this is an area that still likes to think its a leafy outer suburb

[Kong]

I disagree, Addington Village is a pleasant enough place, but abidxxx's views reflect my own observations too. I have known Croydon for a long time and over that period it has been one of decline without exception - its no wonder people there are disillusioned and have hard attitudes. Worsening crime rates, worse employment prospects unless you count out of town retail and the Home Office, LA schools a bit ropey, poor planning decisions. The only bright spots are the transport connections to get you somewhere else and the leafier outer suburbs like Sanderstead, Shirley, Selsdon, Riddlesdown and some (but not all) of the Purley area.

If you compare serious crimes (figures from upmystreet.com) between say Sutton and Croydon you can see that it is alot worse. Violence against the person 20.5 (UK average 15.0) in Sutton its 14.3, sexual offences 1.2 (UK average 0.9) in Sutton its 1.0, Robbery 4.0 (UK average 1.0) in Sutton 1.9 etc etc

So robbery is 4x UK average, Serious Crimes 36% higher than UK average and this is an area that still likes to think its a leafy outer suburb

Talk about manipulating statistics! If you want to go down the futile route of comparing crime statistics let’s take your example of 'Violence against the person', 'Robbery offences' and 'sexual offenses' (per 1,000 population) respectively for the following London boroughs:

Croydon (20.5), (4.1), (1.2)

Ealing (25.0), (4.4), (1)

Lambeth (28.6), (8.0), (1.8)

Hammersmith and Fulham (28.6), (3.9), (1.3)

Southwark (32.6), (7.2), (1.5)

Croydon is not without its problems but statistically does not suffer worse crime rates than other COMPARABLE boroughs. It really depends on which part of Croydon we are talking about - it is a large place.

[gilf]

I would take abidxxx’s apocalyptic rabble with a large pinch of salt and frankly am surprised that you would take something written in such a tone at face value so I am assuming irony in this statement.

It seems you took my reply at face value too....

I compared the crime statistics with where I live now and where I grew up, they were on the whole comparable. As you say and I totally agree no point comparing National figures with an individual place in London, it's a totally different kettle of fish.

[Executive Sadman]

Im not looking to live in croydon but scanning the auctions saw this, on the edge of Croydon opposite fields - detached £155k

Surprised it didnt sell - yes its a converted garage with no garden, but its in London.

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-16131897.html?premiumA=true

[Rozza]

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23851904-croydon-disgust-at-poster-boy-policemans-jeremy-kyle-slur.do

Go Jeremy Kyle

[abcd]

Lived in croydon 15 years.

Advantages: superb shopping centre and transport hub and TRAINS ALL NIGHT FROM VICTORIA as on the Gatwick line.

However if you are looking for a vibrant cafe culture it is not here . At night the centre has a few bars, pubs and night clubs mainly for the under 25's. all the good restaurants are a mile down the Brighton road in South Croydon.

I find it very safe always a quick police response to even the most minor incident.

To be honest I would rather live in Central London but who can afford the prices !!

[abcd]

Lived in croydon 15 years.

Advantages: superb shopping centre and transport hub and TRAINS ALL NIGHT FROM VICTORIA as on the Gatwick line.

However if you are looking for a vibrant cafe culture it is not here . At night the centre has a few bars, pubs and night clubs mainly for the under 25's. all the good restaurants are a mile down the Brighton road in South Croydon.

I find it very safe always a quick police response to even the most minor incident.

To be honest I would rather live in Central London but who can afford the prices !!

[Orbital]

I moved from Kingston to Croydon in 2002 and left in 2009.

I lived in Purley which was very practical but lacked easy acces to a good park. CR is much cheaper than KT but to be honest I didn't notice much difference in feel. Croydon town center is perhaps a little more "sinister" but it isn't that different to any other London center. I now live between the two and regulary shop in Croydon over Kingston.

The transport links and house affordability were the main draws. When I bought in 2005 many on here thought I was mental in the head but I afforded a nice 3 bed house on a starter graduate wage and lived very comfortably.

I eventually moved as I was not impressed by the local parks and schools and family was next on the agenda... I moved somewhere that seemed to offer more to a young family. But I maintain the area is great for 20-30 somethings who want easy access to the green space of Surrey, 24 hour trains into London and even the coast. I lived in a safe tree lined street, never saw any trouble, and sold my house in 24hrs, for a profit, when I left.

Your experience may vary !

[skomer]

abidxxx - Thanks for that wonderful insight.

Thanks abidxxx - just read your comments again after this weeks sad events Very prescient