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The Biggest Pfi In History!

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MINISTERS are planning a far-ranging sale of assets and are considering a radical proposal to privatise the roads network.

Phil Hammond, the transport secretary, is understood to be considering a proposal by NM Rothschild, the investment bank, to sell motorways and trunk roads to private contractors.

Rothschild, that says it all... :ph34r:

Goldman is nothing compared to them...

NM Rothschild, the architect of several privatisations, presented plans to all three main parties last autumn.

Proof again that banksters don't care what colour the government is, they'll make money with anyone.

Edited by wise_eagle

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it's not PFI

will you ever learn to read?

edit: replied to wrong post

Edited by Si1

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Why are you replying to me? Did I say anything about PFI?

whoops sorry - replied to wrong post...silly me

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This isn't PFI in as much as the roads already exist. But it's damned close to it. Selling/leasing already built roads to companies who have to maintain the roads and in return get revenue from the government based on traffic levels.

The only good point is that the road users wouldn't be directly charged for using the roads (of course, they would be indirectly charged via general taxation used to pay the companies who buy the roads).

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This isn't PFI in as much as the roads already exist. But it's damned close to it. Selling/leasing already built roads to companies who have to maintain the roads and in return get revenue from the government based on traffic levels.

The only good point is that the road users wouldn't be directly charged for using the roads (of course, they would be indirectly charged via general taxation used to pay the companies who buy the roads).

I think there are maybe 3 financial benefits to the country:

(1) get a load of cash right now for selling them, when it is sorely needed

(2) offload public sector pay and pension problems, or rather get rid of a near-future headache in one fell swoop

(3) debatable - they will be run more efficiently for less govt money in future

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I think there are maybe 3 financial benefits to the country:

(1) get a load of cash right now for selling them, when it is sorely needed

(2) offload public sector pay and pension problems, or rather get rid of a near-future headache in one fell swoop

(3) debatable - they will be run more efficiently for less govt money in future

If a Rothschild gets their hands on them I can assure you I will be making daily midnight raids with my jackhammer.

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Could be disastrous to the operating companies if the oil price significantly rises and traffic plummets.

(which is what I'm expecting).

Oh I dunno - a bit of commercial ingenuity

if everyone starts driving small electric cars instead then roadside charging stations could become lucrative, overhead trolley-bus wires to power duel-powered electric lorries and coaches, that sort of stuff.

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Oh I dunno - a bit of commercial ingenuity

if everyone starts driving small electric cars instead then roadside charging stations could become lucrative, overhead trolley-bus wires to power duel-powered electric lorries and coaches, that sort of stuff.

It's a bit of a gamble, though.....

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We need to do something, the roads are a bit of a ticking time bomb as regards future investment and so on. I'm not sure this is the something we should be doing but the future projections are not very comforting.

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We need to do something, the roads are a bit of a ticking time bomb as regards future investment and so on. I'm not sure this is the something we should be doing but the future projections are not very comforting.

how do you mean? in terms of traffic numbers? I agree with CST - oil price should lower car use

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This isn't PFI in as much as the roads already exist. But it's damned close to it. Selling/leasing already built roads to companies who have to maintain the roads and in return get revenue from the government based on traffic levels.

The only good point is that the road users wouldn't be directly charged for using the roads (of course, they would be indirectly charged via general taxation used to pay the companies who buy the roads).

That would have been the one saving-grace for the scheme IMO; if you're intent on reducing the deficit why keep the taxpayer on the hook?

Another possible upside is that it could transform motorway funding into a counter-cyclical cost: times get hard -> traffic volumes fall -> payments reduce.

As for things like unfunded pension liabilities, I expect they will be kept on the state's books.

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For investors (or gamblers, as I like to call them).

well that's up to them, the Rothschilds (etc) sounmd like they have a pretty diverse porfolio...

wasn't it one of them that said 'the time to invest is when blood is flowing in the streets' - seems pretty apt that they are now investing in the very streets...

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I think there are maybe 3 financial benefits to the country:

(1) get a load of cash right now for selling them, when it is sorely needed

This is effectively just a loan, lump sum now that must be repaid later in instalments.

(2) offload public sector pay and pension problems, or rather get rid of a near-future headache in one fell swoop

Eh? Do you think the people who maintain the roads are public sector employees? AFAIK all road maintenance is already subcontracted out to various private companies.

(3) debatable - they will be run more efficiently for less govt money in future

Perhaps. It may also mean that busy roads (M25, M1, etc) get much better maintenance than they do now, at the expense of the less well used ones.

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This is effectively just a loan, lump sum now that must be repaid later in instalments.

so it is only worth if if they operate the roads for less

Eh? Do you think the people who maintain the roads are public sector employees? AFAIK all road maintenance is already subcontracted out to various private companies.

I'm thinking of the legions of planers and administrators in the highways agency, county and town councils etc

Perhaps. It may also mean that busy roads (M25, M1, etc) get much better maintenance than they do now, at the expense of the less well used ones.

not sure I understand this - I would have thought they do already, as wear and tear is, I would guess, proportional to physical usage

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This idea has been considered on and off for 30 years. I did some work for the DoT in 1978 and it was being considered then.

TBH, I don't see the problem with it, provided that the contractual terms are properly in place. The problem with most PFI schemes is that:

(a) they are build AND operate, all the risk is in the build and if that progresses to plan, the contract for operation looks very overpriced.

(B) once in operation there is no competition for "modifications" so the "winning" operator can (and usually does) charge what they like.

This is different, as firstly the network is built so it will be "operate" only and it is theoretically possible to write the contract so that all "new" roads are built under a competitive tender outside the terms of this scheme. Presumably the contract will be for the return of the roads to HMG in a fully maintained state at the end of the contract

If this is a way of getting 100 billion off the nation debt in return for, say, 8 billion a year in annual operating expense over 25 or 30 years, it looks a good deal. Whether that's possible or not I have no idea.

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  • 145 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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