Moneybox On Cgt

[flatnose]

Interesting listening: 1:40 mins in

Moneybox player

National LL's Association interviewed.

[flatnose]

Duplicate post ....oooops!

Edited May 15, 2010 by flatnose

[@contradevian]

Interesting listening: 1:40 mins in

Moneybox player

National LL's Association interviewed.

Quick summary before my life ends and "can't be arsed listening?"

[Executive Sadman]

More taxes on malinvestment in non productive, non exporting, non job creating sector of the economy. How shocking.

[winkie]

More taxes on malinvestment in non productive, non exporting, non job creating sector of the economy. How shocking.

Free money should be taxed....so that the workers that earn less than £10k can benefit.

[geezer466]

2nd home owners and other vested interests whinging about the impact the potential Capital Gains Tax increase will have on their windfall property gains.

I think they have trouble getting their heads around the fact CAPITAL GAIN and the fact it will be taxed.

Quite an interesting segment actually the presenter linked HPI and the BTL market.

Some will shite themselves if the 40% rate which is being mooted comes in..

[@contradevian]

2nd home owners and other vested interests whinging about the impact the potential Capital Gains Tax increase will have on their windfall property gains.

I think they have trouble getting their heads around the fact CAPITAL GAIN and the fact it will be taxed.

Quite an interesting segment actually the presenter linked HPI and the BTL market.

Some will shite themselves if the 40% rate which is being mooted comes in..

Not new. Previous Labour Governments used to punish what was known as "unearned income."

[munro]

Not new. Previous Labour Governments used to punish what was known as "unearned income."

Dreadful idea. You slave away, pay your taxes, then pay through the nose to prop up a bunch of trustafarians whose ancestors snaffled all the land. We should all know our places in the neo-feudalism. Heaven forbid we should tax those who don't have to work for a living.

[cashinmattress]

BTL flippers...

They probably feel as secure as a guy walking through a wolf infested woodland with a lamb shank tied around his neck.

That's the problem with property 'wealth'. One cannot simply hide it or offshore it. It IS shackled to you.

[winkie]

Dreadful idea. You slave away, pay your taxes, then pay through the nose to prop up a bunch of trustafarians whose ancestors snaffled all the land. We should all know our places in the neo-feudalism. Heaven forbid we should tax those who don't have to work for a living.

You don't get 'owt for nowt'.....although some think they can.

[plummet expert]

These BTL folk should be pleased if there are any 'gains' to whine about. The fact is the CGT regime only very recently became an 18% jamboree. Before that there were numerous reliefs involved ANYWAY. Most of them were bought then and not in the last 2 years I expect.

I don't really blame the BTL brigade completely. Its the Govt's fault that credit became so lax, that interest rates fell so low, that interest only mortgages on high LTV were being dished out without even checking somone was working. Weak humans seeing this 'opportunity' went in blind to the future, when any sensible govt would have known the wider picture should have prevented it. The govt even designated certain places as ripe for growth and encouraged a vast building programme which could not be absorbed by local demand. Guess who bought all these superfluous places in areas like Manchester and Leeds- Btl piled in like lemmings only to find the rents were lower than the valuers said and the valuations were often quite inflated.

The other wheeze which was most unfair on taxpayers and was stopped by the last Labour budget, was the reliefs applying to a holiday property. The fact that previously you could deduct the 'loss' made on the lack of rent being unable to pay the mortgage against your own earned income tax was disgraceful. I cannot think why a person able to buy a holiday home should have it sudsidised by other tax payers.Hopefully the Coalition will not now alter this new Labour policy - about the only thing they did right in my view.

[flatnose]

Quick summary before my life ends and "can't be arsed listening?"

Have you always lacked social skills or do you practice ignorance? Do you expect 5 star service all the time? Is the word "please" or the phrases "could you just..." "would you mind in future..." in your vocabulary. Do you always spit out your dummy and demand others to do the work for you because your life is too short and you "...can't be arsed"?

Edited May 15, 2010 by flatnose

[Stars]

You don't get 'owt for nowt'.....

True - but you can make sure somebody else pays for the benefit you receive . A glass case example being the owners of real estate passively collecting capital gains, while making other people pay to provide the services which cause those capital gains.

Edited May 15, 2010 by Stars

[@contradevian]

Have you always lacked social skills or do you practice ignorance? Do you expect 5 star service all the time? Is the word "please" or the phrases "could you just..." "would you mind in future..." in your vocabulary. Do you always spit out your dummy and demand others to do the work for you because your life is too short and you "...can't be arsed"?

Prat. Thanks for your off topic contribution though.

[blobby o mr blobby]

Overheard a man in the local chinese complaining bitterly about the proposed increase in capital gains. He owned 5 properties and said he was going to try and offload them before the new tax kicks in...

[EmpiricalBear]

I heard that live. And boy, did I enjoy it!

If it actually happens, I'll be able to look out of my cave for the first time in months.

[headmelter]

Overheard a man in the local chinese complaining bitterly about the proposed increase in capital gains. He owned 5 properties and said he was going to try and offload them before the new tax kicks in...

I hope you wished him good luck with that.

[porca misèria]

Overheard a man in the local chinese complaining bitterly about the proposed increase in capital gains. He owned 5 properties and said he was going to try and offload them before the new tax kicks in...

I expect there's a lucrative little line for lawyers, setting up a new legal entity for a client. The new entity buys the client's portfolio at the most favourable possible price, crystallising any capital gains at current tax rates. Anyone big enough might register their legal entity offshore, too

[The Masked Tulip]

I feel that we all should write to/email Vince Cable asking him to hold his resolve over taxing second homes and BTLs.

Edited May 15, 2010 by The Masked Tulip

[Stars]

I expect there's a lucrative little line for lawyers, setting up a new legal entity for a client. The new entity buys the client's portfolio at the most favourable possible price, crystallising any capital gains at current tax rates. Anyone big enough might register their legal entity offshore, too

Whether this would work would depend on the precise nature of the liability for CGT (which i don't know). Even an offshore entity cannot sell UK real estate independently of the jurisdiction of the UK government.

Edited May 15, 2010 by Stars

[kingsgate]

I don't get why so many are so bothered .... it hasn't been 18% flat rate for more than a few years has it?

Before that, it was always at a person's highest tax rate, although you could offset a set amount each year deemed to be the general inflation rate.

You only pay tax on any "profit" so for those who bought at the peak of the boom, they probably won't make any or hardly any profit anyway!

It isn't as if this is some long-standing tax regime that is suddenly being changed, that would kind of justify people's moaning.

Until 3 or 4 years ago, it was 40% for most people wealthy enough to own multiple properties (i.e. they were paying tax at 40%, so the CGT would be at that rate also).

[munro]

I don't get why so many are so bothered .... it hasn't been 18% flat rate for more than a few years has it?

Before that, it was always at a person's highest tax rate, although you could offset a set amount each year deemed to be the general inflation rate.

You only pay tax on any "profit" so for those who bought at the peak of the boom, they probably won't make any or hardly any profit anyway!

It isn't as if this is some long-standing tax regime that is suddenly being changed, that would kind of justify people's moaning.

Until 3 or 4 years ago, it was 40% for most people wealthy enough to own multiple properties (i.e. they were paying tax at 40%, so the CGT would be at that rate also).

True. People are unbelievably stupid about tax. I'd call it "aspirational tax"; intense whining about the awfulness of a tax when the truth is that if you ever get into the position that you have to pay it, you should be bl**dy grateful. Like the idiots moaning about Labour's tax rates in the late 70s; 83% top rate on earned income, 98% on unearned income. You had to earn shedloads to pay those tax rates; anyone earning enough to pay them was doing fantastically well.

[porca misèria]

True. People are unbelievably stupid about tax. I'd call it "aspirational tax"; intense whining about the awfulness of a tax when the truth is that if you ever get into the position that you have to pay it, you should be bl**dy grateful. Like the idiots moaning about Labour's tax rates in the late 70s; 83% top rate on earned income, 98% on unearned income. You had to earn shedloads to pay those tax rates; anyone earning enough to pay them was doing fantastically well.

Yep, you had to earn £20k to pay those rates.

Today's 75% top rate hits at a mere £100k, which isn't going to get you more than an average house on a sizeable mortgage (unless perhaps you hit the £100k early in life). The difference now is that honest income is taxed much more, not less, than the spivs.

[right_freds_dead]

Dreadful idea. You slave away, pay your taxes, then pay through the nose to prop up a bunch of trustafarians whose ancestors snaffled all the land. We should all know our places in the neo-feudalism. Heaven forbid we should tax those who don't have to work for a living.

yeah well we should know our places are fixed from the day we are born and what we are born into. i often feel that the wealth bridge cannot be crossed within one generation. the gulf is too big. i had a business and in the end i got a lawyers size wage, but its never going to be enough to cross the wealth bridge. ive since realised i will always be working class scum. no matter how much i earn. if your not born into it, your staying where you are. and here i am.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

More taxes for property-inflatin' BTL parasites and community-destroying second home greedsters?

Bugger that - let's stick VAT on kiddies' clothes.