Tory Tax Rises

[slurms mackenzie]

Sure.

First; define the deficit. It is the total amount owed, which is currently about £840bn.

Ah i see where you're coming from but to me a deficit is not the total amount owed.

[bogbrush]

Ah i see where you're coming from but to me a deficit is not the total amount owed.

OK, we each know what the other means anyway.

[Potwalloper]

No more so than the USA. A lot less so, IMO.

You don't shove all your credit card bills unopened into the drawer in the hall do you? It's amazing how many months you can get away with it....

[carbonoid]

Raising taxes. How socialistic.

[RDW]

used to be, now it`s the Bankrupt B*stards Corporation

I call them the Bunker Broadcasting Corporation, there's no end to the amusement in our house.

[wren]

I call them the Bunker Broadcasting Corporation, there's no end to the amusement in our house.

Auntie Pravda.

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

Raising taxes. How socialistic.

were all socialists now

until the inevitable collapse

[f00]

stating the pretty damned obvious really - tell us something we don't already know.

[dances with sheeple]

I call them the Bunker Broadcasting Corporation, there's no end to the amusement in our house.

...Browns a Barking mad C*unt Corporation.......there really is no end is there?

[Andy D]

1. You can't guarantee anything but due to the nature of our work I think its pretty safe. Labour costs are only a small proportion of total costs and it costs extra time and money to send things from India to this country.

2. True but I doubt a lot of high end wealth creation could find Indians able to do it for $5 a day. People in the City on £250,000 jobs will be at risk from Indians on $25,000 though.

3. I'm afraid so, decling living standards in this country.

I wouldn't outsource anything to India - currently have to deal with the effects of someone deciding to get an internet app built in in India and eighteen months into running it he pain is still the same.

They may be cheaper than the UK but they've less experience take three times as long and ultimately I don't believe the figures stack up e.g. how many customers have become disappointed because of the experience they have with our app and the time it takes to get problems fixed

Andy

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

things can only get better

no cuts here just tax rises

of course increasing the tax rate wont increase the tax take ken you muppet or should that be bankers puppet

Edited January 3, 2010 by lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)

[Guest absolutezero]

I wouldn't outsource anything to India - currently have to deal with the effects of someone deciding to get an internet app built in in India and eighteen months into running it he pain is still the same.

They may be cheaper than the UK but they've less experience take three times as long and ultimately I don't believe the figures stack up e.g. how many customers have become disappointed because of the experience they have with our app and the time it takes to get problems fixed

Andy

Circulate that round your associates.

Seriously.

However:

Part of me wonders how quickly the Indians will figure out how to do things exactly as their Western clients want them. Are they quick learners?

[Oh Dear]

Sure.

First; define the deficit. It is the total amount owed, which is currently about £840bn.

To halve that you would have to repay £420bn, which would be great but not possible right now.

The growth of the deficit is currently running at about £180bn a year, far more than twice the worst numbers ever seen before. It is this number which they mean when they say "halve the deficit". They should tell the truth and say "halve the annual increase in the deficit". They intend to do nothing whatsoever about the actual deficit, but to reduce the pace at which it increases by half in quite a few years, down to a number that is horriffic and obscene by any historical standard.

OK?

For me, this is the absolute definition of a bust corporation.

I was taught at school that; during the boom a country should save money, and spend it on things like infrastructure in the bust , thus evening out the 'boom and bust' cycle. This was obviously completely incorrect. If you are in charge, you should spend all your money (and a bit more) in the boom, and just print what you like in the bust. Simples.

[The Ayatollah Buggeri]

It'll be interesting to watch the opinion polls over the next few days - so far the Tories have dropped back every time that tax rises have been suggested. They still can snatch defeat/hung parliament from the jaws of victory. People have had 13 years of tax rises and "redistribution", I think they are now ready for cuts in preference to further tax rises - at least until the cuts start to affect them and those around them.

Given that something like 70% of the population either work for the public sector or for a private sector employer that derives some or all of its business from the taxpayer through various routes, that makes for quite a lot of the electorate.

The Tories' campaign pitch looks likely to be an 'honesty vs. lies' one, arguing basically that both tax rises and spending cuts are needed to even begin to start balancing UK PLC's books. Brown has already signalled that he's going to challenge this head on, with the emergence of Labour's 'austerity vs. aspiration' slogan today. It will be purely and simply a question of who the electorate believes.

[dances with sheeple]

Given that something like 70% of the population either work for the public sector or for a private sector employer that derives some or all of its business from the taxpayer through various routes, that makes for quite a lot of the electorate.

The Tories' campaign pitch looks likely to be an 'honesty vs. lies' one, arguing basically that both tax rises and spending cuts are needed to even begin to start balancing UK PLC's books. Brown has already signalled that he's going to challenge this head on, with the emergence of Labour's 'austerity vs. aspiration' slogan today. It will be purely and simply a question of who the electorate believes.

Brown is a Tool. Even the sheeple can see through this pish. Aspiration my ****,Perspiration coming out of Clowns forehead more like, this guy sums up the nation of Dum dum`s we have become, it is definately going to end badly (for some)

[geoffk]

christ you must have some fun then

being a gayer and all

that was boring and bitchy maybe nasty?

[cells]

As soon as it becomes more profitable to offshore, then offshore they will. Don't delude yourself.

Why?

Maybe not $5 a day but certainly a lot less than by someone in the West.

what about the infristructure or property laws or corruption or regulations?

Why is no one going to open factories in zimbabwae? Labour cost £1 a day!

Only basic labour intensive manufacturing and services is ofshored and that is often very low profit stuff that we dont want or need. Most other things like say steel manufacturing labour costs are only some 10% of the total cost so the other 90% is what matters more.

Also profit is king, not quantity of stuff. Who do you think benefits most from apple ipods? America and apple selling units for £100 profit each or the chinese factory that puts it together for £1 profit a unit?

[dubsie]

Every reason why not to vote Tory. Why on earth would anyone want to vote for a party that is going to tax you more. Crazy...conservatives are not going to win in the spring.

[cells]

Circulate that round your associates.

Seriously.

However:

Part of me wonders how quickly the Indians will figure out how to do things exactly as their Western clients want them. Are they quick learners?

Average indian wage will be the same as the average european wage in 40 years.

Average chinese wage will be the same as the average european wage in 20 years time.

Only nations with super amounts of natural resources relative to their population size will have higher wages.

Those countries with crap wages will have crap laws so no one will ofshore. ie no one is ofshoring to zimbabwae regardless of labour at £1 a day.

Globalisation is a one time trick that will bring most the world to european standards within a generation or two. The west has hardly suffered and at least some of the easts growth is attributed to globalisation. Maybe a billion humans are better off today compaired to 20 years ago. Globalisation has done more for humanity over the last 20 years than anything else in any other 20 year period.

[cells]

Every reason why not to vote Tory. Why on earth would anyone want to vote for a party that is going to tax you more. Crazy...conservatives are not going to win in the spring.

given the choice between

tax more

borrow more

I would opt for tax more.

I would however perfer cutting spending more than either of the above.

[dubsie]

given the choice between

tax more

borrow more

I would opt for tax more.

I would however perfer cutting spending more than either of the above.

My thoughts are the banks caused this whole mess and they should pay for it. There would be no budget problems if we hadn't have pumped trillions into the money markets and bailed out banks. Why the hell should we stand for spending cuts and tax increases when none of this was our fault.

People need to stand up and fight this.

[dances with sheeple]

My thoughts are the banks caused this whole mess and they should pay for it. There would be no budget problems if we hadn't have pumped trillions into the money markets and bailed out banks. Why the hell should we stand for spending cuts and tax increases when none of this was our fault.

People need to stand up and fight this.

First, stop paying your council tax and your TV licence, just do it now, no one else pays anyway, second, stop eating crisps and being a fat Bas*trd, and whatever you do, don`t watch X-Fartor. Third, stop using credit to fund your life, just pay off or default and switch to cash,lastly if Gordo doesn`t F*uck off take to the streets and demand a recount.

[huw]

That's a subtle one isn't it. I am amazed at the number of people this has fooled. The prevelant atitude is "Oh the debt is not that bad if the gov can half it in four years"

Link?

I thought they were talking about halving the deficit, not the debt (not that I trust them to do that either, but at least it's within the bounds of possibility for a government prepared to take tough action).

UK Government Debt & Deficit

In the financial year 2008/09 the UK recorded a general government deficit of £101.3 billion, which was equivalent to 7.1 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP).

At the end of March 2009 general government debt was £796.9 billion, equivalent to 55.5 per cent of GDP.

Halving the deficit = cutting spending by 50 billion, or raising corresponding revenue.

Halving the debt = paying back 400 billion.

[huw]

My thoughts are the banks caused this whole mess and they should pay for it. There would be no budget problems if we hadn't have pumped trillions into the money markets and bailed out banks. Why the hell should we stand for spending cuts and tax increases when none of this was our fault.

People need to stand up and fight this.

All well and good, but if the banks were solvent we wouldn't be in this mess.

Culpability <> ability to pay.

[huw]

Sure.

First; define the deficit. It is the total amount owed, which is currently about £840bn.

You're confusing the deficit with the total debt.

We could turn the deficit around completely into a surplus, and we'd still have the debt for a very long time.

See the link to the NSO page on this I posted above.