Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum
mad_dan

When The Things You Own, Start To Own You

Recommended Posts

This is not a rant about house prices, but the state of peoples finances

do you see it? everyday I see it

do you hear it? everyday I hear it

A few months back.... conversations over dinner, down the local or coffee with friends

My house is worth £xxxxxx, so I've borrowed against it's equity........

We have a new car

We have the just bought a 42' plasma TV

2 family holidays abroad

a plastic conservatory

B&Q decking in the garden

Now most of these people I know have families and most of them only have a single income as the wife tends to stay at home at look after the kids. Now most of these people are only on a modest income.

I am often quized as to how I earn a lot more money than they do, but I rarely seem to spend it. Now I am not tight by no means, my answer is always - I only buy something if i need it, or really want it, and not because you have one.

I am not interested in a white leather sofa, designer clothes or membership to a golf course etc. I have a nice house, a sports car and holidays etc. just because I don't spent all my weekends buying crap from superstores on credit. Only to spend the following week telling everyone you know how great my life is because you have the latest american style fridge.

now recently I have noticed that these same people have gone a little quiet and don't have much to talk about. Just the odd comment on how much the bills have gone up, they won't be coming out for dinner this week as mr X will be working overtime and they don't have much spare cash at the moment. They probably won't have a holiday this year etc.

Now I can see these people are finding it hard to make ends meet after the last couple of years of spending like theres no tomorrow....well tomorrow is here and now its repayment time.

this is the point when the things you own, start to own you.

When your in negative equity and in debt, everything else in your life gets the volume turned down....

don't be sucked in by credit.

Have a good day people,

Mad_dan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is not a rant about house prices, but the state of peoples finances

do you see it? everyday I see it

do you hear it? everyday I hear it

A few months back.... conversations over dinner, down the local or coffee with friends

My house is worth £xxxxxx, so I've borrowed against it's equity........

We have a new car

We have the just bought a 42' plasma TV

2 family holidays abroad

a plastic conservatory

B&Q decking in the garden

Now most of these people I know have families and most of them only have a single income as the wife tends to stay at home at look after the kids. Now most of these people are only on a modest income.

I am often quized as to how I earn a lot more money than they do, but I rarely seem to spend it. Now I am not tight by no means, my answer is always - I only buy something if i need it, or really want it, and not because you have one.

I am not interested in a white leather sofa, designer clothes or membership to a golf course etc. I have a nice house, a sports car and holidays etc. just because I don't spent all my weekends buying crap from superstores on credit. Only to spend the following week telling everyone you know how great my life is because you have the latest american style fridge.

now recently I have noticed that these same people have gone a little quiet and don't have much to talk about. Just the odd comment on how much the bills have gone up, they won't be coming out for dinner this week as mr X will be working overtime and they don't have much spare cash at the moment. They probably won't have a holiday this year etc.

Now I can see these people are finding it hard to make ends meet after the last couple of years of spending like theres no tomorrow....well tomorrow is here and now its repayment time.

this is the point when the things you own, start to own you.

When your in negative equity and in debt, everything else in your life gets the volume turned down....

don't be sucked in by credit.

Have a good day people,

Mad_dan

right on the money

I refer the Rt Hon poster to my signature - courtesy J Lennon 1966

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

debt is a trap. debt and advertising. the rest is history in the making.

what happened to honest to goodness ideals and a pastoral existance.

where for a hard days graft a man could get 3 squares a day.

people had more respect back then.

before they built this school. and this, fine estate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest absolutezero

Mad_dan who isn't actually mad at all.

People buy crap because they are told to do it. Made to do it by the box in the corner of their living room. Advertising and other propaganda!

The Government continue to feed the box with things you need to buy. It "creates wealth" (allegedly) as money is moved around from you to XYZ company to the directors of XYZ to the tax coffers.

People like Mad_dan, me and most people on here are clever. We tend not believe everything the box tells us. We don't need to buy pretty things because we "must" have them.

I drive a 10 year old car, I don't have flash holidays at over £1000 a pop (I do cheap city breaks with easyjet and the like).

My last big purchase was a projector. I watch a lot of films and found a used one for about £300. I bought it not because my mates have one and not because the box told me, but because I actually wanted one. I'm entitled to the odd luxury. I work and live within my means and save like it's going out of fashion. but it took me a good 2 or 3 months to talk myself into buying it.

Remember AbsoluteZero's first rule of Government:

The Government needs a TV in your living room more than you do.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is a malaise and it's easy to feel sorry for these people. I guess when they reach rock bottom, they'll huddle together to develop some new form of one-upmanship.

I usually follow through subjects of interest with a google search. I came across these.

http://www.originaldissent.com/forums/arch...php/t-6065.html

http://www.buynothingday.co.uk/home.html

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

HPI is not real money for drawing down unless you are moving on through downsizing.

Drawing down money on the 'equity we've made' is like drinking seawater......gives short term thirst relief but increases de-hydration.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I guess when they reach rock bottom, they'll huddle together to develop some new form of one-upmanship.

Indeed. For an awful lot of people today their only source of happiness seems to be in feeling superior to others, rather than in doing what they want to do.

Kind of sad, really.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Government needs a TV in your living room more than you do.

Coincidentally, I just had a call from the tv-licence body (well a firm to whom they’ve outsourced expired licencees).

Caller: Can I speak to X

X: Speaking

Caller: Are you aware that your TV licence expired last month?

X: Yes I am

Caller: Would you like to pay a one-off fee or spread payment over 12 months?

X: I don’t want to pay anything.

Caller: “erm…. do you watch TV?”

X: No I don’t, I stopped watching TV earlier this year.

Caller: “... but you have a TV?

X: No, I don’t have a TV - I gave it away.

Caller: “Do you plan to get another TV?

X: No

Caller: You realise that it is illegal to watch TV without a licence? You will pay a £1000 fine.

X: Yes, I do know that.

Caller: Do you have a PC with a TV card in it?

X: No, I don’t have that. I have already reported that I won't renew my licence.

Caller: Are you the only occupier of this address?

X: Yes I am

Caller: Our field operators will visit this area shortly to check this.

X: You’re welcome

Caller: Thank you for your time.

X: Bye-bye.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Other than a few hours here and there while visiting my parents or girlfriend, I haven't watched TV in a decade. After a few weeks you really don't miss it... and if there are any really good shows worth watching, most are released on DVD eventually.

I agree, though: the government need TV far more than we do. People sit there like sponges sucking up the propaganda that spews out over the airwaves... we'd be far harder to control if they didn't have such an easy way to get their message out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
now recently I have noticed that these same people have gone a little quiet and don't have much to talk about. Just the odd comment on how much the bills have gone up, they won't be coming out for dinner this week as mr X will be working overtime and they don't have much spare cash at the moment. They probably won't have a holiday this year etc.

Now I can see these people are finding it hard to make ends meet after the last couple of years of spending like theres no tomorrow....well tomorrow is here and now its repayment time.

this is the point when the things you own, start to own you.

When your in negative equity and in debt, everything else in your life gets the volume turned down....

don't be sucked in by credit.

Have a good day people,

Mad_dan

We all have to endure a hot, stifling, sticky summer day in order to view a beautiful sunset!

Most people thought the sunshine would last forever just because they wanted it too.

Your post made me think of many friends of mine who are doing just that! Even the trip to the weekly pub quiz has stopped because their too knackered after working such long hours to repay the MEW from 2003.

Mortgage Equity Withdrawl will become a dirty word in the years to come, just like endowment did in the 90s. New legislation will come into place to ensure that financial companies never again call a loan "releasing the cash built up in your home". In the future all loans will be called loans and it will be made very clear that unless you sell 40% of your home to a person or organisation that you are not releasing anything, just getting yourself into more debt to the tune of thousands of pounds on top of your existing mortgage!

Rant over!

:o)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest absolutezero
Coincidentally, I just had a call from the tv-licence body (well a firm to whom they’ve outsourced expired licencees).

Caller: Can I speak to X

X: Speaking

Caller: Are you aware that your TV licence expired last month?

X: Yes I am

Caller: Would you like to pay a one-off fee or spread payment over 12 months?

X: I don’t want to pay anything.

Caller: “erm…. do you watch TV?”

X: No I don’t, I stopped watching TV earlier this year.

Caller: “... but you have a TV?

X: No, I don’t have a TV - I gave it away.

Caller: “Do you plan to get another TV?

X: No

Caller: You realise that it is illegal to watch TV without a licence?  You will pay a £1000 fine.

X: Yes, I do know that.

Caller: Do you have a PC with a TV card in it?

X: No, I don’t have that.  I have already reported that I won't renew my licence.

Caller: Are you the only occupier of this address?

X: Yes I am

Caller: Our field operators will visit this area shortly to check this.

X: You’re welcome

Caller: Thank you for your time.

X: Bye-bye.

I'm surprised they didn't threaten you with TV detector vans (which incidentally are another myth and never existed).

How do they know if you have a TV?

You pay for it with a credit or debit card, the Government know you have a TV and someone, somewhere will chase you for the money for the TV licence because your address has just been logged.

You try buying a new TV in cash. They ask you your name and address. If you refuse to give it then you can't buy the TV.

Welcome to the Brave New World. Your every move is being monitored.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great post, mad_dan. You've hit the nail right on the head. When our possessions start to own us rather than the other way around, then there's no enjoyment to be had from owning them, so what's the point?

Like yourself and a lot of others here I suspect, I usually only ever spend money on something that I REALLY want, and never because everybody else has one - who wants to be just like everybody else?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Other than a few hours here and there while visiting my parents or girlfriend, I haven't watched TV in a decade. After a few weeks you really don't miss it... and if there are any really good shows worth watching, most are released on DVD eventually.

I agree, though: the government need TV far more than we do. People sit there like sponges sucking up the propaganda that spews out over the airwaves... we'd be far harder to control if they didn't have such an easy way to get their message out.

The government love TV.

It's sedation for the masses. Imagine if the population of the UK didn't have something provided to them that makes them sit in a chair for 2+ hours without moving, speaking or even thinking!

God knows what they'd do. It would be like the Matrix when they realise the world is entirely different to the one they believed they lived in! LOL

:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had to re-read the topic from this site and I’ve extracted/edited points of interest.

*******************************************************************

“The enemy we’re fighting is different than the one we’d war gamed against."

–General William Wallace

People like me are part of the problem which is why I’m even on the subject. I could make myself feel better about things by writing glibly about this or that government lie, but that’s really what it accomplishes–making me feel better.

In fact, the whole business of keeping track of media deceptions has become an unusually ridiculous exercise, and one would need a thousand pages a week to even begin to do a decent job of it.

You have to wonder after a while whether this is a good use of my or anyone else’s time, racing to keep track of the unceasing string of sensational headlines.

After a while, it’s simply not dignified to freak out over each of these things individually. The dignified thing to do is to recognize once and for all the essential nature of what we’re up against, and then fight it. Don’t write petitions or make appeals, don’t sing songs, don’t wait for someone up there to change their "minds." Just fight it. And make it hurt.

Wall Street supports this war. How do you think it would react if all 30 percent of the country that opposes the war decided one day to dump all of its stock? CNN and FOX are making a killing waving a flag for the Pentagon. Why not start boycotting their advertisers one at a time until they pull their spots? Does Dell really want that "Dude, you’re getting a Dell" kid to be turned into a symbol of the war machine on college campuses?

Hell, forget about boycotting just Dell. Boycott everything. If even this minority of the population could go a month without over-consuming, it would give corporate America an aneurysm. Just one month of no new cars, no new hoop shoes, no Atlantic records, no Kellogg’s Fruit Harvest, no nothing but the bare minimum.

For years, corporate America and the media have tried to convince us that buying things is a political act, a way of expressing our individuality (Fruitopia instead of flower power, Nikes sold to the tune of "Revolution," peace signs on the walls of Starbucks). Well, let’s call their bluff. Let’s non-participate. Let’s go on consumer strike. Pull a slowdown. We don’t have a lot of choices when it comes to voting for politicians, but when it comes to buying, where our existence is actually necessary, we have a thousand choices a day. It might be the only method we have of making the decision-making class pay attention to our concerns.

Hell, let’s try something, anyway. Because what we’re doing now is just what they expected–nothing.

*****************************************************************

Like Mad_Dan, I’m comfortable. I can sit here and write glibly about those who are going to suffer and feel what? Superior. Yes, that’s what I think it is.

Perhaps I am inferior to those who have the conviction to make a change, those that will make a difference. I certainly don’t see what I can do to make a difference other than agree with the STRs and to protect those that are dear to me. The world can look after itself. But is that the type of world I want my children to live in?

The views and information on sites such as these do motivate. But if only there was a leader who could realize these motivations. Sadly, my apathy makes me conclude that I won’t find anything in the fat and powerful of today. Perhaps I can only hope for the young. That they will rise and have the guts to bear intellectual arms against the sick malaise that is developing globally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm surprised they didn't threaten you with TV detector vans (which incidentally are another myth and never existed).

How do they know if you have a TV?

You pay for it with a credit or debit card, the Government know you have a TV and someone, somewhere will chase you for the money for the TV licence because your address has just been logged.

You try buying a new TV in cash. They ask you your name and address. If you refuse to give it then you can't buy the TV.

Welcome to the Brave New World. Your every move is being monitored.

Apologies in advance to the original poster for going OT....

Perhaps I shouldn't reveal my darker criminal side here but what the hell. I have no TV license but I do have a TV, I don't watch it all that much myself but the gf does quite a bit and I don't think she'd be willing to give it up(I'd happily get rid of it personally). Now I know I'm breaking the law but tbh, I think the law is a joke so I don't really have a problem with this as I find the whole licensing thing to be a complete con and effectively another form of taxation.

Despite the above, obviously I don't want to pay a £1000 fine. In the real world do detector style ppl actually exist? Am I actually going to be paid a visit by a guy in a raincoat whos willing to sit outside monitoring my flat so that he can get his man? The TV licensing ppl have sent me several letters saying I need to get a license and always one for being a bit cheeky I phoned them up and told them I didn't have a TV and they MUST stop sending me letters or I'd report them :P They said ok then, we'll send someone round to verify you don't have TV receiving equipment, do you have a prefered time for the visit? So I said they could come anytime as it makes no difference because I won't be letting them into my place of residence :) I assume I do have the right to refuse entry, so in this case how exactly do they prove I have a TV set?

Am I sailing dangerously close to the edge and risk a nasty fine or are these ppl all mouth and no trousers?

Apologies if I've offended anyone whos pro-licensing :ph34r:

Edited by wtc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What a great thread!

Soooooo me!

I don't have a tv either Liquid and went through a few conversations with the licensing people like you did.

They told me their field operators would be round to check. I told them to bring a telly with them so we could all sit around watching something educational whilst having a cuppa.

It makes me laugh how they insist they want you to put it in writing. I'm presuming this is because folk lie about it so if it goes to court they have evidence. I just asked them with law it came under and they decided I didn't need to write. Still kept sending me reminders for a license though.

When I'm in a home and dribbling, THEN I'll sit and watch the telly. Just think everybody else will be watching repeats and it will all be new to me! Something to look forward to.

All this stuff that people "want" really just gives them a sense of worth and belonging. You watch how they attack you for being outside the norm if you tell them you aren't interested. I'd rather be outside the norm than lead by the nose!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It is a malaise and it's easy to feel sorry for these people.  I guess when they reach rock bottom, they'll huddle together to develop some new form of one-upmanship.

Have people always been so tedious or is it a recent phenomenon?

Pseudo friends, I no longer socialize.

$hitty crap w@nk ******** lifestyles, just pi$$ off rubbish b@stards!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

True wealth is created by social mobility and I not talking about a pub crawl.

In 1997 the man at the end of the street was on 15k pa and is on 16.2k pa

in 2005 however the 40k house is worth 160k. It is all paper wealth people

should be improving their situation using education.

Most folks have not got a clue about finance and that is why they are in this

mess. Easy come easy go.

Edited by E Powell

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm surprised they didn't threaten you with TV detector vans (which incidentally are another myth and never existed). 

How do they know if you have a TV?

You pay for it with a credit or debit card, the Government know you have a TV and someone, somewhere will chase you for the money for the TV licence because your address has just been logged.

You try buying a new TV in cash.  They ask you your name and address.  If you refuse to give it then you can't buy the TV.

Welcome to the Brave New World.  Your every move is being monitored.

Bit OT, but a sign of the times: we had this recently.

I bought a Freeview decoder box online. Within 2 weeks I had a letter from TV Licencing asking me to supply details of any licence valid at my address.

Since my partner's parents already have a licence, I simply circled the part on the front which said something like "The property may already have a licence" and wrote next to it, "I am sure you can work this bit out for yourself".

I then received a letter explaining how the licencing scheme works.

I've since received a slightly more threatening letter saying I risk a fine if I don't have a licence.

I had always thought "innocent until proven guilty", therefore I don't see why it's for me to prove there is a valid licence and simply ignore the letters. I'm waiting for someone to turn up at the door.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest absolutezero
Despite the above, obviously I don't want to pay a £1000 fine. In the real world do detector style ppl actually exist? Am I actually going to be paid a visit by a guy in a raincoat whos willing to sit outside monitoring my flat so that he can get his man? The TV licensing ppl have sent me several letters saying I need to get a license and always one for being a bit cheeky I phoned them up and told them I didn't have a TV and they MUST stop sending me letters or I'd report them :P They said ok then, we'll send someone round to verify you don't have TV receiving equipment, do you have a prefered time for the visit? So I said they could come anytime as it makes no difference because I won't be letting them into my place of residence :) I assume I do have the right to refuse entry, so in this case how exactly do they prove I have a TV set?

Am I sailing dangerously close to the edge and risk a nasty fine or are these ppl all mouth and no trousers?

Apologies if I've offended anyone whos pro-licensing  :ph34r:

Detector people do exist. The equipment for detecting doesn't.

It's a database with each address in the UK. They assume each house has a TV and therefore should have a licence. They then cross out the ones with licences and assume all the others have TVs but aren't paying.

So they won't actually sit there and monitor. They'll just send someone round.

As far as I know you can refuse them access but they can then get a warrant and/or bring the Police with them and gain access. Probably gives you enough time to get rid of the TV.

Not that I would encourage anyone to break the law. You have a TV and should therefore pay for using it.

That's me covered...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Detector people do exist. The equipment for detecting doesn't.

It's a database with each address in the UK. They assume each house has a TV and therefore should have a licence. They then cross out the ones with licences and assume all the others have TVs but aren't paying.

So they won't actually sit there and monitor. They'll just send someone round.

As far as I know you can refuse them access but they can then get a warrant and/or bring the Police with them and gain access. Probably gives you enough time to get rid of the TV.

Not that I would encourage anyone to break the law. You have a TV and should therefore pay for using it.

That's me covered...

Well I don't want to get into an extended argument as to whether the license fee is justifiable. Suffice to say, I feel watching the constant advertisments is the price you pay for the TV, time is more valuable than money and as theres no option to not receive the BBC....

Thanks for the info though :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess the next thing will be to 'streamline the system' by passing a law making television ownership compulsory.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest absolutezero
Well I don't want to get into an extended argument as to whether the license fee is justifiable. Suffice to say, I feel watching the constant advertisments is the price you pay for the TV, time is more valuable than money and as theres no option to not receive the BBC....

Thanks for the info though :)

You're not paying for the BBC when you buy a licence.

If you can't receive BBC but still have a TV you still have to pay.

The licence is for using TV receiving equipment (BBC or not).

By the way, the warrants I mentioned earlier can be got hold of very quickly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You're not paying for the BBC when you buy a licence.

If you can't receive BBC but still have a TV you still have to pay.

The licence is for using TV receiving equipment (BBC or not).

By the way, the warrants I mentioned earlier can be got hold of very quickly.

Just makes me more opposed to the system tbh, whats next? A license to own a kettle?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • 301 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.