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Public Sector Workers Get Pay Rises Twice The Rate Of Private Sector Workers


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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/6327373/Public-sector-workers-get-pay-rises-twice-the-rate-of-private-sector-workers.html

Figures from the Office for National Statistics indicated that public sector workers received a pay rise of 3.4 per cent in the three months to August compared to a pay rise of just 1.5 per cent for employees in the private sector, with the figures excluding bonuses.

It highlights the growing disparity between those working in the public sector, who enjoy generous perks such as gold-plated pensions, and those working in the private sector who have suffered the closure of many final salary pension schemes.

Politicians attacked the Government for giving generous pay rises at a time when prudent spending of taxpayer’s money was required.

Theresa May, shadow work and pensions secretary, said: “This growing disparity between jobs in the public and private sectors is unsustainable.

“It is important to protect frontline services such as doctors and nurses, but its time that Labour recognised they cannot continue to casually spend taxpayers money.

“They need to start exercising some prudence and, for example, start cutting back on the quango gravy train.”

It comes in a week when unemployment jumped to 2.47 million as economists predicted it is now inevitable that the numbers out of work will pass three million, matching the job crises seen in the 1980s and 1990s recessions.

The ONS figures also revealed an increase in the number of people working part-time and a rise in the number of pensioners delaying their retirement.

A record 979,000 individuals between June and August worked less than 30 hours a week because they could not find a full-time job, a rise of 276,000 on a year ago.

And far more pensioners are being forced to work into their retirement to earn extra money to top up their poor performing pensions.

In the three months to August, there were 1.4 million people of pensionable age working, an increased of 77,000 on last year.

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Yeah but we've (public sector) had shit pay rises all through the entire boom whilst the private sector lapped it up.

erm, from where I've stood, this is categorically incorrect, many many private sector jobs have been getting near zero payrises since the early 2000s, whilst public sector people I've known have had inflation plus a couple of percent, hugely more

The ONS reported in about 2003 that median public sector salaries had overtaken private sector ones

And do you really think that the whole private sector drives a Beemer?

Edited by Si1
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Guest absolutezero

Yeah but we've (public sector) had shit pay rises all through the entire boom whilst the private sector lapped it up.

And therein lies the crux of the argument.

The private sector have had great pay rises the last few years whilst the public sector have hovered around 2.5%.

That's except a small number of private sector workers off here who had no rises because they work in an easily outsourced/offshored job.

There were even threads with polls asking what your payrise was. A lot were 7% or above!

Now it's turned sour for them they start to bleat.

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erm, from where I've stood, this is categorically incorrect, many many private sector jobs have been getting near zero payrises since the early 2000s, whilst public sector people I've known have had inflation plus a couple of percenty, hugely more

The ONS reported in about 2003 that median public sector salaries had overtaken private sector ones

And do you really think that the whole private sector gets a BMW company car? eh?

Yes, this. Private sector. No pay rise for the last 5 year, and that means 0% - not even cost of living. In fact, I changed job recently ( to avoid the axe) and took a pay cut.

Yes, we've been lapping it up in the private sector.

Edited by waynezilla
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Yes, this. Private sector. No pay rise for the last 5 year, and that means 0% - not even cost of living. In fact, I changed job recently ( to avoid the axe) and took a pay cut.

Yes, we've been lapping it up in the private sector.

Correct. A lot of you have.

I'd love to dig up those polls but search doesn't work.

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Yeah but we've (public sector) had shit pay rises all through the entire boom whilst the private sector lapped it up.

Now you cry cos your 5 series on credit needs upgrading.

3.4% of not a lot is not a lot.

1.5% of more is likely to be more than the 3.4% for comparable jobs.

OK, you want people to take you on.

Can I (genuinely) ask you

a) what role you do - and what do you see as the equivalent in the private sector that you would be doing - and how much overtime (unpaid) you have to do each week)

b ) how experienced you are/your age

c) what you get paid gross (give or take - a band is near enough), and remember to add in a third on top for your final salary pension if you get one

d) how much you think would a fair wage for your job

e) whether you think you will be able to afford to retire at 55ish and how much pension you think you'll get at that time....

if you can do that, I think you'll be staggered at how much less the people in the private sector get paid for the equivalent job - I do wonder whether you've been brainwashed by your shop stewards......

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erm, from where I've stood, this is categorically incorrect, many many private sector jobs have been getting near zero payrises since the early 2000s, whilst public sector people I've known have had inflation plus a couple of percent, hugely more

The ONS reported in about 2003 that median public sector salaries had overtaken private sector ones

And do you really think that the whole private sector drives a Beemer?

And yet, according to a chap from Unison on R4 this AM, 86% or public sector employees earn below the private sector average.

So there must be a small number of public sector employees earning a fortune while everyone else gets vilified and FA wages.

You only have to look at upper management in the Royal Mail, BBC, NHS hospitals, QUANGOs and other large public sector employers to see who has been raking it in.

£1,000,000 PA + benefits is not unheard of - look at Crozier and Wasshisname at Royal Mail

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This is maybe the situation today, but it won't be tomorrow.

I find it funny though that the PS workers on this board think the private sector have it so easy. Anyhow, its all wind because the PS gravy train will come to a shuddering halt around May 2010 not long now................happy days.

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And yet, according to a chap from Unison on R4 this AM, 86% or public sector employees earn below the private sector average.

So there must be a small number of public sector employees earning a fortune while everyone else gets vilified and FA wages.

You only have to look at upper management in the Royal Mail, BBC, NHS hospitals, QUANGOs and other large public sector employers to see who has been raking it in.

£1,000,000 PA + benefits is not unheard of - look at Crozier and Wasshisname at Royal Mail

Median old boy, median.................

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And yet, according to a chap from Unison on R4 this AM, 86% or public sector employees earn below the private sector average.

that's a startling statistic and I would like to see the precise measure they use

The private sect MEAN is higher - but that is skewed by astronomical 6 and 7 figure super-salaries for a very very few, and even then the 86% figure is amazing compared to other stats I've seen

Anecdotally, certainly in the Northern regions, public sector workers all noticeably far more than private sector ones for similar skills/responsibilities, except for private sector solicitors and very specialist skills, and private sector consultants who work on public sector contracts

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After the Conservative slap down to the self indulgent dreamers (aka most public sector cash cow riders) and the divided response from the public – those who were against it being Public sector workers and those for being those in the private sector, it got me thinking what the next few years are going to be like.

Will we see the start of a new divide in UK society with the poor bastards in the private sector who have already faced up to REALITY with seeing redundancies and pay cuts and freezes getting increasingly frustrated with the only to quick to react unionised public sector who will kick off as soon as the reality of job cuts, wages freezes and cuts kick in.

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Can I (genuinely) ask you

a] what role you do - and what do you see as the equivalent in the private sector that you would be doing - and how much overtime (unpaid) you have to do each week)

b] how experienced you are/your age

c] what you get paid gross (give or take - a band is near enough), and remember to add in a third on top for your final salary pension if you get one

d] how much you think would a fair wage for your job

e] whether you think you will be able to afford to retire at 55ish and how much pension you think you'll get at that time....

I can ghost-answer these questions if you'd like?

a] Hard to define as you need a degree in 1984-style doublespeak to understand what the hell the role actually is. Still opaque even with that level of understanding. Probably relates to photocopying some reports made up specially for a meeting, discussing said reports at meeting, shredding said reports, going back to the start. There is no equivalent in the private sector as any business working on that basis goes bust quite fast. Overtime is any work done between 9am-10am and 4pm+ Mon-Thur, or any time at all on Friday. Paid at triple time.

b] Depends how you define experience. I'm good at photocopying and shredding.

c] More than you can dream in your grimy, reality-linked private sector slavery post. And if you think 30% more of your salary would buy my pension you must be joking. My pension would cost £1million (most people's lifetime earnings) to buy prior to your retirement.

d] Much more than I earn now of course!!! For a detailed thesis of my opinions refer to the BBC, paying competitive pay rates to retain 'talent' and full and complete emigration to La La land.

e] Won't retire at 55 but will instead take extra holiday, extended sabbaticals and transfer across functions until I'm 66 and can begin living a millionare lifestyle.

YOU ALREADY KNOW THESE ANSWERS OR YOU WOULDN'T BE ASKING :)

Edited by JonnyTomes
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that's a startling statistic and I would like to see the precise measure they use

The private sect MEAN is higher - but that is skewed by astronomical 6 and 7 figure super-salaries for a very very few, and even then the 86% figure is amazing compared to other stats I've seen

Anecdotally, certainly in the Northern regions, public sector workers all noticeably far more than private sector ones for similar skills/responsibilities, except for private sector solicitors and very specialist skills, and private sector consultants who work on public sector contracts

course its startling...they makethe figures up for everything else, why not salary comparisons at negotiation time.

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And yet, according to a chap from Unison on R4 this AM, 86% or public sector employees earn below the private sector average.

So there must be a small number of public sector employees earning a fortune while everyone else gets vilified and FA wages.

Or the Unison chap is just picking random figures from the air to support his case. :unsure:

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Increase in private sector earnings (including bonuses, SA) since Jan 2000: 39.3% [ONS series LNKY]

Increase in public sector earnings (including bonuses, SA) since Jan 2000: 45.3% [ONS series LNNJ]

Also, from the 2008 ONS ASHE summary:

The percentage difference between the median level of full-time earnings in the public sector (£523 per week in April 2008) and the private sector (£460 per week) narrowed over the year to April 2008, following annual increases of 4.3 per cent and 4.6 per cent respectively.”

Sounds to me like the Unison guy was playing footloose with statistics.

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OK, you want people to take you on.

Can I (genuinely) ask you

a) what role you do - and what do you see as the equivalent in the private sector that you would be doing - and how much overtime (unpaid) you have to do each week)

b ) how experienced you are/your age

c) what you get paid gross (give or take - a band is near enough), and remember to add in a third on top for your final salary pension if you get one

d) how much you think would a fair wage for your job

e) whether you think you will be able to afford to retire at 55ish and how much pension you think you'll get at that time....

if you can do that, I think you'll be staggered at how much less the people in the private sector get paid for the equivalent job - I do wonder whether you've been brainwashed by your shop stewards......

I thought i join this debate.............

I consider myself well paid for my job in the public sector with a good pension.

I earn approx 93K per year and will have a pension of approx 50k a year by the time I reach 60.

I’m also self employed doing much the same work as I do in public sector, but spending about 25% of the time (40 hrs public, 10 hrs private). I consider myself very well paid for the job I do and the hours I work. My profit after deductions are approx 90k year, of which I put 30k in a private pension.

Each sector has its own advantages and disadvantages-all depends on what you do!

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Each sector has its own advantages and disadvantages-all depends on what you do!

err no, I think that is the entire point of the above debate from the private sector's side, there are no particular compensations right now in most private sector positions

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err no, I think that is the entire point of the above debate from the private sector's side, there are no particular compensations right now in most private sector positions

i dont know...............i can imagine being a banker quite a nice private sector job- i mean you got job security, good pay and even bonuses are now back!

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OK, you want people to take you on.

Can I (genuinely) ask you

a) what role you do - and what do you see as the equivalent in the private sector that you would be doing - and how much overtime (unpaid) you have to do each week)

b ) how experienced you are/your age

c) what you get paid gross (give or take - a band is near enough), and remember to add in a third on top for your final salary pension if you get one

d) how much you think would a fair wage for your job

e) whether you think you will be able to afford to retire at 55ish and how much pension you think you'll get at that time....

if you can do that, I think you'll be staggered at how much less the people in the private sector get paid for the equivalent job - I do wonder whether you've been brainwashed by your shop stewards......

a) can't. I'm too well known in my sector. I get 50k, my private counterparts are 70-80k + bens. I do 12 hour days most days and have a 37.5 contract. All o/t unpaid. I do it because the job needs doing properly. No shite on my watch is my M.O.

B) am late 30's, 10 years in this sector, 5 in another related sector.

c) see a) and yes it does make the numbers up, nearly. Although we all know my pension won't be paid out in it's current form. The numbers don't add up in years to come.

d) if I compare it to my previous sector, I'd say 30k, but I am from a poorly paid sector originally.

e) am gonna retire early 100% cgnao guaranteed. If my health doesn't force me to, then I will as you have but one life and I don't intend to sacrifice it to the gummint.

TFH

PS: My original post was a bit tongue in cheek you do realise?

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i dont know...............i can imagine being a banker quite a nice private sector job- i mean you got job security, good pay and even bonuses are now back!

most people working in banks are on 1 months notice and earn about £25000 per year with a defined contribution pension scheme that might pay out £15k per year if they wait until they are 75

do you instead suppose that 'most private sector workers' are bank executives on 6/7 figure salaries?

Edited by Si1
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most people working in banks are on 1 months notice and earn about £25000 per year with a defined contribution pension scheme that might pay out £15k per year if they wait until they are 75

do you instead suppose that 'most private sector workers' are bank executives on 6/7 figure salaries?

exactly.....................all depends on what you do!

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Or the Unison chap is just picking random figures from the air to support his case. :unsure:

Yes maybe. That is why I was careful to attribute the quote and he wasn't asked to justify the statement by Humphries or contradicted by the other person on the interveiw (cant remember who he was)

It wasn't clear whether he was talking about annual salary or hourly rate and whether pensions, bonuses or other benefits were counted so I took it with a pinch of salt but I'm just stating what was said.

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