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Turnbull2000

Digital Spy Thread - The Benefits System At It's Finest

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In summary...

  • OP loses job, goes on Jobseekers. Jobseeker entitlement expires.
  • Council puts OP and working disabled parter on housing and council tax benefit. Tax credit entitlement is also increased.
  • Benefits stack up to £903 per month, nearly on par with OP's take home pay before job loss of £956. But...
  • Working required travel costs of £100 p/m, actually leaving OP better off on benefits to the tune of £47 p/m
  • OP is now understandably reluctant to seek work as he'll be worse off unless he finds a job that pays more than the last one. He'll also be dragging his **** out of bed each day for little financial gain.

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1132931

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I concur.

The last two people I have worked with, one aged 48 and the other one 28, have been in a similar situation. The 48 year old came off benefits, take home was £12.50 a week more than he was getting on the dole, by the time you factor in lunch and the travelling, well, he had to go on the sick until he was made redundant. He then tried to kill himself. :(

The other one can't/won't take any pay rise, unless it's for over £2,000. Anything less will just eat into his benefits and leave him worse off!

It's a trap that you are born into, Like the affordable housing for the 'poor' citizen earning only £60,000 a year.

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Do you mean the government are producing statistics for the unemployed and that after four months you can no longer qualify to be included in these statistics?

Well that's......that's...... fraud. Isn't it? :lol:

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  • Working required travel costs of £100 p/m, actually leaving OP better off on benefits to the tune of £47 p/m

  • OP is now understandably reluctant to seek work as he'll be worse off unless he finds a job that pays more than the last one. He'll also be dragging his **** out of bed each day for little financial gain.

Of course! There must be millions on lower incomes[1] in that situation. It's precisely where our tax-and-benefits system is at its most destructive. And you didn't even mention dole-perks like free NHS treatment!

Up to 75% marginal tax on high earners is very, very bad. But it pales into insignificance against effective tax rates of 100% or even 200% on low and middle earners.

[1] up to significantly-above-average incomes for those who could qualify for extra benefits - e.g. disabled, or with offspring at university being means-tested.

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p.s. This is nothing new. When my father was seriously ill in the 1970s and was off work for several months, we (his family) were better off. Not only did he save on costs, but he also paid less tax, despite his salary being maintained.

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I call it the trap of the working poor.

Someone goes to work and is allowed to earn about £6,000 tax free , but pays 11% national insurance on this £6,000 n/i just another name for income tax . Any earnings above £6,000 and the government take is 11% n/i and 20% tax.

What a disincentive to work if you are on low salary with a family . The taxes on incomes are far to high at the lower end of earnings.

Surely dropping taxes and letting people keep more of what they earn would pay for itself in reduced dependency on benifits . Also know many couples where the wife would love to give up full time working and look after the children if the husband could keep more of what he earn't. This would free up many jobs for people in households where no one works.

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I call it the trap of the working poor.

Someone goes to work and is allowed to earn about £6,000 tax free , but pays 11% national insurance on this £6,000 n/i just another name for income tax . Any earnings above £6,000 and the government take is 11% n/i and 20% tax.

What a disincentive to work if you are on low salary with a family . The taxes on incomes are far to high at the lower end of earnings.

Surely dropping taxes and letting people keep more of what they earn would pay for itself in reduced dependency on benifits . Also know many couples where the wife would love to give up full time working and look after the children if the husband could keep more of what he earn't. This would free up many jobs for people in households where no one works.

Thank Brown for that. The Libs would hoik millions out of tax altogether.

All these "wealth creating" people have had it easy employing Poles for ****** all.

Its time to pay people proper money for a proper days work Shame the "socialist" Brown didnt manage it.

Shame he managed to tax cleaners more on £10k, pro rata, thatn a bankers bonus.

Vote Lib Dem for a fairer tax system. Maybe then people will decide a job is worth their while again.

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Thank Brown for that. The Libs would hoik millions out of tax altogether.

All these "wealth creating" people have had it easy employing Poles for ****** all.

Its time to pay people proper money for a proper days work Shame the "socialist" Brown didnt manage it.

Shame he managed to tax cleaners more on £10k, pro rata, thatn a bankers bonus.

Vote Lib Dem for a fairer tax system. Maybe then people will decide a job is worth their while again.

100% Agree.

The Tories want to cut inheritance tax for the idle offspring of multi millionaires - something that will benefit only the richest 2% of the population who are already very well off.

The Lib Dems want to cut income tax for those earning £10k or less.

Which party is going to look after ordinary people - rather than their mates in the banks and hedge funds.

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Thank Brown for that. The Libs would hoik millions out of tax altogether.

All these "wealth creating" people have had it easy employing Poles for ****** all.

Its time to pay people proper money for a proper days work Shame the "socialist" Brown didnt manage it.

Shame he managed to tax cleaners more on £10k, pro rata, thatn a bankers bonus.

Vote Lib Dem for a fairer tax system. Maybe then people will decide a job is worth their while again.

I thank brown and thatcher for it. She cut income tax from 33% lower rate the tories left office with it at about 22% ( somthing like that anyway ) but she put up n/i from 6% to 10% , brown increased it to 11% . She also froze personal allowances when inflation was high i.e. increasing the tax take by fiscal drag.

About time having two taxes on income was scrapped and just one tax introduced , that could be leved on a sliding scale the lower earners keeping enough to make working worthwhile.

Judging by what I heard from the Lib Dem conference last week , I don't think they will sort anything out to be honest.

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100% Agree.

The Tories want to cut inheritance tax for the idle offspring of multi millionaires - something that will benefit only the richest 2% of the population who are already very well off.

The Lib Dems want to cut income tax for those earning £10k or less.

Which party is going to look after ordinary people - rather than their mates in the banks and hedge funds.

the tories.

ordinary people learned to read and write at school and don't work for £10k a year.

I worked hard to get where I am, why should I have to be worse off now to subsidise feckless morons?

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Prodave sounds a bit of a douche nugget (and is flat out wrong with his assumptions, they do get their mortgages paid, not that they should, home ownership should be about putting money aside, having unemploment insurance, and accepting that property can become a liability)

I think it's unfair that the unemployed get their rent paid for them.

If you have a mortgage, you certainly don't get all your mortgage paid for you.

An unfair system that favours renters, and penalises somebody trying to buy their own home.

The system needs an overhaul.

However, most likely if you DO take a job, you will still get tax credits, so all you will lose out on is your housing benefit.

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The other one can't/won't take any pay rise, unless it's for over £2,000. Anything less will just eat into his benefits and leave him worse off!

If I earn $1 more than my standard pay this year I'll be slugged around $2,000 from the Australian Department of Fun. I have already exceeded that and I'm on track for a nice Christmas bonus. Be rest assured that I've put that money aside and will be taking some unpaid leave before the start of the new financial year <_<

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What is better two people working part time or one full time worker and one non worker....wouldn't more couples working part time pay less tax and create more employment? ;)

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What is better two people working part time or one full time worker and one non worker....wouldn't more couples working part time pay less tax and create more employment? ;)

not good for mortgage lenders. therefore, not good for the economy.

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What is better two people working part time or one full time worker and one non worker....wouldn't more couples working part time pay less tax and create more employment? ;)

Two lethal injections?

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not good for mortgage lenders. therefore, not good for the economy.

There are ways around that, for example: lifetime interest only mortgages that are repaid on sale, death or interest could be passed onto children later in life or even on death...renting your home from the bank indefinitely. ;)

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the tories.

ordinary people learned to read and write at school and don't work for £10k a year.

I worked hard to get where I am, why should I have to be worse off now to subsidise feckless morons?

Idiot.

What about those with low intelligence or disabilities that mean that they can realistically only do low paid unskilled work? You know, the stuff like caring for old people, cleaning offices - that kind of unimportant thing that society can well do without.

I worked hard to get where I am as well, which is why I think it's right for me to help out those who work and who are on low incomes.

Same old callous selfish tory crap.

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the tories.

ordinary people learned to read and write at school and don't work for £10k a year.

I worked hard to get where I am, why should I have to be worse off now to subsidise feckless morons?

The benefits trap can catch people who earn way more than the national average wage. So you can forget £10k per year.

There are millions of people in the UK who would be financially better off by not working, or by working less. That is true all the way up to at least £30k per annum for some famillies.

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compared to China, our poor are rich.

thats why we cant compete.

Yes we can we just need more immigrants to force wages down and that isw what is happening even during these dificult times.

country wlll be all black but we can compete.

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Idiot.

What about those with low intelligence or disabilities that mean that they can realistically only do low paid unskilled work? You know, the stuff like caring for old people, cleaning offices - that kind of unimportant thing that society can well do without.

I worked hard to get where I am as well, which is why I think it's right for me to help out those who work and who are on low incomes.

Same old callous selfish tory crap.

help like paying for council houses, fuel bills, housing benefit, child benefit, tax credits etc etc?

or free healthcare, dentalcare, legal aid, education?

most low earners get far more back in benefits than they pay in tax.

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The benefits trap can catch people who earn way more than the national average wage. So you can forget £10k per year.

There are millions of people in the UK who would be financially better off by not working, or by working less. That is true all the way up to at least £30k per annum for some famillies.

agreed.

i think that we should stop imigration and the import of cheap labour, allow wages to rise to the point where jobs are filled by uk residents and cut benefits for all but the needy. We need to have an incentive to work, problem is though there is little incentive to work extra or try to improve your lot when the government will be penalising you at every step. That goes for pretty much all wage brackets.

I have seen those on benefits with a council house getting kitchens fitted for free courtesy of the tax payer, having the sky van arrive within days of moving in shortly followed by the land of leather delivery wagon. I have heared the constant parties and barbeques and returns from pub trips. I couldn't afford the same yet was putting in 50 hours a week and expected to support the feckless. B0l0x!

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