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Mikhail Liebenstein

How Much Money Has Hpc Saved You?

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I reckon thanks to HPC.co.uk I am immediately £300k better off relative to your average reluctant land lord.

My rationale is that in selling at the top of the market I avoided losing £100-150k.

Secondly, when I buy relatively soon, the type of house I want is now at least £200k cheaper.

So by exiting the property market, I am £300-£350k better off than someone who let to move.

However,in the long term the gains are even more, as I avoid paying 25 years interest on the top £200k.

So perhaps relative your property obssessed let to buyer, I am now £550k better off.

Edited by mikelivingstone

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I reckon thanks to HPC.co.uk I am immediately £300k better off relative to your average reluctant land lord.

My rationale is that in selling at the top of the market I avoided losing £100-150k.

Secondly, when I buy relatively soon, the type of house I want is now at least £200k cheaper.

So by exiting the property market, I am £300-£350k better off than someone who let to move.

????

Even if you hadnt sold at the top of the market, the house you want to buy would still be 200K cheaper. So you cant include that drop in your savings.

Edited by Mammon

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????

Even if you hadnt sold at the top of the market, the house you want to buy would still be 200K cheaper. So you cant include that drop in your savings.

If he sold at the top, and buys at the bottom, then why can't he include it?

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If he sold at the top, and buys at the bottom, then why can't he include it?

There are 3 possible scenarios.

1) Sell to rent. Sell at the top, buy at the bottom.

2) Sell to buy - this is what most people do

3) Let to buy - this is what your property types would do.

If you compare doing 1 versus doing 3, then yes I am £550k better off.

Comparing 1 with 2, then I guess I am £200k better off plus the interest not paid on the £200k, so lets say £300k.

So £300k relatively better of than Joe Public, and £550k better of than the Assetz / Ajay types.

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

HPC the route to prosperity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Guest P-Diddly
I reckon thanks to HPC.co.uk I am immediately £300k better off relative to your average reluctant land lord.

My rationale is that in selling at the top of the market I avoided losing £100-150k.

Secondly, when I buy relatively soon, the type of house I want is now at least £200k cheaper.

So by exiting the property market, I am £300-£350k better off than someone who let to move.

However,in the long term the gains are even more, as I avoid paying 25 years interest on the top £200k.

So perhaps relative your property obssessed let to buyer, I am now £550k better off.

:rolleyes:

How much Michael?

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I reckon thanks to HPC.co.uk I am immediately £300k better off relative to your average reluctant land lord.

My rationale is that in selling at the top of the market I avoided losing £100-150k.

Secondly, when I buy relatively soon, the type of house I want is now at least £200k cheaper.

So by exiting the property market, I am £300-£350k better off than someone who let to move.

However,in the long term the gains are even more, as I avoid paying 25 years interest on the top £200k.

So perhaps relative your property obssessed let to buyer, I am now £550k better off.

Did you once work for Enron?

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:rolleyes:

How much Michael?

Well £100-£150k extra in my bank today - cash/gold/shares etc.

or alternatively not paying interest on the extra £200k it would have cost to buy in 2007.

Yes, I agree you can't strictly double count.

However, relative to property types who I know who let to buy - I can now say, "we are now considerably richer than yow"

HPC the path to prosperity. Property the path to poverty.

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Did you once work for Enron?

You miss my point. Total wealth in £, Dollars etc doesn't matter its what you have relative to the rest of the population that counts.

So the point I was making was compared to someone with 2 houses throughout the crash I am £550k better off long term.

I say this as I know a lot of people who let to buy, or else became reluctant landlords. It is these people I am contrasting myself with.

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Really. I sincerely hope that the OP is not in a profession involving any figure work!

I heard on here last week from a chap who STRed in 2005 and claims to have lost £150k. I am sure that relationships must also have taken a battering - disgruntled partners going along with IT contractor husbands "idea", formed partly on the basis of this site, to STR, only to end up worse off and in rented. I can imagine the pillow talk!

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You miss my point. Total wealth in £, Dollars etc doesn't matter its what you have relative to the rest of the population that counts.

So the point I was making was compared to someone with 2 houses throughout the crash I am £550k better off long term.

I say this as I know a lot of people who let to buy, or else became reluctant landlords. It is these people I am contrasting myself with.

There is a moral tale here.

Speculation can enrich you - In my case I was lucky and shorted houses (I was short one one house to live in).

But speculation can impoverish you - I know people who effectively went long houses, buying the new one they wanted before selling the old one, or hanging on to it because "pwoperty is a great investment." Or worse they had portfolios.

The sensible people are the ones who didn't play the market. Yes, they might have been a bit better off if they had sold in 2007, but actually they live in their house which is a home and will generally get on with their lives.

I do feel very sorry for those who were FTBs in 2007, I know a few of those. But I don't have sympathy for speculators.

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That's a Gordon Brown-esque double count I'm afraid!

Try thinking of it this way. You'll only "save" the £200k if you think the house you'll be buying is worth its value at peak, eg you've got it for £200k less than you "should" have done.

The extension ramifications of this line of thinking are mouth watering If you were going to have bought a £25m mansion that you could now buy for £20m then haven't you "saved" £5m? Why stop there???

Edited by Tricksy

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Really. I sincerely hope that the OP is not in a profession involving any figure work!

I heard on here last week from a chap who STRed in 2005 and claims to have lost £150k. I am sure that relationships must also have taken a battering - disgruntled partners going along with IT contractor husbands "idea", formed partly on the basis of this site, to STR, only to end up worse off and in rented. I can imagine the pillow talk!

Actually I do work with figures, but you miss my point.

I am saying that as a Sell to Renter, I am £550k better off than someone who is into property.

What I am not saying is that I have £550k more in my pocket. What I am saying is that I am certainly up £150k today in cash, and in the future I won't have to pay back interest on £200k for 25 years. So this I consider my real gain.

So Lets say I am about £300k up in 25 years.

Now I reckon you typical property speculator, lets say they have £1m portfolio, then they are £200k-£250k down, perhaps more

So relative to someone into property I think I can say my social standing is improved by about £550k.

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That's a Gordon Brown-esque double count I'm afraid!

Try thinking of it this way. You'll only "save" the £200k if you think the house you'll be buying is worth its value at peak, eg you've got it for £200k less than you "should" have done.

The extension ramifications of this line of thinking are mouth watering If you were going to have bought a £25m mansion that you could now buy for £20m then haven't you "saved" £5m? Why stop there???

You also miss my point.

By reading and understanding the views on HPC.co.uk, I am at least £550k better off than someone who listed to Mr Lawz at Assetz or someone who listened to Ajhay or indeed Mr Bovey.

Edited by mikelivingstone

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A small amount of money - the property I am buying has devalued by the same percentage that the one I sold has (in 2007). This means that the cost to trade up would've fallen for me anyway.

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In the real world...sold Nov '07, renting since....guess that we are, given currents stats, just about even.

Freedom from 'home ownership/mortgage' tho' is priceless.

Edited by SOAP

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A small amount of money - the property I am buying has devalued by the same percentage that the one I sold has (in 2007). This means that the cost to trade up would've fallen for me anyway.

Which is absolutely fine and the sensible way to do things.

You have benefited perhaps from not paying as much, though offset by a drop in the one you own.

The people I am winding up are the property bulls. Who relative to me are possible £1/2m worse off.

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Actually I do work with figures, but you miss my point.

I am saying that as a Sell to Renter, I am £550k better off than someone who is into property.

What I am not saying is that I have £550k more in my pocket. What I am saying is that I am certainly up £150k today in cash, and in the future I won't have to pay back interest on £200k for 25 years. So this I consider my real gain.

So Lets say I am about £300k up in 25 years.

Now I reckon you typical property speculator, lets say they have £1m portfolio, then they are £200k-£250k down, perhaps more

So relative to someone into property I think I can say my social standing is improved by about £550k.

This is like saying my neighbour blew 500K gambling. So now my social standing has improved 500K relative to him. What kind of world do you live in?

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Which is absolutely fine and the sensible way to do things.

You have benefited perhaps from not paying as much, though offset by a drop in the one you own.

The people I am winding up are the property bulls. Who relative to me are possible £1/2m worse off.

Yep - I did STR though, so there was a 2 year gap between selling and buying, with all the costs incurred through renting. However, I sold in a rubbish town, where properties of the kind I sold are ten a penny and am now buying in a very desirable area which never has many properties up for sale - so there are factors other than headline hpi to account for.

I wish I'd made more of a 'profit' on my STR strategy (because I'm greedy), as I was wanting to be able to pay off a mortgage in 10 years. Now I'll have to settle for 15. Both are better than continuing to live in a chav infested town and allow my kids to socialise on the weekends with heroin addicted pondlife.

If I had been a bull I'd have had to get a mortgage for £50K more to buy the same house in 2007. My savings are therefore this minus my rent costs, plus the cost of interest on £50K over 20 years, plus 2% stamp duty, minus additional capital repayments on my previous mortgage (if I'd stayed). Christ knows what that comes to.

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Where I live, asking prices are at or close to 2007 level according to rightmove.

Anyone who whould have STR in 2007 in my area, would just about breakeven today (or lose money) when stamp duty, solicitor fees, moving fees, and renting costs are taken into accounts.

Not sure STR is the gravy train most posters are trying to portray here...

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