@contradevian Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 David Hare. We are being blackmailed by the financial system. Fantastic stuff. He should avoid hill walking for a while. Whats happened at the BBC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crash2006 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 oh missed this.,.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traktion Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Even if you legislated that all goods and services must be invoiced pro-forma you'd soon find people were offering credit informally. I can't see the issue with it as long as it's not fraudulent in nature like bank originated loans.___________ Much of what the other poster was calling for in late payment legislation exists but few firms take advanatge of it for obvious reasons. IMO, relying on informal credit should be encouraged - building up trust for a prosperous relationship lays the foundations for a strong, long term, business relationships. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sign_of_the_times Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Well that pissed all over the Meeja's green shoots then I'm off to learn Mandarin, ah-so..les Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R K Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 David Hare. We are being blackmailed by the financial system. Fantastic stuff. He should avoid hill walking for a while. Whats happened at the BBC? One of their best programs for as long as I can remember. Probably because they didn't interview a single politician. They should resolve to keep politicians off the the show permanently. They add nothing of value - ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNACR Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Well that pissed all over the Meeja's green shoots then I'm off to learn Mandarin, ah-so..les I reckon that all this Lehman/bank collapse retrospective might have genuinely rattled people. My online sales have slowed to a dribble over the last hour. :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traktion Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) I agree too many companies think they have grown just by credit.But it is the same argument as house purchases. Most people can not afford to buy a house outright but a lot of people can afford a sensible LTV to buy a house. The same is true for business, a lot of busineses thought they were growing because of cheap credit whereas in reality they were not. But decent profit making busineses can afford credit at a decent level of gearing to invest in the future. And what has excess credit done to house prices? Leaving aside land ownership issues, it has clearly been a catalyst for the BTL frenzy, as well people using their homes like a cash machine. Here is the crux of the problem though - how much credit is the right amount? Who gets to decide? A group of central bankers? A non-expert government minister? IMO, the market needs to dictate such matters, which is why I believe we need monetary reform - central bank and government backed banks just cause problems. Free banking and competing currencies, would restrain themselves, without the (imperfect) guiding hand being involved. This whole monetary experiment has failed and the sooner people realise this, the sooner we can set about changing it for one which ebbs, flows and self balances. EDIT: typo Edited September 15, 2009 by Traktion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralphmalph Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I reckon that all this Lehman/bank collapse retrospective might have genuinely rattled people. My online sales have slowed to a dribble over the last hour. :angry: Slowed to a dribble! are you an online erotic toy seller, you can confess to your HPPC mates we will understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guillotine Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 David Hare. We are being blackmailed by the financial system. Fantastic stuff. He should avoid hill walking for a while. Whats happened at the BBC? I agree, very clear thinking. It's an obvious point I've not heard made outwardly on HPC. That the bankers are effectively a powerful union holding the country to ransom. Also you've got to love Rowan Williams "a need for unreality", very revealing haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNACR Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 IMO, relying on informal credit should be encouraged - building up trust for a prosperous relationship lays the foundations for a strong, long term, business relationships. I agree the problem is people have delegated that to credit ratings agencies and lawyers with contracts that courts will enforce. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) I see the Archbishop of Canterbury how now pitched up to join this rather rudderless episode of ideological navel-gazing. The 'real wealth creation' and 'unreality' bit was ripped straight from a thread on here earlier today :- http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...howtopic=125471 I'm surprised he didn't mention usury once, I suppose that's a given when you consider the size of the CoE portfolio and pension fund, are they still invested in arms manufacturers? Nor did he mention anything about land or rents, also not surprising given the CoE is still one of our largest land owners/rent collectors. Take tonights programme :- The City - Corrupt The Regulators - Corrupt Parliament - Corrupt The WPP man and media/advertising in general - Corrupt and responsible for blowing bubbles and property porn BBC - Decadent and corrupt, infected with property porn. Ex-Bankers - Corrupted by their past The Church - Corrupted by self interest The Goldman Sachs woman - the spawn of Satan. The cause of our problems is right before them, if they collectively looked into a mirror. Edited September 15, 2009 by sillybear2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godless Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 The 'real wealth creation' and 'unreality' bit was ripped straight from a thread on here earlier today :-http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...howtopic=125471 I'm surprised he didn't mention usury once, I suppose that's a given when you consider the size of the CoE portfolio and pension fund, are they still invested in arms manufacturers? Nor did he mention anything about land or rents, also not surprising given the CoE is still one of our largest land owners/rent collectors. Take tonights programme :- The City - Corrupt The Regulators - Corrupt Parliament - Corrupt The WPP man and media/advertising in general - Corrupt and responsible for blowing bubbles and property porn BBC - Decadent and corrupt, infected with property porn. Ex-Bankers - Corrupted by their past The Church - Corrupted by self interest The Goldman Sachs woman - the spawn of Satan. Is this on Iplayer, didn't see it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) Is this on Iplayer, didn't see it? http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00mt...rash_a_Year_On/ What they failed to grasp fully was that this is their generational failure, out of all the bull$hit of '68 the only thing they have left is a toxic legacy, mountains of debt; an unreformed, corrupt and morally bankrupt system of exploitation. "Be reasonable - demand the impossible!" they would shout in the streets in 1968, 40 years on and all these f***g iPhone toting hippy clowns have wormed their way into the establishment and media and they've proceeded to f**k everything with clueless self-interest and a total disregard for those who follow them. It's like our entire economy is an giant branch of Ben & Jerry's with some nasty, nasty flavours! Edited September 15, 2009 by sillybear2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godless Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 cheers SB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomwatkins Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 You are wrong with this post. If a business takes a large order and needs to fund production before the customer pays then credit is essential.Same for business investment. If you want to invest to become more effcient then a loan can fund that captial expenditure. I do agree in an ideal world where all companies pay in 30 days as agreed it may be not needed but every large company I deal with pays over much longer timescales than small companies. So credit is needed or legislation that says small busineses by law van add punititve fees (like banks do) to large companies with big cash balances that do not pay in the agreed 30 days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) cheers SB It's pretty obvious where all these financial instruments were dreamt up, those quants were cooking up home made toxic instruments back in the day and never stopped, just look at the names :- MBS, MDMA, CDS, CDO, THC, FDIC, LSD, LSE. Edited September 16, 2009 by sillybear2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomwatkins Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Sorry-clicked the wrong button. Having been in business most of my life I never understood the "net 30 days" crap at all. I do a job, supply you or whatever, you pay me. There is no reason why payments cannot be immediate by and large. It's the reason why large ammounts of cash get "stuck" in the system, starving out the little guy who has no leverage. If you can process a credit card payment immediately then somebody can figure out a payment system for small business's. In fact for any business. ANYBODY OUT THERE FANCY HAVING A GO AT THAT?? Bit like factoring I guess but I am sure we could come up with something less onerous for the small guy. "The checks in the post"-biggest lie since "I'll still respect you in the morning". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) Sorry-clicked the wrong button. Having been in business most of my life I never understood the "net 30 days" crap at all. I do a job, supply you or whatever, you pay me. There is no reason why payments cannot be immediate by and large. It's the reason why large ammounts of cash get "stuck" in the system, starving out the little guy who has no leverage. If you can process a credit card payment immediately then somebody can figure out a payment system for small business's. In fact for any business. To be honest once business has benefited from that one bite of the cherry and then everyone collectively runs 30 days in arrears then nobody gains from that point on, I suppose that's why they keep pushing terms to 60, 90, 120 days. It's just the same as when Brown switched North Sea revenues from being payed in arrears to being paid advance, but it was a one time only trick, one year he stole from the future and gained essentially double revenues but the next year you're just back to square one. 'Business services' like factoring shouldn't really exist at all given the ability to settle bills in the matter of days, this also ties into that bird on Newsnight moaning about the lack of working capital, if businesses actually bothered to keep some reserves for themselves instead of relying on revolving credit lines then the system would be more robust and fluid. Edited September 16, 2009 by sillybear2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NuBrit Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Fsuckin' BBC iPlayer. Can someone rip this, I really want to watch this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athom Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Fsuckin' BBC iPlayer.Can someone rip this, I really want to watch this. Rip it from where? it's still not up yet, there is a definite pattern on iPlayer, seems if it's a bit bearish or otherwise not ministry of information stamped it takes an age to come on, something suspect going on i can't help wondering?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athom Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 there it is, must have heard me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SNACR Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 The 'real wealth creation' and 'unreality' bit was ripped straight from a thread on here earlier today :-http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...howtopic=125471 I'm surprised he didn't mention usury once, I suppose that's a given when you consider the size of the CoE portfolio and pension fund, are they still invested in arms manufacturers? Nor did he mention anything about land or rents, also not surprising given the CoE is still one of our largest land owners/rent collectors. Pretty sure CofE is landlord of some of my shops - interesting take on Sunday trading. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00mt...rash_a_Year_On/What they failed to grasp fully was that this is their generational failure, out of all the bull$hit of '68 the only thing they have left is a toxic legacy, mountains of debt; an unreformed, corrupt and morally bankrupt system of exploitation. "Be reasonable - demand the impossible!" they would shout in the streets in 1968, 40 years on and all these f***g iPhone toting hippy clowns have wormed their way into the establishment and media and they've proceeded to f**k everything with clueless self-interest and a total disregard for those who follow them. It's like our entire economy is an giant branch of Ben & Jerry's with some nasty, nasty flavours! Much truth there. Don't forget they still expect to unroll crisp £10 notes from their unearned income at some point and say 'here person from the younger generation, who has been priced out of a roof over their head, wipe my ar5e for me'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athom Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 In case you're not seen this http://po-ru.com/projects/iplayer-downloader/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hywel Dda Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) Just watched it and ROWAN ROCK'S. and that's from an athistic Bible Black Welsh methodist. Uncertainty (Read Taleb) Resentment/Closure (Read HPCForum) Unreality - "No such thing as rational self regulated market and that awkward amateurs wether it's historians or Artists (MOI) or the odd theologian have a lot to say Repentance.............Lack of closure.......diffused RESENTMENT...........muted ANGER Edited September 16, 2009 by Hywel Dda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libspero Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Bump Bump Bump! Definately worth watching. Hendry in particular was interesting to listen to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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