scottbeard Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 can I add:the same bunch of economic clowns that have been & are telling you that QE will stop. Well until the G20, when the US et al announced that actually they will be continuing the QE for a bit longer. the same idiots that tell everyone the recession is over, well until the next time that its not of course. so how's that affected all those holding cash & expecting higher IR's next year then ? any knock-on effect ? ffs, when are people going to start working this out. Some of the posters have been members for years & still don't get it. All your reasoned arguments sound totally believeable. The trouble is, so do those of Karl Denninger and Dr Bubb, who see something totally different happening. I honestly don't think it is possible to know with certainty what will happen - the world is simply too unpredictable and it depends upon the reactions of different parties. Nothing is 100% correct, guaranteed - we can only speculate what is most probable. He suppressed the price so him and his backers could buy some cheap. Evil, not stupid. Most of your posts, Injin, are very interesting to read. This one however does start to sound like a conspiracy theory, and I always find conspiracy theories unconvincing. Of course all people are looking out for themselves. But if you want to make your fortune, suppressing the gold price, buying gold, then plunging a country of 60 million people who have trusted you into chaos sounds an outlandish way to do it. You don't even make that much money - all you do is preserve some wealth in the chaos. Surely better to keep "the system" ticking over and feather your bed in subtler ways, like your predecessors before you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr ray Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 He suppressed the price so him and his backers could buy some cheap. Evil, not stupid. My postings above have been tongue-in-cheek but the conspiracy theory is that Goldman-Sachs had been betting heavily on POG going down and were about to be wiped out when Brown helped them out. He then used the money to buy Euros to curry favour with our European friends while losing a shed more money on the transaction. Gavin Davies- a GS partner- was GBs adviser and a New Labour doner Personally I believe this is the explanation rather than stupidity or coincidance. We will see if he gets a job with GS when he is kicked out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Congreve Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Looks like some of it is a fall in the dollar. A fall in the dollar, and this is something that is inevitable with the crazy fiscal policy over in the US, is exactly what is needed to propel gold higher in all currencies. If the dollar continues to be undermined (in fact the damage is already baked into the cake), holders of dollars the world over will rush out of it looking for a safer place to put their money. As the world's reserve currency, the dollar underpins all fiat currencies, so a big fall in the dollar will hit sterling et al too. The only safe place to put your money in this scenario, in currency terms at least (gold should be treated as a currency), is precious metals, particularly gold and silver thanks to their historic popularity as money. Some of you are bemoaning the fact that the gold price in dollars is currently not reflected in sterling. Have patience. Brown has undermined Sterling to a greater degree than Bernanke has undermined the dollar. So in addition to dollar fallout as described above, we will have our turn in the devaluation vs. gold stakes. Additionally, markets are also driven by sentiment as well as fundametals, perhaps even more so (why else have the bankrupt likes of Fanny Mae seen such frenzied buying of their stocks recently?) and 1000USD Gold (if the PPT can't kick it back down this time) will drive positive gold investor sentiment like nothing else. Gold is money. Their fiat experiment is failing as we speak. I've protected my savings, have you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 The dollar price is largely irrelevant if you are buying gold to hedge against Sterling collapse. Gold was £666 in February and is now just over £600 as £ has recovered relative to $.When Sterling halves in value (not if but when IMHO) gold will be worth the same ie £1200. I'm not sure what happens if $ halves in value. I don't think POG will double to compensate as it won't be the perfect hedge against the reserve currency. if the dollar halved then gold would be worth $2000 but still only £600 to us. I don't believe that gold and silver would be dragged down with the dollar in the event of a currency crisis, quite the opposite infact but worst case gold should decouple from the dollar and remain stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 gordon clowns strategy of sell at the botttom may have a slight flaw then, in relation to the UK's gold that has been sold. gordon didn't exactly sell at the bottom, he announced a week early that we were going to sell some tonnage thus creating a new low to sell into. Was more about helping banks caught short than raising revenue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man-returns Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 All your reasoned arguments sound totally believeable. The trouble is, so do those of Karl Denninger and Dr Bubb, who see something totally different happening. I honestly don't think it is possible to know with certainty what will happen - the world is simply too unpredictable and it depends upon the reactions of different parties. Nothing is 100% correct, guaranteed - we can only speculate what is most probable. I see your point BUT the deflationists argument depends on QE being stopped now (or before the last increase), this hasn't happened. Whereas the gold bugs are reading the goepolitics & have a better understanding of general politics imo. why on earth would the politicians do what they say they would do & stop QE. One of the most important points & also showing their future flation hand was by bailing all the financial institutions/banks etc, this could ONLY point to inflation imo & especially coupled with QE & lot's of it..... you think it's luck that the goldbugs are consistently right ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiggerUK Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 you think it's luck that the goldbugs are consistently right ? I think that for most of the gold-bugs the answer is yes. Some of them follow the Gourd, and some of them follow the Shoe. And they all get excited when the juniper bush brings forth juniper berries. Ask them how a juniper bush produces junipers and they won't have a clue. The same as most gold bugs don't have a clue why gold is valuable. Anyway I go off to the garage to collect my car, spend enough to buy 2 sovereigns, and come home to find the thread moved. No surprise apart from the fact that Erroll hasn't posted "mods can we have this moved to the gold forum" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 gordon didn't exactly sell at the bottom, he announced a week early that we were going to sell some tonnage thus creating a new low to sell into. Was more about helping banks caught short than raising revenue. Some would call that treason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottbeard Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 why on earth would the politicians do what they say they would do & stop QE.you think it's luck that the goldbugs are consistently right ? It's not much use being Prime Minister of a country that has been destroyed by hyperinflation: it's like being captain of a scuttled ship. Can QE generate nice, debt-friendly high inflation without spilling over into hyperinflation? Only for so long I would imagine. Eventually the politicians will be faced with a choice of stopping QE or destroying the currency and then the economy. We cannot be certain of their choice, but hyperinflation doesn't seem rational to me if they want their governmental power to mean something. As for goldbugs predictions - so far so good, perhaps. But i'm sure plenty of property bulls were using that line in July 2007. I have decided only that I am undecided, so far. It is a good discussion to be having though - I wish it were more mainstream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill still Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 I've been reading along, knowing that I don't know enough to comment -- just educating myself -- but "goldbugs being consistently right"! I've followed goldbug predictions of $5,000/oz gold since the early 1970s. I wouldn't make a leveraged bet on gold price. As others have said, there are just too many variables. I see your point BUT the deflationists argument depends on QE being stopped now (or before the last increase), this hasn't happened. Whereas the gold bugs are reading the goepolitics & have a better understanding of general politics imo.why on earth would the politicians do what they say they would do & stop QE. One of the most important points & also showing their future flation hand was by bailing all the financial institutions/banks etc, this could ONLY point to inflation imo & especially coupled with QE & lot's of it..... you think it's luck that the goldbugs are consistently right ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stay Beautiful Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Gold, you spend all that time and effort getting it out of the ground only to pop it safely back into the ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_w_ Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Well? This thread's awfully quiet all of a sudden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man-returns Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 (edited) I've been reading along, knowing that I don't know enough to comment -- just educating myself -- but "goldbugs being consistently right"!I've followed goldbug predictions of $5,000/oz gold since the early 1970s. I wouldn't make a leveraged bet on gold price. As others have said, there are just too many variables. I should have said the majority of goldbugs that I have spoken to. I am speaking generically, which is always flawed for someone. you have to choose your 'flation flavour before it's rolled out to you, too late for a choice then. I am 99% sure it's high inflatiopn, leading to very high inflation, leading to a hyper inflation of both the dollar & sterling. I am using silver & gold as a currency store primarily Bill, then afterwards as an investment. If I get the same back that's more than will be said for holding sterling & run the risk of getting caught out in the next part of the banking crisis. edited - I am not leveraged at all btw & I have no debt....at all, but I don't own a property though. Edited September 8, 2009 by grumpy-old-man-returns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 I wouldn't make a leveraged bet on gold price. As others have said, there are just too many variables. Eminently sensible. Nobody should be betting on gold in this manner (unless you can truly afford to lose the money). In this market gold could move $50 in either direction in a matter of hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 Well?This thread's awfully quiet all of a sudden. What were you expecting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_w_ Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 (edited) What were you expecting? After the initials exultations and once gold went back below 1,000? Nothing. Just being facetious. Anyone thinking this could be a bull trap or are the Chinese oh so stupid? <Edit to add: don't get me wrong, I'm stuffed with gold and silver as a hedge, but I wouldn't call myself a gold bug, I have great reservations about it> Edited September 8, 2009 by williamdb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Take Me Back To London! Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 After the initials exultations and once gold went back below 1,000? Nothing.Just being facetious. Anyone thinking this could be a bull trap or are the Chinese oh so stupid? <Edit to add: don't get me wrong, I'm stuffed with gold and silver as a hedge, but I wouldn't call myself a gold bug, I have great reservations about it> Gold back over $1,000 at 1am this morning. The Chinese are going to win. My reservations about gold are greatly exceeded by my reservations of fiat money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpy-old-man-returns Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 courtesy of Pluto at GEI: Barrick sees gold going much higher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_w_ Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Gold back over $1,000 at 1am this morning.The Chinese are going to win. My reservations about gold are greatly exceeded by my reservations of fiat money. My theory about the what Chinese are doing: they are ramping up gold to distract us while they accumulate oil assets. The amount of oil assets they are currently buying is quite impressive and that's something for them to keep quiet about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr ray Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Price dropping now. Not held $1000/oz and a hairs breath above £600. Might get another chance to stock up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr ray Posted September 9, 2009 Share Posted September 9, 2009 Price dropping now. Not held $1000/oz and a hairs breath above £600.Might get another chance to stock up Wossapennin? Chart gone vertical this evening $990 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tahoma Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Some people think posting a picture of a rocket is soooo HPC circa 2007. Not me. In your faces. It even looks like it is made of Gold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Gold over $1010!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Take Me Back To London! Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) Most of the reasons given on the gold thread to own gold could have been lifted off the home page of CID. I do like the CID reasons to own gold on their home page. I am not sure why they have 2 different lists side by side and the second list has more than 10 "10 Top Reasons to Invest in Physical Gold"? Reason 8 of the first list states "Gold is an inflation-proof investment." Well, it was not inflation-proof investment if you bought and held it through the 1980s and 1990s. Top 10 Reasons to Invest in Physical Gold1) No other investment has the wealth preserving power of gold! 2) Gold should be part of every optimally diversified portfolio. 3) Physical (allocated) gold is the most secure way to invest in gold. 4) The current U.S. debt and trade crisis will continue to push gold prices up. 5) A tangible and liquid asset, gold is the only truly international currency. 6) Gold maintains its value through political and social upheavals, wars, and natural disasters. 7) Unlike paper currency, stocks and bonds, gold will never loses its intrinsic value. 8) Gold is an inflation-proof investment. 9) Gold will always be in demand, and demand is increasing. 10) Gold has always been, and will always be, the most legendary precious metal in the world. • Top 10 Reasons to Invest in Physical Gold • The Allure of Gold • Rarity • Durability • Utility • Gold as Commodity • Gold as Currency • Gold as Store of Value • The U.S. Gold-based economy • The U.S. Paper Economy • US debt • The Outlook for Gold • Global Currency Debasement: • Long-term pricing trends • Investing in Gold • Why Wait? http://www.coininvestdirect.com/main.php Edited September 12, 2009 by Take Me Back To London! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erat_forte Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 (edited) • Top 10 Reasons to Invest in Physical Gold... • Investing in Gold • Why Wait? The last 2 are very sweet! Edited September 12, 2009 by erat_forte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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