Does Anyone Else Get The Feeling Hpc.co.uk Has Turned Into A Parody Of Itself?

[munners]

People come and go on all forums. Im 34 and was a member on an old skool bmx forum. I used to collect 80's BMX's. I spent morning noon and night on there. It takes over your life after a while. I left 2 months ago and havent entered the site since. Dont miss it at all...

Its interesting to see the 'bitchy' arguements on here that people get into. They exist on every forum.

As long as there is opinion then there will always be conflict.

This is a great forum but all about opinion. No one knows whats gonna happen. Its all guess work but we all have an opinion.

[Dopamine]

I'm spending less time on here, proportionate to my increasing exasperation about the terminally high house prices in this country (and in fact this country in general)

The general sense I get is that people on here are showing the normal emotions people have when they can't have something they want - depressed and angry (and justifiably so IMO).

Even those who remain convinced perma-bears often seem to be trying to convince themselves, so their posts often come across as self reinforcing rhetoric rather than an invitation to discuss. This is not a criticism since I feel that way too.

Indeed, I wonder how many of those posters who were more prolific a year ago but who are now rarely seen, are spending more time on 'expat' and 'emigration' forums. I know I am!

[_w_]

I'm not saying the forum is crap, but nowadays you have to sift through the drivel (some would suggect this thread - fine!) to find the nuggets.

There were a lot more nuggets a year or two ago.

There were a lot less argument and insults a year or two ago.

From a financial perspective, the last two years were the most amazing and the fastest paced in a lifetime. The forum was bubbling with analysis and comments about what was happening on a daily basis.

Things have slowed down a bit since, it's no wonder the forum content has been affected.

But I agree about the trashing of pro-hpi arguments, they should be encouraged and learned from rather than trashed. I'm not sure there is any more trashing than there was in the past though.

[libspero]

Simple no debate on here anymore.

Some chap posted a graph today with his analysis of why prices do not matter affordability does. The first page of replies were basically "you are an idiot" no justification for why, no arguments put forward, no discussion.

Just worth noting, of all of the posters on the first page of that thread, the date they joined the forum were:

2004 - 3 posters

2005 - 1 poster

2007 - 6 posters

2008 - 2 posters

2009 - 3 posters (including the OP).

The debate may have changed, but a lot of the people are the same

[SNACR]

From a financial perspective, the last two years were the most amazing and the fastest paced in a lifetime. The forum was bubbling with analysis and comments about what was happening on a daily basis.

Things have slowed down a bit since, it's no wonder the forum content has been affected.

But I agree about the trashing of pro-hpi arguments, they should be encouraged and learned from rather than trashed. I'm not sure there is any more trashing than there was in the past though.

Also, people tend to run out of amusing anecdotes and sarcastic putdowns they can shoehorn in under the general heading of house prices crashing.

[ralphmalph]

Just worth noting, of all of the posters on the first page of that thread, the date they joined the forum were:

2004 - 3 posters

2005 - 1 poster

2007 - 6 posters

2008 - 2 posters

2009 - 3 posters (including the OP).

The debate may have changed, but a lot of the people are the same

and I note now he is just being called a troll.

[noodle doodle]

I blame all the threads about what exactly the national average salary is. Repeated viewing of these threads has turned everybody's brain to mush: now people can only communicate by banging their heads against the keyboards and posting the results.

amen, I've spent way too much energy trying to explain the difference between median and mean on those threads...

Me: "A median gives you the salary of the average person, a mean gives you the average salary of a population"...

anon: "But median's not the average!"...

Me: "It is, it's a type of average, like a flat is a type of home, it's just not a... 3-bed semi-detached average"...

anon: "yeh, well everyone in london earns 50k, MINIMUM!"...

Me: "AAAarghhhh......"

[SNACR]

amen, I've spent way too much energy trying to explain the difference between median and mean on those threads...

Me: "A median gives you the salary of the average person, a mean gives you the average salary of a population"...

anon: "But median's not the average!"...

Me: "It is, it's a type of average, like a flat is a type of home, it's just not a... 3-bed semi-detached average"...

anon: "yeh, well everyone in london earns 50k, MINIMUM!"...

Me: "AAAarghhhh......"

TBH anon seems pretty bang on with his assertion modal earnings in London are £50k.

[tinker]

It's a Bull Trap

I think we all know that.

The economy is completely wrecked.

The Government can't go on printing money and increasing public debt at the current rate forever.

The Sh*t WILL hit the fan sooner or later

Not much to debate really.

This is a strange period when, if you are reasonable economically savvy and have been following HPC story, not a lot of what is currently going on makes sense. There is so much interference and predigitation in both the housing market and economy, that we are in a relative hiatus. With a moribund government and an election coming up, it's a bit like a phoney war.

Most of us here can see the reality out there... the correction is being delayed. Arguments were won a long time ago,new ones will emerge. There is still debate and analysis to be had - and some fun (especially 'off-topic').

The calm before the storm.

Edit: Missing word

Edited September 3, 2009 by tinker

[IMHAL]

Says one of the "private sector adherents" I mentioned in my opening post, so I'd not expect a rational debate from you.

Can't remember the last time you had much to say that was'nt twaddle so you really cannot expect a rational debt on that.

[Game_Over]

I'm spending less time on here, proportionate to my increasing exasperation about the terminally high house prices in this country (and in fact this country in general)

The general sense I get is that people on here are showing the normal emotions people have when they can't have something they want - depressed and angry (and justifiably so IMO).

Even those who remain convinced perma-bears often seem to be trying to convince themselves, so their posts often come across as self reinforcing rhetoric rather than an invitation to discuss. This is not a criticism since I feel that way too.

Indeed, I wonder how many of those posters who were more prolific a year ago but who are now rarely seen, are spending more time on 'expat' and 'emigration' forums. I know I am!

Yes, but I have a house and no mortgage, so why am I so angry??????

[Super Mario]

I'm spending less time on here, proportionate to my increasing exasperation about the terminally high house prices in this country (and in fact this country in general)

The general sense I get is that people on here are showing the normal emotions people have when they can't have something they want - depressed and angry (and justifiably so IMO).

Even those who remain convinced perma-bears often seem to be trying to convince themselves, so their posts often come across as self reinforcing rhetoric rather than an invitation to discuss. This is not a criticism since I feel that way too.

Indeed, I wonder how many of those posters who were more prolific a year ago but who are now rarely seen, are spending more time on 'expat' and 'emigration' forums. I know I am!

Me too. Not that I posted that much, but I find myself lurking less than I did.

[Letsdance]

Been on here a couple of years now, don't post much but on every day reading the threads.

Seems to me that no body expected what we have got now and where we are now!!

2 years ago we were just hitting the top and expecting the drop into the black hole. As yet it has not happened (or has it). Nobody expected this bear or bull. The bears expected the massive fall, it should of happened, its happening in drips and draps, 2% here 3% there. Frustration is setting in. The bulls riding the wave 2 years ago also thought , christ this is for real,what do I do now. 12 months later confidence has returned somewhat. Both bears and bulls at the moment are in limbo. Nobody can predict next week, never mind next year.

The hard core bears foretelling the FTSE sinking, banks crashing, Inflation, Deflation. The bulls Sibley, Valerius, Hamish jumping on the Express headlines.

The government, Brown and Co, will either be saints or lunitics in 50 years. I don't know!! Nobody else does!!

At this moment in time HPC.co.uk can not predict next week (forget next year), the threads reflect this. Interesting times. Can this site and all who contribute hold it together to see the next few years through. I say this as we have lost a lot of good posters during the last 12 months. Mick Dundee today.

Can you accept this state of limbo?

[Guest absolutezero]

Can't remember the last time you had much to say that was'nt twaddle so you really cannot expect a rational debt on that.

I don't owe a penny, thanks.

[SNACR]

I don't owe a penny, thanks.

What about all that money you've had of us taxpayers as something you call 'wages'?

[Game_Over]

This is a strange period when, if you are reasonable economically savvy and have been following HPC story, not a lot of what is currently going on makes sense. There is so much interference and predigitation in both the housing market and economy, that we are in a relative hiatus. With a moribund government and an election coming up, it's a bit like a phoney war.

Most of here can see the reality out there... the correction is being delayed. Arguments were won a long time ago,new ones will emerge. There is still debate and analysis to be had - and some fun (especially 'off-topic').

The calm before the storm.

Well it makes perfect sense to me and you actually explained why in the rest of your post.

The Government spends and prints hundreds of billions of pounds and the economy improves SLIGHTLY

This tends to suggest that when the money runs out we will be totally and utterly f*cked.

Sorry about the language, but there is no other way to adequately express the situation we will be in.

[Stars]

What about all that money you've had of us taxpayers as something you call 'wages'?

That's how he pays his debts so well, he gets you to pay them for him

Handy huh?

[Grime- skint wouldbe ftb]

Simple no debate on here anymore.

Some chap posted a graph today with his analysis of why prices do not matter affordability does. The first page of replies were basically "you are an idiot" no justification for why, no arguments put forward, no discussion.

Why would anybody put forward new thoughts for the idiot masses.

Exactly... I've been making the same point about the "hive mind" but its generally a waste of time, people have got their fingers in their ears and are going La La La.

The main problem is a lot of followers of this site seem to treat economic bad news as good news, as if its going to make it easier for them to own their own homes. For the average person, home ownership is as distant as ever and will remain so... as prices drop, your chances of being able to borrow enough or even actually have a job are getting slimmer all along.

As I say, total waste of time trying to open peoples' eyes.

You can also try and open their eyes to politics but the stupidity is pretty strong around here..

[Guest Daddy Bear]

Can't remember the last time you had much to say that was'nt twaddle so you really cannot expect a rational debt on that.

debt or debate?

Had a few beers imhal? However I do agree.

Seriously - there was only one debate after aug 2007 (start of HPC) - Massive inflation or deflation.....

All those who had the prescience to sell up before aug 2007 have ceased meaningful posting.

They know the result will be massive inflation.

The nominal house price crash is over.

Granted - house prices in real terms will fall slowly over the next 10 years - to the benefit of noone apart frm those who will be in their early 20's in 10 years time purchasing their first house.

Those who joined in 2008/2009 are generally going to be a bit more stupid and have less to offer then 2004/05/06/07 members.

For example "bruce banner " - what a muppet.

Us "old school" are no longer interested - we are too ahead of the curve.

Edited September 3, 2009 by Daddy Bear

[Stars]

Exactly... I've been making the same point about the "hive mind" but its generally a waste of time, people have got their fingers in their ears and are going La La La.

The main problem is a lot of followers of this site seem to treat economic bad news as good news, as if its going to make it easier for them to own their own homes. For the average person, home ownership is as distant as ever and will remain so... as prices drop, your chances of being able to borrow enough or even actually have a job are getting slimmer all along.

As I say, total waste of time trying to open peoples' eyes.

You can also try and open their eyes to politics but the stupidity is pretty strong around here..

I agree

[Harry Sacks]

Bill Still's monetary reforum

[Guest Daddy Bear]

Exactly... I've been making the same point about the "hive mind" but its generally a waste of time, people have got their fingers in their ears and are going La La La.

The main problem is a lot of followers of this site seem to treat economic bad news as good news, as if its going to make it easier for them to own their own homes. For the average person, home ownership is as distant as ever and will remain so... as prices drop, your chances of being able to borrow enough or even actually have a job are getting slimmer all along.

As I say, total waste of time trying to open peoples' eyes.

You can also try and open their eyes to politics but the stupidity is pretty strong around here..

Exactly

The moderators are at fault on this too.

I was a bear from 2005 - 2009 and turned bull recently.

Since then alot of my posts have been censored and removed.

I posted loads of graphical data on commodity prices, currencies, bail outs and printing of money etc pointing to massive inflation and rising NOMINAL house prices. The posts were removed by the mods.

Other inflation posts were quickly moved to the economics section - have a look.

New members just label me as a Troll.

I will admit they have won and I cannot be bothered posting anymore - I just feel smug as prices have nominally risen for the last 5 months or so ...since I turned bulll

[Equity's Darling]

Per Letsdance: "At this moment in time HPC.co.uk can not predict next week (forget next year), the threads reflect this. Interesting times. Can this site and all who contribute hold it together to see the next few years through. I say this as we have lost a lot of good posters during the last 12 months."

A point well made. I have mainly lurked on here, lured by the small percentage of very perceptive posts. Others do a disservice to this forum by shouting down the likes of Hamish, Sibley and Valerious every time they dare to tell things how they see them.

For much of the time this forum is a laughing stock, frequented by lonely types who presumably dilute the HPC debate with their spurious musings because their local post office has shut and they can no longer make a nuisance of themselves there. Such posters are clearly identified by the length and colour of their signature remarks.

And don't get me started on the stupid woman who posted a question yesterday about why her Volkswagen kept cutting out - on the main forum FFS! What have we come to?

So please, report interesting HPC facts. Debate them. Be eloquent and informed when disagreeing. And give our resident bulls the time of day when they post. As a committed bear I disagree with their long term views too - but in the moment they are spot on. I don't like it either.

[Guest absolutezero]

What about all that money you've had of us taxpayers as something you call 'wages'?

Don't you start!

[Oh Dear]

If I recall correctly, bear news articles were few and far between. Most of the time on the forum was spent by posters citing theories of why house prices would fall; how much they would fall, when it would start and how the government would react. These very interesting (to me) questions have now mostly been answered, for the time being.

If you can get past the multiple multiple page threads about public sector workers (ones about teachers seem to get everyone foaming at the mouth), average earnings etc then there is still some good commentary here.