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gordyjuly23

Farm Land

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One of the other non-football forums I belong to is obsessed with peak oil to the point that around last October I had myself convinced that the civilised world as we know it was on the verge of being knocked back to industrial era type technology.

I have calmed myself somewhat but a lingering interest in limited farming remains.

Therefore does anybody know the process of getting myself some farmland? Not a farm, just a piece of land. Enough to grow some vegtables maybe and/or keep some animals...

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What about an allotment?

Personally i would not worry about the doom sayers, people have been predicting the end of time since the start of time and we are all still here.

Just try growing some pasta, beer, and ice cream ;)

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Alot of the peak oil doomers would get along with the house crash doomers :)

I havnt been convinced by the total doom that the American peakers spout but I do believe 10/15 years time we will be looking at a significantly harder place to live in.

Northern Ireland is not energy independent nor are we food secure. We import alot of both.

So it would be great if I had the option to grow my own stuff and or keep my own animals.

I have a book about making my own beers ;)

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Alot of the peak oil doomers would get along with the house crash doomers :)

I havnt been convinced by the total doom that the American peakers spout but I do believe 10/15 years time we will be looking at a significantly harder place to live in.

Northern Ireland is not energy independent nor are we food secure. We import alot of both.

So it would be great if I had the option to grow my own stuff and or keep my own animals.

I have a book about making my own beers ;)

Yet peak oilers have not been proved wrong yet. The fact is that the supply curve has been flat for 5 years, this is what the hard data shows. I expect oil to be much higher in the next 5-10 years, and there is a chance it could be north of 300 USD.

There was joy yesterday on the announcement that BP had made a deep discovery in the Gulf of Mexico, it will be up to ten years before that is in production. By that time many of the present large fields will have been depleted, so I am very sceptical that daily production can be increased to meet daily demand. The decline rate is around 6-8% per year at the moment, that is huge.

You see the peak oilists Matthew Simmons was called a wacko back in the year 2000 he said oil would reach 100 USD. Jim Rogers received hate mail for saying oil would reach 150 USD this decade. The peak oilists have been right in price prediction, yet the economists have been chasing oil down all the way up. I think it is a case of the pessimists (realists in many cases) have to be right only once where as the optimists have to be right everyday.

Peak oil is not peak energy by the way, but the transition I feel will be very painful. If one looks at the best data we have available it all points in the direction that we have peaked in production. Also don't confuse peaking with running out, we have no where near run out, it is just the fact that daily production will not meet daily demand due to geological issues rather than economic ones.

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Depends on the graph

A bell shaped peak oil graph and only half the oil is gone with the rest increasingly hard (and expensive) to get out.

But there is another graph with a peak and swift drop, cant remember the name/tip of graph and that would be much worse.

Peak Oil Doomers also say that even though the energy crisis is bad enough there is worse should we hit peak. Oil is tied into the production of so many things. I heard a figure stating to put a sunday roast in a London pub takes 20 barrels of oil throughout the whole process.

The transportation of food could easily leave us looking at third world status, we import so much and barely have the capacity to feed ourselves as a nation. The production of drugs and pesticides again are reliant on oil.

I know a guy in the oil industry - looking at renewables. During my own panic he assured me that oil would not run out and if it did all the energy companies have something up their sleeves to screw us over with a "new" energy to get the most money out of us.

300$US a barrell would not surprise me in 5-10 years. Can you all see how bad that would be for us just in a transport to work and heating the home scenario without adding the costs of increased food to that?

This recession has saved us a bit but we need a depression to hold off for these "new technologies" to "save" us or lessen the blow.

The Stormont government annoy me. We need radical plans now to tackle this future problem. We need a nuke power plant (creates job and leaves us a bit more energy independent) - Geo thermal power, dig a mile into the earth and hey presto thermal power - £1million a plant I believe. And again more jobs to run it.

We need an improved electric rail network should oil raise drastically.

Even if oil doesnt hit that high a level (but it will) an improved rail network and energy independence should be something we strive for. Cars are a luxury we can do without if the proper infrastructure is there to deal with our transportation needs.

But anyway...

Farm land or more accurately - agricultural land, anybody know where I could even see listings?

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Go to propertynews or propertypal and hit land or commercial then agricultural land. Try auctioneer websites for your area. Try Farming Life or farmers weekly. Ask a local farmer who to go to for information

thanks

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The Stormont government annoy me. We need radical plans now to tackle this future problem. We need a nuke power plant (creates job and leaves us a bit more energy independent) - Geo thermal power, dig a mile into the earth and hey presto thermal power - £1million a plant I believe. And again more jobs to run it.

We need an improved electric rail network should oil raise drastically.

There's more chance of every person in Northern Ireland picking the winning Lottery numbers simultaneously. It takes a superhuman effort for Stormont to think beyond our borders and in the current decade at the same time.

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There's more chance of every person in Northern Ireland picking the winning Lottery numbers simultaneously. It takes a superhuman effort for Stormont to think beyond our borders and in the current decade at the same time.

I disagree. I don't think stormont are capable of thinking.

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I think this is a bit off with the discussion but the farm land would relate to this.

Have a friend looking at a site in the mid Ulster area. The site has FPP but the site is very small. As the site has a field to the side of it, he wants to approach the farmer to see if there is any possibilities of the farmer releasing any land (0.2 acre) roughly. How much do you think he should pay for this? He knows he is at the farmers mercy with this. But anyone know a realistic price?

Thanks

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I'm a bit of a peak oiler myself, and tend to agree with most of what you say. I tend to take the science view rather than an industrial or political one, and scientist are saying that the industry is trying to cover up the real reserves and that noone really knows.

Having suffered massive energy bill increases in the last year (I had heating problems with my new house and rates went up for gas and lecky), so have been thinking hard about alternatives. I also have some agri land that I own with some other family members and while they are busy trying to get housing planning permission for it I have been thinking about planting trees, Ash for example for energy. Not sure how they will react, and I don't think planning is going to happen any time soon, but it will take 7 years to grow a decent crop I think, assuming one starts with saplings or germinated seeds. Might just grow what I can find in public treeland, seem to grow like weeds round here.

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http://www.powerswitch.org.uk/forum/index....b19992af9092565

Thats the British peak oil forum I read

in regards to the farmer, good luck even getting him to sell.

There is a field behind our row of 6 semi detached houses in the country with a small gated section of the field beside the last house in the row. Probably about 30m by 5m strip and the farmer point blank refused to sell the part of the field. He never used the gate.

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Farmland in NI can be a frustrating topic,but you are right to be looking at it.Energy and food both supply and price are not going down beyond short term fluctuation.

Prices in Co.Down an area with some of the most fertile and Atlantic warmed land have been high,in fact higher than comparable land even in S.Lincs! Relatively little appears on the market and there is not necessarily much more being traded with neighbours. Prices of £10,000/acre don't stack up with current commercial returns/usage although hopes for more dubious property opportunities won't go away from many farming families.

More than anything however there seems a laudable aim to hang on to land and to value it as an asset for family security.NI has relatively small farm size and relatively resilient farmers with broad skill base(not vegetables mind).In many ways it it the best prepared,or could be,for lower input farming.The areas dry enough for grain production are lowish but for forestry/biomass great potential.

Shipping and imported food costs may well impact faster than Tesco and other leeches ability to drive producers down. If there is any independent retail left to get to the public with then producers may be better placed than mainland UK.

Good luck.

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