On The Brink

[sdoey]

Think this deserves its own thread. On the Brink BBC 1 tv series this week presented by Stephen 'fat boy' Nolan.

Synopsis:

As the recession continues to bite hard in Northern Ireland, Stephen Nolan presents a series of programmes that go behind the scenes in the offices of the Citizens' Advice Bureau, which finds itself at the coal face in helping those affected cope with its impact.

From personal debt to property repossessions and redundancies, this insightful and emotional series looks at how the new hardship of the 21st century is afflicting people of all backgrounds.

Edited August 31, 2009 by sdoey

[Mammon]

Think this deserves its own thread. On the Brink tv series this week presented by Stephen 'fat boy' Nolan.

Synopsis:

As the recession continues to bite hard in Northern Ireland, Stephen Nolan presents a series of programmes that go behind the scenes in the offices of the Citizens' Advice Bureau, which finds itself at the coal face in helping those affected cope with its impact.

From personal debt to property repossessions and redundancies, this insightful and emotional series looks at how the new hardship of the 21st century is afflicting people of all backgrounds.

Which channel?

Should be interesting, was speaking to someone who works in a CAB recently.

Says many people come in with 100K+ credit card debts. And its not even from living it up, its mostly from paying normal living expenses (like rent) + compound interest over a few years.

The Banks know that these people are in heavy debt but continue to lend anyway.

[Guest KingCharles1st]

I'm sorry, but that bloke annoys the crap out of me

[headmelter]

Fatboy Nolan Surveys Increasing levels of Debt.

Nothing the regulars on here don't already know.

This is only the start. When the second wave of the credit crunch hits followed by the second recessionary dip methinks we will be right royally rogered.

Are the sheeple still asleep ?

On again tomorrow night at 10.35.

[gordyjuly23]

Fatboy Nolan Surveys Increasing levels of Debt.

Nothing the regulars on here don't already know.

This is only the start. When the second wave of the credit crunch hits followed by the second recessionary dip methinks we will be right royally rogered.

Are the sheeple still asleep ?

On again tomorrow night at 10.35.

Who would you class as "we" seems to be alot about here waiting for the second part of the crash so that they can swoop in get what they waited for.

It's sad for a lot of people but they have mostly brought it on themselves. I was brought up not to spend what I dont have. I dont have any credit cards nor any loans ( dont even have a student loan - I payed my own way through uni working 70 hour weeks in a factory). When I worked in an office about 2 years ago one of my colleagues was 9k in debt from credit cards and they were on the same wage as me which at that time was 14k. How is that sustainable? Its not really their fault when all these credit cards are put in their face with the lifestyles they see on TV just a trip to the shopping centre away. That persons debt was not through living expenses but through clothes shopping.

Currently working with another guy who had to take a loan out just after Christmas to pay off a number of other loans. Again out drinking and partying most nights of the week with massive Virgin package and it appears that he is back in further debt despite seemingly getting his debt under control.

People never learn. There is very little of a saving culture here. Its all a want want want culture. See it want it get it regardless of their situation.

[headmelter]

Who would you class as "we" seems to be alot about here waiting for the second part of the crash so that they can swoop in get what they waited for.

Nothing wrong with that.

Life is about choices. Some people make good ones, some people make poor ones. IMO those that have waited did not make a poor choice.

[gordyjuly23]

Nothing wrong with that.

Life is about choices. Some people make good ones, some people make poor ones. IMO those that have waited did not make a poor choice.

Not saying that there is, as you say its the opposite.

Was just wondering from the OP was there something else that would drag the patient people into the debt riddled peoples mess too?

[headmelter]

Not saying that there is, as you say its the opposite.

Was just wondering from the OP was there something else that would drag the patient people into the debt riddled peoples mess too?

I can't speak for anyone else but I can't think of anything that would encourage me to get into debt over the next 18-24 months.

[Ride_on]

I did find it interesting the comment made by the blonde woman, she didn't go looking for it, it was shoved in her face. I recall EVERYTIME buying clothes being offered a store card to save 10 or £20 on the purchase. Its all just do this to save money now, no real commitment if you pay it off, of course when you say yes it is a big commitment and a huge form comes out. I did it once, and never used the card, but you feel as if you are letting your family down by not saving that 10 or £20.

They know how to tempt people, and I do not blame them for being less cautious than I. I have never been unemployed for a significant length of time and earn a good wage, I wonder what it woulod be like to be needing to buy food or clothes for a dependent and you have these cards.

Then there was the old guy who paid of his cards with a loan then started using the cards again, then stopped getting benefits for his son/grandson that he was using to pay the loan, and then becam ill.

There are critisms to be made of the individuals, but would anyone be any different. We all like to think so but you can never know until you are there.

It very much resounds with me on the hatred I have of these marketing people who get paid alot of money to script these schemes in every detail so as to make you think its easy money with no commitment, until you say yes. These things really need to regulated much more strongly.

[yadayada]

I did find it interesting the comment made by the blonde woman, she didn't go looking for it, it was shoved in her face. I recall EVERYTIME buying clothes being offered a store card to save 10 or £20 on the purchase. Its all just do this to save money now, no real commitment if you pay it off, of course when you say yes it is a big commitment and a huge form comes out. I did it once, and never used the card, but you feel as if you are letting your family down by not saving that 10 or £20.

The best policy is to take the card and the rebate, then throw the card out. Take a look at moneysavingexpert.com on these. You're letting your family down if you don't!

Edited September 1, 2009 by yadayada

[gordyjuly23]

I did find it interesting the comment made by the blonde woman, she didn't go looking for it, it was shoved in her face. I recall EVERYTIME buying clothes being offered a store card to save 10 or £20 on the purchase. Its all just do this to save money now, no real commitment if you pay it off, of course when you say yes it is a big commitment and a huge form comes out. I did it once, and never used the card, but you feel as if you are letting your family down by not saving that 10 or £20.

They know how to tempt people, and I do not blame them for being less cautious than I. I have never been unemployed for a significant length of time and earn a good wage, I wonder what it woulod be like to be needing to buy food or clothes for a dependent and you have these cards.

Then there was the old guy who paid of his cards with a loan then started using the cards again, then stopped getting benefits for his son/grandson that he was using to pay the loan, and then becam ill.

There are critisms to be made of the individuals, but would anyone be any different. We all like to think so but you can never know until you are there.

It very much resounds with me on the hatred I have of these marketing people who get paid alot of money to script these schemes in every detail so as to make you think its easy money with no commitment, until you say yes. These things really need to regulated much more strongly.

It's sneaky some of the sales pitches and even the strongest of wills are not immune.

I received sales training from a company selling a product at £2000 a pop but it was worth nowhere near that and I was expected to fill peoples heads full of crap and then hit them with the A B option. Option A is £2000 all at once or Option B pay x amount per month at silly apr a month. There are people out their that would take either deal regardless. The training we got gave us answered to dispel the customers every opposition and then guilt them into buying it as it could be damaging their childrens health not to have this product. I left on the 3rd day of training.

I also have worked in debt enforcement for the government and they are now are playing hardball, much harder apparently than the other debt recovery private sector companies do. We routinely sent people to the wall taking 40% of their wages without a second thought and there wasnt much they they could do to stop us once we had decided this was

the fastest way to get the money back.

Lessons I've tried to learn

Dont buy what I dont need or really really want. Dont spend what I havnt got no matter how good the deal seems.

I recently bought Fight Night round for for the Xbox 360 to keep my nephew amused when he stays with me. Was a bit of a lunchtime impulse buy from GAME at 39.99, the sales assisstant nearly made me buy a controller too without me registering it in my head until at the last moment I thought to myself that I didnt need one as it was a 2 player game at most and I already had 2 controllers. However I was still kicking myself later as I could have got the game cheaper online at home.

My only other frivilous purchases are DVDs and books. I buy books from Tesco at 2 for £7 and DVDs on offer whenever I see them. Its rare that I buy something new when it is initially released.

The blame has to ultimately lie with the individual but the companies spending millions telling us we want the junk in the first place have to take some of the blame too but then they need to make a living too do they not? The choice we have today is startling compared to what it must have been like in the past. THese millions have to be spent on advertising to give a product a chance but it also serves to inflate the bubble lifestyle of the "American Consumer Dream" of having everything and it seems that people readily chase that dream regardless.

[Rock-n-Roll]

It's sneaky some of the sales pitches and even the strongest of wills are not immune.

I received sales training from a company selling a product at £2000 a pop but it was worth nowhere near that and I was expected to fill peoples heads full of crap and then hit them with the A B option. Option A is £2000 all at once or Option B pay x amount per month at silly apr a month. There are people out their that would take either deal regardless. The training we got gave us answered to dispel the customers every opposition and then guilt them into buying it as it could be damaging their childrens health not to have this product. I left on the 3rd day of training.

I also have worked in debt enforcement for the government and they are now are playing hardball, much harder apparently than the other debt recovery private sector companies do. We routinely sent people to the wall taking 40% of their wages without a second thought and there wasnt much they they could do to stop us once we had decided this was

the fastest way to get the money back.

Lessons I've tried to learn

Dont buy what I dont need or really really want. Dont spend what I havnt got no matter how good the deal seems.

I recently bought Fight Night round for for the Xbox 360 to keep my nephew amused when he stays with me. Was a bit of a lunchtime impulse buy from GAME at 39.99, the sales assisstant nearly made me buy a controller too without me registering it in my head until at the last moment I thought to myself that I didnt need one as it was a 2 player game at most and I already had 2 controllers. However I was still kicking myself later as I could have got the game cheaper online at home.

My only other frivilous purchases are DVDs and books. I buy books from Tesco at 2 for £7 and DVDs on offer whenever I see them. Its rare that I buy something new when it is initially released.

The blame has to ultimately lie with the individual but the companies spending millions telling us we want the junk in the first place have to take some of the blame too but then they need to make a living too do they not? The choice we have today is startling compared to what it must have been like in the past. THese millions have to be spent on advertising to give a product a chance but it also serves to inflate the bubble lifestyle of the "American Consumer Dream" of having everything and it seems that people readily chase that dream regardless.

this is not new

took a couple of american cuzs to the Ulster American folk park recently

one item stuck with me

it told the story of how the emigrants were coaxed to get on the boat with tales of

streets paved with gold, rivers flowing with milk and honey etc

now stories like this would come as no surprise from the captains trying to fill their boats

but it also came from the letters of relatives and friends who had already crossed the sea

even though most of them were still living in abject poverty!

chasing the dream and

not admitting you got it wrong

seems to be hardwired!

rock on!

[Ride_on]

It's sneaky some of the sales pitches and even the strongest of wills are not immune.

The blame has to ultimately lie with the individual but the companies spending millions telling us we want the junk in the first place have to take some of the blame too but then they need to make a living too do they not? The choice we have today is startling compared to what it must have been like in the past. THese millions have to be spent on advertising to give a product a chance but it also serves to inflate the bubble lifestyle of the "American Consumer Dream" of having everything and it seems that people readily chase that dream regardless.

I don't think people should make a living doing something that adds no value, for instance doubling the size of the building industry as we have here now, beyond was was really required, has significant negative consequences.

I certainly don't agree that all products need marketing in its current obvious form. Most marketing these days is just 'Sales', ie sell what you have or can do, rather than figure out what the market needs or wants. I work in an industry that spends alost nothing on marketing (consumer electronics believe it or not), big companies like Philips, Sony etc will do adverts to promote the brand but thats about it, a very small spend per product.

I am still trying to figure out if we need marketing for anything, the music industry business model is an interesting one. If we didn't get the feeling many new songs were popular would we enjoy them as much. In this case marketing maybe replacing social interaction (but IMO in a lying/bad way). ie why don't bands just sell direct on the web and get rid of those marketing budgets, good stuff will sell itself, or do we actually need the marketing to have the enjoyment. Is music just pure branding?

In my general opinion marketing these days just makes you spend your money in the way of the best marketing campaign, it doesn't actually add anything or make any more money to be spent, except perhaps the perceived enjoyment of joining a group you identify with.

It is no longer to do with 'informing the consumer about their options' or 'telling them the relative merits of the vendors products' , it is now just 'buy this product and you will get more sex, or have a happy life like all the other people using it'.

Frankly I think with the Internet, we do not need todays marketing. I fully intend to put a stop to it, but it may take some time.

[VedantaTrader]

I am still trying to figure out if we need marketing for anything, the music industry business model is an interesting one. If we didn't get the feeling many new songs were popular would we enjoy them as much. In this case marketing maybe replacing social interaction (but IMO in a lying/bad way). ie why don't bands just sell direct on the web and get rid of those marketing budgets, good stuff will sell itself, or do we actually need the marketing to have the enjoyment. Is music just pure branding?

I m not debating or disagreeing with your post in general, however, I do believe from a personal point of view that the more popular the music the worse it is. As far as music goes new songs not being popular is a positive musically. Some of the best music is never heard or promoted, infact really fantastic music that has got that near "celestial" element to it might not even be appreciated in the time sphere it exists, sometimes it is decades later that the music can become more popular than it was in its day...I guess the same goes for most truly great art. Sometimes, certain people, rare artists if you like are so misuderstood and ahead of their time that they are not appreciated at the time. Of course I define popular as being played on the radio often and the general populace love it and they achieve short bursts of success at the top of the charts..and then fades away and is written to target a specific group, ie, marketed. I think you are right in what you say regards this type of music as it is probably more like a fashion accessory as in it is cool to "wear" at the time and to be seen to be listening to it. This in my opinion is not in the spirit of real music and will not have any lasting effect on the listener...I m not saying there is not popular great music, however it is rarely in the mainstream...Radiohead I guess you could our popular but in the way that they are played onn the radio often, an album might only get into the top ten for a week or two before falling back.

[headmelter]

About housing tonight.

On now.

[headmelter]

mortgage for £150k and similar houses only making £60k.

[headmelter]

titanic quarter 'investors' look phucked.

[Malthus]

mortgage for £150k and similar houses only making £60k.

TQ getting a go now

[headmelter]

Fatboy never mentioned his own property interests.

[Killer Bunny]

Fatboy never mentioned his own property interests.

You leave my mate Stephen alone. He's allright (now) that he's seen the light. BTW - watch Thursday's show...

[sophia]

You leave my mate Stephen alone. He's allright (now) that he's seen the light. BTW - watch Thursday's show...

Nolan has seen 'the light' he is all bearish now! What a turnaround!

[headmelter]

You leave my mate Stephen alone. He's allright (now) that he's seen the light. BTW - watch Thursday's show...

Will watch with interest.

Stopped listening to him over a year ago because of his ramping but maybe a leopard can change his spots.

He's still fat though.

[wild card]

Is Thursday night a live show with the people from the shows?

[Killer Bunny]

He's still fat though.

I thought he WAS NI when I first saw ihim!

[ravedave]

I thought it was a very restrained program. It didn't go anywhere near as far as it could have done and TBH I was a bit disappointed in its content.

People get into mortgage difficulties through good times and bad - there should have been a bigger point made about the effect on NI rather than the 3 case studies they used. However, its good that these programs are starting to come on and tell the truth.