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Security Staff / Doormen Etc Given Powers To Issue Fines Etc

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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/c...icle6727070.ece

if you are police, do you think it's a good idea?

as a member of the public, ditto?

seems these security staff "fully vetted" will have access to the police national computer too.

is Labour just turning citizen against citizen or is this a sensible step?

I think policing and related enforcement is best left to the police, and if there aren't enough then recruit more police. Simple as that.

Or is this just another tax take ploy?

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It will be abused massively.

Many security staff fit firmly into the bracket of people who like nothing more than to fuel there own ego by belittling others.. trust me I have experienced it first hand more times than I care to mention. Some of them are good people and professional, but a lot of them are bullies, some with tie-ins to criminal goings on who command a lot of (fear based) respect in the local community.. they are good people to have onside if needs be.

This is a really, really bad idea.. crazy in fact. I do not like the direction this society is being coerced into one bit. What the bloody hell are the government playing at!

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It is in fact little different to Hitler's Germany and the so-called "Brown Shirts", or Sturmabteilung

These paramilitaries were used to target those in disfavour.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturmabteilung

Once any organised society moves to empower quasi-officials with any above normal abilities and elevates them outside the normal rules of law, then that society is doomed.

Britain already suffers an increasing body of people not governed by whatever passes for ethics of the police, who in some cases, enjoy greater powers than the police.

A primary ethos of government is that laws are passed by a supposed process of democracy and thereafter implementation, control and enforcement delegated to a variety of bodies: the police; the courts and magistrates and judges.

The system always enjoyed a series of checks and balances to try and avoid abuse.

With such as idiot local council officers now empowered to effectively issue ASBOs on a rubber stamp "Justice" basis and thereby saddle people with a criminal record, we have already seen how such delegated powers have been abused; with a Norfolk farmer whose pigs strayed onto a neighbour's land, an elderly women feeding birds in her backgarden suffering ASBOs: hardly the original concept!

With the track record of "Door Security Staff" in the UK and their involvement in affray, drug pushing, favouritism and violence this must be viewed by anyone concerned with civil rights, as an extremely dangerous step.

Sig heil !

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:angry: WTF?

EventGuard is understood to have spent about £10,000 on the accreditation including uniforms of yellow jackets and T-shirts emblazoned with a logo indicating they are authorised by the police to issue the tickets.

That's ok then, wouldn't want to waste money on something useful like training. Training 25 people to do anything more than boil an egg properly would cost far more than the sums they're talking about.

How long till they get ******ing Tasers

with thanks to uncle rogi:

fascism.jpg

post-5383-1248528279_thumb.jpg

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is this a sensible step?

It's about as sensible as you throwing your cheese away cos it got left out of the fridge!

Seriously, though, when it comes to making me part with cash, some gimp in a yellow jacket telling me he's got permission from the police is not going to cut it.

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Bad idea.

These people have no powers other than being able to issue the ticket.

They also have no power to detain, so refuse your details and walk away......

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Bad idea.

These people have no powers other than being able to issue the ticket.

They also have no power to detain, so refuse your details and walk away......

thats what i was going to say, or have they been given computer access to do person checks and have some powers to detain while the person is "checked" or powers to detain while a constable is summoned to take them in for id verification?

has labour thought this through or was it a back of a fag packet half drunk moment one night at a Commons bar?

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thats what i was going to say, or have they been given computer access to do person checks and have some powers to detain while the person is "checked" or powers to detain while a constable is summoned to take them in for id verification?

has labour thought this through or was it a back of a fag packet half drunk moment one night at a Commons bar?

And police are really going to respond well to a security guard who wants to issue a ticket to someone that's dropped a crisp packet on the floor.

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And police are really going to respond well to a security guard who wants to issue a ticket to someone that's dropped a crisp packet on the floor.

disputes or should i say assaults between door staff and patrons are already a regular occurrence for police to deal with at weekends, can just imagine what a love-in theres gonna be at clubs now that HM Idiot of Justice has given the green light to this. knowing how reluctant most bouncers are to get needlessly physical with patrons, what could possibly go wrong?!

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Guest skullingtonjoe
thats what i was going to say, or have they been given computer access to do person checks and have some powers to detain while the person is "checked" or powers to detain while a constable is summoned to take them in for id verification?

has labour thought this through or was it a back of a fag packet half drunk moment one night at a Commons bar?

Is the most likely case. This has got to be one of the stupidest ideas I`ve ever heard of. :unsure::rolleyes::( :angry:

Next it`ll be mini-guns fitted to CCTV to dish out `

.

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Is the most likely case. This has got to be one of the stupidest ideas I`ve ever heard of. :unsure::rolleyes::( :angry:

Next it`ll be mini-guns fitted to CCTV to dish out `

.

ssshhhhhhhhhh !! :( mods pls delete these last two posts before someone from NuLabour copies it down as policy for a new "crime initiative" !!!

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I have the power to issue fines to HPC members and soon I will use that power. :lol:

I'm waiting to get wheel-clamped so I can bring a prosecution for 'tampering with a motor vehicle' under section 25 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 - against the individual clamper in person, if they ar working for a company. :D

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C'mon guys. Let's be sensible about this. They have to claw back that budget deficit somehow. What next? The Thought Police?

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I dont see how this works. Doormen says "Im giving you a fine" I say "I dont have any money on me" Doormen says "I'll send you a bill, who are you?" I say "Im not telling you" Are they then going to arrest me? And send for the real police?

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Guest skullingtonjoe
I dont see how this works. Doormen says "Im giving you a fine" I say "I dont have any money on me" Doormen says "I'll send you a bill, who are you?" I say "Im not telling you" Are they then going to arrest me? And send for the real police?

Probably.

Nothing would surprise me now <_<

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I'm waiting to get wheel-clamped so I can bring a prosecution for 'tampering with a motor vehicle' under section 25 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 - against the individual clamper in person, if they ar working for a company. :D

interesting, i've learnt more on this forum in a few months than i did at 10 years of school, i shall look that up, nice one :)

C'mon guys. Let's be sensible about this. They have to claw back that budget deficit somehow. What next? The Thought Police?

thats what i suggested above ie tax take

I dont see how this works. Doormen says "Im giving you a fine" I say "I dont have any money on me" Doormen says "I'll send you a bill, who are you?" I say "Im not telling you" Are they then going to arrest me? And send for the real police?

yes here they are...erm...Well done, Labour !

realpolice.jpg

policeconfusion.jpg

notrealpolice.jpg

post-20211-1248558396_thumb.jpg

post-20211-1248558420_thumb.jpg

post-20211-1248558453_thumb.jpg

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I think it's great - I'd love to tell my (potential) grandchildren that I once got banged up in chokey for wearing casual shoes.

Bring it on I say - and, at the end of the day, if you're smart casual, you've got nothing to worry about.

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They quote you can't be given an on the spot fine if you already have a 'record'. Yet they mention stopping traffic etc. Only a police officer (in uniform) can legally stop a driver of a vehicle or bike rider, as per S173 RTA 1988, and then demand their details once stopped.

Being given a fine on the street (by police) doesn't preclude those with criminal records, though. Why should someone with a spent record for a crime not be allowed the same allowance of a ticket over being arrested? You need a power of arrest to be able to take someone into custody to enforce this rule if they refuse to provide their details.

Badly thought out.

I see this rule has been in force for a while............ I've never heard of anyone being 'done' under these new rules.

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Just when I begin to convince myself this government cannot but cannot have the talent to come up with something else that is beyond the pale, BING ..... up pops another stinker.

How about we give some bouncers jurisdiction over the Palace of Westminster, lots of antisocial stuff going on there methinks.

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Nah, the real estate is ok.

How about we get some bouncers to wander in and just chuck all the politicians into the river, except Chloe Smith because she's a wee bit too young to have learnt how to swim yet.

We could get Guy Ritchie to film it and the TMS team to provide a commentary.

"And there goes Manders, SPLOSH."

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It is in fact little different to Hitler's Germany and the so-called "Brown Shirts", or Sturmabteilung

These paramilitaries were used to target those in disfavour.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sturmabteilung

Once any organised society moves to empower quasi-officials with any above normal abilities and elevates them outside the normal rules of law, then that society is doomed.

Britain already suffers an increasing body of people not governed by whatever passes for ethics of the police, who in some cases, enjoy greater powers than the police.

A primary ethos of government is that laws are passed by a supposed process of democracy and thereafter implementation, control and enforcement delegated to a variety of bodies: the police; the courts and magistrates and judges.

The system always enjoyed a series of checks and balances to try and avoid abuse.

With such as idiot local council officers now empowered to effectively issue ASBOs on a rubber stamp "Justice" basis and thereby saddle people with a criminal record, we have already seen how such delegated powers have been abused; with a Norfolk farmer whose pigs strayed onto a neighbour's land, an elderly women feeding birds in her backgarden suffering ASBOs: hardly the original concept!

With the track record of "Door Security Staff" in the UK and their involvement in affray, drug pushing, favouritism and violence this must be viewed by anyone concerned with civil rights, as an extremely dangerous step.

Sig heil !

This was an excellent post. Pretty much says everything I was going to and more. I'll just add two things:

1) This transition to a police state is not 'accidental'. It's not a bunch of foolish bureucrats making a string of poor decisions that take away all your rights and freedoms. That's propaganda. Forget all the rubbish that paints all the top politicians as morons. They are anything but. This thing is global and it's planned. The politicians are just the front men who sell it to you. Anyone who hasn't realised by now that that don't do a damned thing the public wants is naive. The other trick they play is that the party in power continues the agenda of taking everything away from you, whilst the opposition party rallies against it. Of course, once the opposition gets in, it's all change and they're the ones continuing the erosion of your rights.

2) An old 'friend' of mine pointed out a bouncer to me, saying he had seen this guy in prison, and he went by the handle of 'Mike the axe' because he always carried one around with him. These are the type of people we have as 'door security staff'

Sig heil!

Oh... on a related note, has anyone else heard the rumour that traffic wardens are to be given police powers? I haven't seen enough to cinvince myself if it's true or not, but it wouldn't surprise me.

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Ultimately I can't imagine anyone other than other public sector bodies using this, which makes it even more worrying.

I would hope that no private business would want to be associated with the death knell to their trade that this would be. Clubs don't want to **** people off so they won't come back, they want them to come back the very next day when they have sobered up and refilled their wallet.

Councils, on the other hand, would I imagine love to fine people for disorder by standing in the council office arguing that they want their bin emptied or their LHA paid before they get evicted...

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I think bouncers have been giving out on the spot fines for fighting and racist abuse in Manchester for at least the last couple of months .

Not too sure what I think of this to be honest .

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