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Vp Joe Biden Strikes Again! 2nd Time In 2 Weeks.

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Joe Biden: ‘We Have to Go Spend Money to Keep From Going Bankrupt’

Thursday, July 16, 2009

By Penny Starr, Senior Staff Writer

(CNSNews.com) – Vice President Joe Biden told people attending an AARP town hall meeting that unless the Democrat-supported health care plan becomes law the nation will go bankrupt and that the only way to avoid that fate is for the government to spend more money.

“And folks look, AARP knows and the people with me here today know, the president knows, and I know, that the status quo is simply not acceptable,†Biden said at the event on Thursday in Alexandria, Va. “It’s totally unacceptable. And it’s completely unsustainable. Even if we wanted to keep it the way we have it now. It can’t do it financially.â€

“We’re going to go bankrupt as a nation,†Biden said.

“Now, people when I say that look at me and say, ‘What are you talking about, Joe? You’re telling me we have to go spend money to keep from going bankrupt?’†Biden said. “The answer is yes, that's what I’m telling you.†(Listen to Audio)

The event, sponsored by the AARP – which supports the Obama administration’s plan – was attended by mostly AARP members who were bussed in for the meeting.

Biden told the group that the Obama health plan will not eliminate people’s ability to choose their health care insurance and that people who cannot afford insurance will be covered by the plan.

“They’ll be a deal in there so there’s competition, so what you’ll have in there is you’ll have the ability to go in there and say, ‘Now look, this is the policy I want. This is the one,†Biden said.

“And those people who can’t afford to get in there, up to a certain income, we’re going to subsidize them, you get in there and we’ll help you pay for it,†Biden said.

After opening remarks by Biden and AARP CEO A. Barry Rand, the audience asked questions, which were fielded by Biden, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius and Nancy Ann DeParle, director of the White House Office of Health Reform

http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/arti...px?RsrcID=51162

:lol:

This should go down well with the "Obama Administration misread the economy" quote from last week.

Edited by MOP

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Biden is completely right.. but the plebes won't understand how this could make sense, as it is so backwards from what they experience on an individual level.

The shrewd politicians make it sound like they are trying to cut the budget and get things in line, while spending huge amounts of money in reality. Biden seems like the guy who is too honest for his own good, and not thinking how these statements will shock people.

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Biden is completely right.. but the plebes won't understand how this could make sense, as it is so backwards from what they experience on an individual level.

The shrewd politicians make it sound like they are trying to cut the budget and get things in line, while spending huge amounts of money in reality. Biden seems like the guy who is too honest for his own good, and not thinking how these statements will shock people.

Can you explain to me how stealing lots of resources at gunpoint and then throwing them at whatever Obama thinks is a good idea this morning is better than just letting people keep their own money?

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Biden is completely right.. but the plebes won't understand how this could make sense, as it is so backwards from what they experience on an individual level.

The shrewd politicians make it sound like they are trying to cut the budget and get things in line, while spending huge amounts of money in reality. Biden seems like the guy who is too honest for his own good, and not thinking how these statements will shock people.

Instead of governments engineering demand by expanding their own they would be better off allowing their voters to do this naturally by getting tax off their wages.

You can't spend your way out of bankruptcy; you can only work your way out of it.

Edited by chefdave

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I'd like to ask aa3 what happens when you've done this for ages, the government debt hits, say, 200% of GDP and the markets have got so windy of you that interest rates have to be hiked to 15%.

You then have annual interest payments of 30% of GDP.

What happens to the economy when you have to not only service that debt, but take steps to reduce the deficit?

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You can't spend your way out of bankruptcy; you can only work your way out of it.

Bankruptcy of the US state is an interesting idea. It might well be advantageous for the US state and world economy if its accompanied by the full write off, of sovereign debt. Might learn the chinks and ragheads some manners too.

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I'd like to ask aa3 what happens when you've done this for ages, the government debt hits, say, 200% of GDP and the markets have got so windy of you that interest rates have to be hiked to 15%.

You then have annual interest payments of 30% of GDP.

What happens to the economy when you have to not only service that debt, but take steps to reduce the deficit?

Probably why Japan which is now at 200% of gdp, has always undershot on their QE(staying in deflation), for fear of your scenario starting. I believe as time goes by states are starting to think we'll never see interest rates and inflation take off, so the fear is dissapating.

My personal belief that its basically impossible to go too far is based on the technology we have now and its exponential growth. It seems with computers we can over time automate everything, which is profoundly deflationary.

I was reading about a panasonic high def tv factory, which had only 7 workers. The rest was all robots. It seems to me that factory wouldn't be affected by inflationary forces in the same way we're used to. Like producing 10 times the volume of tv's might only increase the costs by double, instead of by 10 times. Otoh land prices are obviously still affected by the growth in the money supply.

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A couple of funny quotes from Market Ticker on this story:

Johnny said

I wonder what the Chinese think about Joe's economic philosophy?

Jata1 said

Actually Joe, the reason we are going bankrupt is because the sheeple elect ****tards like you over and over and over again

Infidel said

Corn Row Joe make Dan Quail look like a MIT Quantum Electrodynamics Professor.

This is what happens to a man after being surrounded by butt lickers and lobbyist for thirty years, he equates power with intelligence. FAIL!

Mo said

What's not to like about Joe? He's everyone's crazy uncle AND he's just one step away from the nuclear football.

:lol::lol::lol:

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Probably why Japan which is now at 200% of gdp, has always undershot on their QE(staying in deflation), for fear of your scenario starting. I believe as time goes by states are starting to think we'll never see interest rates and inflation take off, so the fear is dissapating.

My personal belief that its basically impossible to go too far is based on the technology we have now and its exponential growth. It seems with computers we can over time automate everything, which is profoundly deflationary.

I was reading about a panasonic high def tv factory, which had only 7 workers. The rest was all robots. It seems to me that factory wouldn't be affected by inflationary forces in the same way we're used to. Like producing 10 times the volume of tv's might only increase the costs by double, instead of by 10 times. Otoh land prices are obviously still affected by the growth in the money supply.

if we are so goddamn advanced how come peopel like you keep advocating stealing my money?

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if we are so goddamn advanced how come peopel like you keep advocating stealing my money?

LOL

pwned.

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LOL

pwned.

It's starting to piss me off, how casualy dipshits can lay claim to all my stuff in order to chuck it into the fire of ******** economic fads that have failed only about two or three hundred times since 1850.

aa3 wants me and my family and everyone I ever met dead. It can be the only possible conclusion. Either that or he's never read any history, studied any economics and is in a coma from the neck up.

Edited by Injin

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It's starting to piss me off, how casualy dipshits can lay claim to all my stuff in order to chuck it into the fire of ******** economic fads that have failed only about two or three hundred times since 1850.

aa3 wants me and my family and everyone I ever met dead. It can be the only possible conclusion. Either that or he's never read any history, studied any economics and is in a coma from the neck up.

He doesn't care because the effects haven't hit him where it hurts. Yet.

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if we are so goddamn advanced how come peopel like you keep advocating stealing my money?

:lol::lol::lol:

Injin 1 aa3 0

Next time spell people properly though ;)

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Biden is completely right..

he's not actually. he talks about the risk of bankruptcy, when there is no such risk for a country like the US with it's own currency.

As for your idea of a permanent period of deflation, or i assume from the measures stagflation. IF we do get widespread automation, what do you pay people to do ? full employment in a world dominated by public sector and public sector related OR billions more in social security to pay those left redundant by automation and the desire of big companies to downsize the workforce. Isn't social security where your fiscal stimulus really goes.

Or perhaps spending on education. Free college places for all thse supermarket part-time staff being employed who've got a spare 16 hours a week they don't know what to do with.

As soon as you start giving our govt. tacit approval to go out and spend on infrastructure and education, you get monstrous levels of waste and malinvestment. You've lived through 10 years of it ffs.

Now new labour have only a couple of years to spunk another few billion on consultants fees and other malinvestment before they progress onto their course of balancing the budget....as they can't be trusted with a blank chequebook they need to talk about the dangers of not spending, and yet they are losing this battle so probably won't make the required difference to employment with the stimulus spending.

IT's probably slightly different in the US, where they have need genuine social reform of healthcare. So many billions spent there could make a real difference. But the only difference we ever seem to make from increased spend, is more money in the pockets of lawyers, financiers and consultants, and an appalling increase in the level of beuracracy.

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if we are so goddamn advanced how come peopel like you keep advocating stealing my money?

I'm actually saying to QE until inflation hits 2%.. and you can buy government bonds that yield 4%. So the holders of money would actually be gaining 2% a year for simply holding onto it.

But to throw out some question to question the libertarian ideology taken to an extreme level:

If you've read the work of Henry George.. what gives landowners the right to steal the productivity gains and work that society at large does(like building a nice productive city). When they have not improved the value of their property personally.. its the societal increase.

Also money can't possibly account for everything in a society. Probably the most valueable thing is when a mother gives birth to a child and spends countless hours raising it. Its the continuation of the civilization - and the creation of another consumer in the long run. In a pure money system the value of that is allegedly zero.

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Bankruptcy of the US state is an interesting idea. It might well be advantageous for the US state and world economy if its accompanied by the full write off, of sovereign debt. Might learn the chinks and ragheads some manners too.

Is this post modern irony? its so difficult to tell nowadays.

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It's starting to piss me off, how casualy dipshits can lay claim to all my stuff in order to chuck it into the fire of ******** economic fads that have failed only about two or three hundred times since 1850.

aa3 wants me and my family and everyone I ever met dead. It can be the only possible conclusion. Either that or he's never read any history, studied any economics and is in a coma from the neck up.

sometimes you can think there is no hope with so much idiotic thinking

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if we are so goddamn advanced how come peopel like you keep advocating stealing my money?

Injin you dont have any money or believe in the concept of money, whats your point! :ph34r:

Now new labour have only a couple of years to spunk another few billion on consultants fees and other malinvestment before they progress onto their course of balancing the budget....

Its only around 10 or so months now, not that im counting or anything :lol:

Edited by Johnny Storm

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Can you explain to me how stealing lots of resources at gunpoint and then throwing them at whatever Obama thinks is a good idea this morning is better than just letting people keep their own money?

I'm with you on this, but I'll have a shot anyway.

IMHO, it's all down to velocity. Paying down debt and saving is minimising the amount of transactions taking place. Those transactions are the economy. The ultimate conclusion would be us all sitting at home with no debt and no work. The government thinks it can reverse this by spending your money. The fact they can force you to take on state debt, and then work to service it is no doubt a nice bonus.

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It's starting to piss me off, how casualy dipshits can lay claim to all my stuff in order to chuck it into the fire of ******** economic fads that have failed only about two or three hundred times since 1850.

aa3 wants me and my family and everyone I ever met dead. It can be the only possible conclusion. Either that or he's never read any history, studied any economics and is in a coma from the neck up.

Ooh, someones tired. :blink:

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I'm actually saying to QE until inflation hits 2%.. and you can buy government bonds that yield 4%. So the holders of money would actually be gaining 2% a year for simply holding onto it.

Which would all be stolen from people. The government doesn't have anything of it;s own - it just steals. Any time you say the government shoudl do something, you are saying the government should steal, bully, coerce - this is simply what it does and it is evil.

But to throw out some question to question the libertarian ideology taken to an extreme level:

If you've read the work of Henry George.. what gives landowners the right to steal the productivity gains and work that society at large does(like building a nice productive city). When they have not improved the value of their property personally.. its the societal increase.

Landowning is a mad fallacy, a crazy despotic fantasy backed by the state. Your point here seems to be that because one set of people are stealing, lets' all jump in the pool. Bobbins.

Also money can't possibly account for everything in a society. Probably the most valueable thing is when a mother gives birth to a child and spends countless hours raising it. Its the continuation of the civilization - and the creation of another consumer in the long run. In a pure money system the value of that is allegedly zero.

I'm assuming here you are just throwing random crap out in the hope that I stop banging on about how evil the rubbish you are talking about it.

You want to steal from this mother and child to chuck it into the maw of worthless state spending. Take the kids clothing money of the mother and use it to prop up the state for another 12 seconds, I am certain we will all be much happier in the long run. :angry:

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It's starting to piss me off, how casualy dipshits can lay claim to all my stuff in order to chuck it into the fire of ******** economic fads that have failed only about two or three hundred times since 1850.

aa3 wants me and my family and everyone I ever met dead. It can be the only possible conclusion. Either that or he's never read any history, studied any economics and is in a coma from the neck up.

well, spending works because its all a made up phenomenom.

using all the oil at a greater rate doesnt have the same apparent effect.. it just uses more oil.

spending money on the other hand, keeps people in work, until borrowers really cant borrow any more. then its time for a new currency.

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Any strategy that is aimed at maintaining the US economy in its current form is doomed.

Until the likes of Biden realise that there is going to have to be a major secular shift in how the economy is organised and run, the pain will only get worse.

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Which would all be stolen from people. The government doesn't have anything of it;s own - it just steals. Any time you say the government shoudl do something, you are saying the government should steal, bully, coerce - this is simply what it does and it is evil.

you want to steal from this mother and child to chuck it into the maw of worthless state spending. Take the kids clothing money of the mother and use it to prop up the state for another 12 seconds, I am certain we will all be much happier in the long run. :angry:

I must be reading you too much. I'm beginning to understand your posts.

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Which would all be stolen from people. The government doesn't have anything of it;s own - it just steals. Any time you say the government shoudl do something, you are saying the government should steal, bully, coerce - this is simply what it does and it is evil.

Landowning is a mad fallacy, a crazy despotic fantasy backed by the state. Your point here seems to be that because one set of people are stealing, lets' all jump in the pool. Bobbins.

I'm assuming here you are just throwing random crap out in the hope that I stop banging on about how evil the rubbish you are talking about it.

You want to steal from this mother and child to chuck it into the maw of worthless state spending. Take the kids clothing money of the mother and use it to prop up the state for another 12 seconds, I am certain we will all be much happier in the long run. :angry:

+1

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