Another Little Anecdotal

[Austin Allegro]

Never seen the point of those big monsters. They always seem to be driven by silly yummy mummy types as well. Is it something to do with insecurity?

Personally the smaller the better for me, esp in town. I don't have a car but on hols I hired some tin can called a Matiz, which was about the size of a pram. It was perfect for pottering about the Algarve.

[Joey Buttafueco Jr]

some tin can called a Matiz, which was about the size of a pram. It was perfect for pottering about the Algarve.

Not good for doing reverse J turns >10mph IIRC. Autocar refused to award it any stars as it was so unstable

[dr ray]

I think its the americanization of society, european cars only got big recently

Americans like big things. Folks go on about how the american trucks are absurdly large - theyre not to americans, theyre the same size as the average american saloon car in the 1970s, its just shortsighted fuel economy laws introduced by the carter govt all but outlawed large 'full size' saloon cars forcing everyone to get trucks. Unintended consequences i guess.

If anyones to blame for all these 4x4s its Jimmy carter.

The Americans have big cars because anyone selling into the US would lose 75% of their customer base if they sold a normal size car because the driver (or someone in his family) would not be able to fit into it.

Purely a matter of ar5e size.

Edited July 9, 2009 by dr ray

[CountryMove]

Never seen the point of those big monsters. They always seem to be driven by silly yummy mummy types as well. Is it something to do with insecurity?

Personally the smaller the better for me, esp in town. I don't have a car but on hols I hired some tin can called a Matiz, which was about the size of a pram. It was perfect for pottering about the Algarve.

I think it has a lot to do with insecurity and what other people think

Have you ever read a book called "Enough" by John Naish? I think a lot of HPC-ers would like it, he talks about the 4x4 phenomenon, he also talks about how the desires we have to consume and compete nowadays partly come from how we evolved. I found it interesting

[impatient_mug]

No, I will buy a small 15 years old second handed Fiat or even better a scooter so in the case of an accident I am sure my off-springs will all die ...

What is wrong with an idea that I buy a bigger and stronger car to increase passive safety of my children???

Me and my wife are trying to be responsible drivers and we just want to increase the passive safety of our children. We do not drive to kill!

You are brainless and I claim my 5£!

If this argument is ever taken to it's logical conclusion we're going to need some bigger roads

[yes]

... and HPC shall happen.. guys this is not www.carcrash.co.uk!!

[leftiebeard]

When this lot all goes- it's going to be like one of the Twin Towers going down

Its gonna be grim to watch. There must be '000s of folk tottering on the edge..... I wish them luck, but somehow I think the past is about to catch up with many of them

[Jason]

A range rover sport let me out of a junction this morning, so we can't tar everyone with the same spray gun.

That's my 2p anyway.

[Ron Forthehills]

No, I will buy a small 15 years old second handed Fiat or even better a scooter so in the case of an accident I am sure my off-springs will all die ...

What is wrong with an idea that I buy a bigger and stronger car to increase passive safety of my children???

Me and my wife are trying to be responsible drivers and we just want to increase the passive safety of our children. We do not drive to kill!

You are brainless and I claim my 5£!

It is awkward to make these points to my intellectual superior, but surely it must have crossed your giant brain that the very bulk of your lumbering 'car' which MAY serve to protect your and your brood will at the same time actually imperil the majority of road users who for various reason have elected to drive more modest, sensible vehicles.

Your position suggests that all responsible parents who really DO care for their children are duty-bound to buy a small truck, and when they all have, you are going to need something even bigger and stronger, for this automotive game of conkers. The logical conclusion is that we trundle our kids to school in decommisioned Challenger tanks.

After all, you can't be too careful. Or too selfish.

[Laughing Gnome]

In general I would tend to agree- but this family are "nice" and don't need stuff like that as a status symbol.

What's "nice" about a lazy sow who drives a stonking great 4x4 over a 4 minute walk? Please explain.

[MinceBalls]

Anyhow, back on topic, this is actually quite an interesting anecdote. And there are thousands of similar ones. This is because you haven’t needed cash to buy a car for years, even people WITH cash haven’t used it to buy cars. They simply put a small deposit down and repay the loan on monthly installments. After 2 years or so they sell the car on the second hand market and pay off the rest of the loan with the money from the sale. Works fine until the **** falls out of the second hand premium car market and there is a large shortfall in the difference between the outstanding loan and the amount the car is worth on the second hand market.

My brother just got out at the right time of this, he was dim enough to be paying £800pcm on a BMW Z4 until he realised it was actually costing him £50 every time he got in it (when all the costs were added up as he did little mileage – London based). He sold in 2007 and didn’t quite cover the outstanding loan of £18K – small shortfall of 1K – but if he’d been in the same situation today he’d be about 7K down.

This is happening all over the country with people who thought they had wealth (which was in fact debt) and can’t stump up the difference because they are actually cash poor. And they all try to dump their cars on the market wich drives the prices down and makes the situation worse (or from where i am standing better)

[Joey Buttafueco Jr]

Anyhow, back on topic, this is actually quite an interesting anecdote. And there are thousands of similar ones. This is because you haven’t needed cash to buy a car for years, even people WITH cash haven’t used it to buy cars. They simply put a small deposit down and repay the loan on monthly installments. After 2 years or so they sell the car on the second hand market and pay off the rest of the loan with the money from the sale. Works fine until the **** falls out of the second hand premium car market and there is a large shortfall in the difference between the outstanding loan and the amount the car is worth on the second hand market.

My brother just got out at the right time of this, he was dim enough to be paying £800pcm on a BMW Z4 until he realised it was actually costing him £50 every time he got in it (when all the costs were added up as he did little mileage – London based). He sold in 2007 and didn’t quite cover the outstanding loan of £18K – small shortfall of 1K – but if he’d been in the same situation today he’d be about 7K down.

This is happening all over the country with people who thought they had wealth (which was in fact debt) and can’t stump up the difference because they are actually cash poor. And they all try to dump their cars on the market wich drives the prices down and makes the situation worse (or from where i am standing better)

"even people WITH cash haven’t used it to buy cars"

I did.

[dr ray]

A range rover sport let me out of a junction this morning, so we can't tar everyone with the same spray gun.

That's my 2p anyway.

Were you driving a 12 year old car held together with duct tape?

I use to drive such a car in London and everyone gave me a really wide berth. When I got a newish one it was crashed into twice in the 1st month I had it because other drivers assumed I would give way.

[Bloo Loo]

"even people WITH cash haven’t used it to buy cars"

I did.

I didnt

[Greg Bowman]

Youll probably get better residuals too.

I take pride in not being trendy, but sometimes it makes financial sense to be trendy. In a way its trendy to be not trendy.

Agreed but isn't taking pride in not being trendy just like being trendy?

[MinceBalls]

"even people WITH cash haven’t used it to buy cars"

I did.

Really useful insite again.

I know of people who purchased with cash - very sensible - but plenty more who did it on credit. Part of my point being that credit has become so easy to come by in the last 10 years more and more people have being buying on credit as opposed to saving up like they did in the 'old' days. Debt / credit has made them feel wealthy. But you knew that was my point and you know I wasn't describing EVERYONE in the world.

Thanks very much once again for your useful input.

[Bobajobbob]

Really useful insite again.

I know of people who purchased with cash - very sensible - but plenty more who did it on credit. Part of my point being that credit has become so easy to come by in the last 10 years more and more people have being buying on credit as opposed to saving up like they did in the 'old' days. Debt / credit has made them feel wealthy. But you knew that was my point and you know I wasn't describing EVERYONE in the world.

Thanks very much once again for your useful input.

Beware the generalisation. I've never bought a car on credit in my life. Always cash even for my monster truck.

[Joey Buttafueco Jr]

Thanks very much once again for your useful input.

No problem

[Bloo Loo]

Beware the generalisation. I've never bought a car on credit in my life. Always cash even for my monster truck.

its totally selfish people like you thats causing the credit crunch, dontchaknow.

bankers gotta eat!

course, if everyone paid using cash, then we wouldnt need banks and we wouldnt need to rescue them. just a thought.

Edited July 9, 2009 by Bloo Loo

[loafer]

Surely HPC is full of contrarians, in which case we should be buying 5 litre 4x4's?

That's the way I'm thinking, anyway.

[Joey Buttafueco Jr]

Surely HPC is full of contrarians, in which case we should be buying 5 litre 4x4's?

That's the way I'm thinking, anyway.

I'd rather a 6.2 litre E class (with E180 badge)

[Imp]

It is awkward to make these points to my intellectual superior, but surely it must have crossed your giant brain that the very bulk of your lumbering 'car' which MAY serve to protect your and your brood will at the same time actually imperil the majority of road users who for various reason have elected to drive more modest, sensible vehicles.

Your position suggests that all responsible parents who really DO care for their children are duty-bound to buy a small truck, and when they all have, you are going to need something even bigger and stronger, for this automotive game of conkers. The logical conclusion is that we trundle our kids to school in decommisioned Challenger tanks.

After all, you can't be too careful. Or too selfish.

You need to take into account that a lot of safety features on roads are designed to keep normal sized cars on the road, and on motorways, on their side of the road, if they lose control. Kerbs, armco barriers, bridge parrapets, are less and less useful the larger the vehicle. If you are driving an SUV and go off the road, then that's your look out.

I do object to larger vehicles speeding down the motorways. The amount of destructive energy they carry is phenominal.

[loafer]

I'd rather a 6.2 litre E class (with E180 badge)

Hi, Noel.

I like your thinking, but they only go down to E220 don't they?

Mind you, how about a 6.2l with "Blue Efficiency" badges?

Shame the noise would give you away...

[loafer]

I do object to larger vehicles speeding down the motorways. The amount of destructive energy they carry is phenominal.

I do object to numpties driving small cars at 40mph on both sweeping A roads and in villages. The amount of destructive energy they carry is phenominal.

[MinceBalls]

Beware the generalisation. I've never bought a car on credit in my life. Always cash even for my monster truck.

What do you think anecdote means? Did you read the post? I even pointed out that I wasn’t referring to EVERYONE. How much clearer can I be without inviting you round to my house and explaining very slowly with pictures?

You cannot deny that there are very many people who have bought their car on credit, just because you and Noel haven’t doesn’t change the fact that banks are currently holding onto absolutely millions of car debt. Isn’t this why we got into the banking mess we are in? TOO MUCH CREDIT / debt?

By the way, I have never bought anything on credit – absolutely NOTHING – including my car but so what, its irrelevant when looking at the bigger picture.