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House Price Crash Forum

Don't Expect A Pension From Ibm (or Anyone Else)


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You are right in one sense. I didn't know there was such a thing, but I'm happy to admit it though. Wouldn't have a clue which shares to pick. Even if I did, I would probably lose it all at the crucial moment :lol: .

Don't get me wrong, if people want to invest in such things then fine. I assure you I won't be complaining when I am old and poor. I don't expect to live much past 65 anyway, even IF I get that far. I'm not so much a glass half empty person. More like I've just dropped the glass, and it's shattered on my foot, causing me to bleed to death as I watch the contents of the glass soak into the floorboards. :rolleyes:

Still, musten grumble.

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You are right in one sense. I didn't know there was such a thing, but I'm happy to admit it though. Wouldn't have a clue which shares to pick. Even if I did, I would probably lose it all at the crucial moment :lol: .

Don't get me wrong, if people want to invest in such things then fine. I assure you I won't be complaining when I am old and poor. I don't expect to live much past 65 anyway, even IF I get that far. I'm not so much a glass half empty person. More like I've just dropped the glass, and it's shattered on my foot, causing me to bleed to death as I watch the contents of the glass soak into the floorboards. :rolleyes:

OK, fair enough. good luck to you. Would recommend you read anything by J.C. Bogle on sensible stockmarket funds.

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Only problem with this announcement, it cannot be true.

IBM bids on contracts involving local and national government, so needs a final salary scheme otherwise it couldn't tupe staff across, so there must still be a scheme.

why?

Also there must be thousands of staff already in that position, whose contracts cannot be changed, so they must remain on the scheme.

yes, they will remain on it I guess, it would be closed to new entrants to the scheme

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IBM is going to stop more pension building up, but the pensions accrued to date are still likely to be paid.

Pensions have advantages and disadvantages, as with any investment, but I don't see why it is such a no-brainer to avoid them?

You've provided the answer yourself. Pension provision is supposed to be iron-clad. The fact that the stake money is tax-deductible is not an argument in favour of putting your prospects for old-age prosperity on red.

We know that BTLs won't work as expected because of demographic changes; exactly the same arithmetic applies to pensions -- unless the "endless growth" model fires up again, and keeps going until we retire.

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You've provided the answer yourself. Pension provision is supposed to be iron-clad. The fact that the stake money is tax-deductible is not an argument in favour of putting your prospects for old-age prosperity on red.

We know that BTLs won't work as expected because of demographic changes; exactly the same arithmetic applies to pensions -- unless the "endless growth" model fires up again, and keeps going until we retire.

incorrect on both counts

(1) investing is not the same as gambling, but I accept that this can depend on the individual's knowledge of pension products and underlying funds

(2) UK shares can be chosen to represent international interests - ie one can invest diversly via UK stockmarket funds in international non-UK economies without our underlying demographic constraints. Particularly accessible are Asia-Pacific-ex-Japan index funds at very reasonable costs, for example.

Edited by Si1
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Likely to be paid?!? Likely? That's enough of a reason to avoid them.
We take risks all the time. As you say, crossing the road for example. Handing over money, for someone else to invest for you, over a lifetime of work, in the HOPE that you might get SOME of it back, is not a risk, it's insane.
Pension provision is supposed to be iron-clad. The fact that the stake money is tax-deductible is not an argument in favour of putting your prospects for old-age prosperity on red.

You are looking for certainty in an uncertain world - and you can't get it. Can you really say that any other store of value (gold, house, cash etc) will DEFINITELY be around for your retirement? Gold can stolen, countries can be invaded - things happen. How could anyone possibly say with certainty anything about the world in 30 years' time?! All I can say is that to date MOST people get back MOST of the pension they have been promised.

Just because to your mind there are two outcomes (1 you get your money back, 2 you don't) doesn't mean the chances are 50:50 or it's like putting all your money on red.

It's like people who don't pay into a pension because "I might not live to 65 anyway". In actual fact, around 95% of healthy adults are expected to live to 65 based on current data. But I can't tell you that you will DEFINITELY celebrate your 65th birthday. All I can say is that you are LIKELY to do so, and ought to plan for it.

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