Gordon Brown To Warn G8 Leaders Of Threat Of Second Recession

[interestrateripoff]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...-recession.html

At the Group of Eight summit in Italy, the Prime Minister will sound a pessimistic note about the economic outlook and suggest the limited recovery now under way is weaker than had been hoped.

Saying that the world economy is now at a "pivotal point," Mr Brown will list economic threats that could smother any recovery.

He will warn of the risks from falling trade and investment, growing unemployment and continued problems in the banking sector.

British officials are particularly concerned about oil prices, which have fluctuated wildly in recent months. Having fallen to $33 a barrel in December, oil is now back above $60, and some analysts predict big rises ahead.

Mr Brown will try to win support for new international market rules to ban speculative trading in oil, which officials say threatens to push up prices.

"We have to ensure the oil market does not get ahead of itself and choke off the global economy," said a British official.

At a meeting in France with President Nicholas Sarkozy on Monday, Mr Brown called for new market rules to prevent "undue speculation or speculation that is unfair in the oil market".

Mr Brown and Mr Sarkozy believe world leaders could try to set a "price range" for oil, attempting to set upper and lower limits within which prices could fluctuate.

Greater transparency and predictability in both demand and supply for oil could help smooth out peaks and troughs in the oil price, officials said. The summit should attempt to reduce such "information asymmetry" they said.

UK officials said they expect the G8 to give formal backing to the International Energy Forum, a body that brings together both oil consuming nations and oil producers.

However, they also conceded that trading on the international commodities markets also played a significant part in the volatility of the oil price.

In an attempt to address that, the G8 will debate moves towards common international standards on trading of oil futures contracts, hoping to force speculators and other investors to disclose more information about their positions.

Mr Brown said this week world leaders must "take seriously some of the warning signals that exist in the world economy".

In an interview last night, he added: "This is a second wake-up call for us. We have to deal with the challenge of resuming growth in the world economy."

The summit is being held in L'Aquila, which was struck by an earthquake in April, killing almost 300 people. The region has recently experienced aftershocks and the Italian authorities have prepared contingency plans for evacuating world leaders to Rome in the case of a major shock.

Silvio Berlusconi, the Italian Prime Minister, moved the summit venue to L'Aquila in a last-minute political gesture that has raised concerns about the logistics of the gathering.

Mr Brown, like other world leaders, will be staying in a converted police college building in L'Aquila.

British officials played down suggestions of "barracks" accommodation, saying they were satisfied that the college and other summit buildings had been brought to a suitable standard for the gathering.

Mr Berlusconi has faced criticism over his G8 role since his country has still failed to meet pledges to increase development aid he made at the G8 summit in Gleneagles in 2005.

To increase the pressure on Italy to meet such promises, Britain wants the G8 meeting to agree a new system of public "benchmarks" – regular independently-compiled public updates on how each G8 country is enacting the promises made at summits.

"There is a feeling that the credibility of the G8 depends on reporting on how it has done," said a UK official.

A senior British source denied a report that the UK is pressing for Italy to be kicked out of the G8 because of Mr Berlusconi's poor leadership. "The Italians have been very professional. We have no problem with them," the source said.

Continuing the trend towards larger and larger summit meeting, more than 30 heads of Government will actually attend the G8 meeting this week.

Tomorrow (THURS) the eight original members will be joined by China, India, Brazil, South Africa and Mexico, the "plus five" group of emerging economies.

Those nations have been at G8 meetings since 2006 and the L'Aquila summit is likely to assess their attendance and take another step towards making them formal members of the group.

On Friday, a group of African nations – Algeria, Egypt, Libya, Nigeria and Senegal – will attend for talks about food aid.

The G8 nations are expected to agree a new $15 billion fund to support the development of farming in African and other countries facing food instability. Britain will contribute $1.8 billion from existing aid budgets.

Our dear leader leading the world again. Does this mean we can expect him to take seriously govt debt or is that one warning that can safely be ignored.

The man is delusional.

[THE BALD MAN]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...-recession.html

Our dear leader leading the world again. Does this mean we can expect him to take seriously govt debt or is that one warning that can safely be ignored.

The man is delusional.

He shopudl know about the problems he created them. It pathetic to watch this washed up unelecteced failure of a PM and chancellor pretend to be a world leader. Just resign

[Guest KingCharles1st]

No- this is not possible- I cannot believe what I'm reading.

Any sane person- would realise we aren't even into the first one proper yet.

This man is a gibbering fool

WHY is he still in power... Can't ANYONE important like M15 lose a bullet

[Bloo Loo]

What he is saying is the route to hyperinflation.

What he is saying is we have printed some money. its worked, but not as we had hoped, so the answer, to avoid a fall back, is to do some more.

if he is successful, guess what, the underlying problem is still not fixed, ie, the deflation in perceived wealth, and he will call again for more printing.

this man must be stopped. I think the other nations see him for the fraud he is, thankfully.

[THE BALD MAN]

What he is saying is the route to hyperinflation.

What he is saying is we have printed some money. its worked, but not as we had hoped, so the answer, to avoid a fall back, is to do some more.

if he is successful, guess what, the underlying problem is still not fixed, ie, the deflation in perceived wealth, and he will call again for more printing.

this man must be stopped. I think the other nations see him for the fraud he is, thankfully.

It just shows how undemocratic the Uk is that we have to continue with the unelected leader. At least Mugabe pretends to hold elections.

[Minos]

It just shows how undemocratic the Uk is that we have to continue with the unelected leader. At least Mugabe pretends to hold elections.

What's your favourite - Pepsi or Coca-Cola?

[Patfig]

Maybe the one eyed fool can see more than all of us

[Georgia O'Keeffe]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics...-recession.html

At a meeting in France with President Nicholas Sarkozy on Monday, Mr Brown called for new market rules to prevent "undue speculation or speculation that is unfair in the oil market".

The man is delusional.

Im sure what he means is there should be no speculative buying (coz its evil) allowed in the oil market because its unfair, i'm sure hes fine about shorting.

Just like there should be no speculative shorting (coz its evil) allowed in the equities market because its unfair, i'm sure hes fine about buying.

Hypocritical TW@T

[lowrentyieldmakessense(honest!)]

What he is saying is the route to hyperinflation.

What he is saying is we have printed some money. its worked, but not as we had hoped, so the answer, to avoid a fall back, is to do some more.

if he is successful, guess what, the underlying problem is still not fixed, ie, the deflation in perceived wealth, and he will call again for more printing.

this man must be stopped. I think the other nations see him for the fraud he is, thankfully.

history

http://mises.org/books/inflationinfrance.pdf

[Minos]

A second recession? When did the current one end?

[cynic]

A second recession? When did the current one end?

These are concurrent.

[Minos]

These are concurrent.

A recession super highway you mean?

[dr ray]

history

http://mises.org/books/inflationinfrance.pdf

Thanks

I have just read the first few pages.

It's a shame Gordon Brown hasn't

The story of "Fiat Money Inflation in France" is one of

great interest to legislators, to economic students, and to

all business and thinking men. It records the most gigantic

attempt ever made in the history of the world by a government

to create an inconvertible paper currency, and to

maintain its circulation at various levels of value. It also

records what is perhaps the greatest of all governmental

efforts—with the possible exception of Diocletian's—to

enact and enforce a legal limit of commodity prices*. Every

fetter that could hinder the will or thwart the wisdom of

democracy had been shattered, and in consequence every

device and expedient that untrammelled power and unrepressed

optimism could conceive were brought to bear.

But the attempts failed. They left behind them a legacy

of moral and material desolation and woe, from which one

of the most intellectual and spirited races of Europe has

suffered for a century and a quarter, and will continue to

suffer until the end of time.

Written in 1912

* Gordon Brown is reported today as pushing for price controls on oil

[Minos]

Thanks

I have just read the first few pages.

It's a shame Gordon Brown hasn't

Written in 1912

* Gordon Brown is reported today as pushing for price controls on oil

Here come the shortages.

[Tim Miller]

No- this is not possible- I cannot believe what I'm reading.

Any sane person- would realise we aren't even into the first one proper yet.

This man is a gibbering fool

WHY is he still in power... Can't ANYONE important like M15 lose a bullet

Would that be to put him out of his misery or our misery?

[Meerkat]

Now, where are the guys who say the free market is a myth? A myth is centralised planning as it is futile and always, without an exception, fails. Free markets do work; it is exactly the opposite of the free market that does not work.

[Bloo Loo]

history

http://mises.org/books/inflationinfrance.pdf

very interesting....i like the bit where corrupt powers are guillotined.

[Minos]

very interesting....i like the bit where corrupt powers are guillotined.

The lack of manufacturing in this country means we no longer have the knowledge/skills to make them. Cunning sods.

[dr ray]

history

http://mises.org/books/inflationinfrance.pdf

More interesting passages from this book:

But this current in

favor of paper money became so strong that an effort was

made to breast it by a compromise: and during the last

months of 1789 and the first months of 1790 came discussions

in the National Assembly looking to issues of notes based

upon the landed property of the Church, which was to be

confiscated for that purpose. But care was to be taken; the

issue was to be largely in the shape of notes of 1,000, SOO

and 200 livres, too large to be used as ordinary currency,

but of convenient size to be used in purchasing the Church

lands; besides this, they were to bear interest and this would

tempt holders to hoard them.

So in post revolutionary France the issue of fiat money was backed by land confiscated from the Church. As far as I can see the issuance of paper money now is not backed by any assets at all. It is backed by the future labour of the current population and of their descendants who will have to pay interest to the people who accept our fiat currency. This means we and our children are essentially being sold as slaves.

Edited July 8, 2009 by dr ray

[interestrateripoff]

Now, where are the guys who say the free market is a myth? A myth is centralised planning as it is futile and always, without an exception, fails. Free markets do work; it is exactly the opposite of the free market that does not work.

Sorry too many paradoxes in the free market, monopolies get created they seek protection, a state give good protection back to square one again.

If you can stop the paradoxes from forming the free market will work, but that requires some sort of organisation to regulate effective, which requires power. Lets say a govt.

Back to square one again.

Govt exits for a reason but that reason gets distorted by power.

[THE BALD MAN]

Sorry too many paradoxes in the free market, monopolies get created they seek protection, a state give good protection back to square one again.

If you can stop the paradoxes from forming the free market will work, but that requires some sort of organisation to regulate effective, which requires power. Lets say a govt.

Back to square one again.

Govt exits for a reason but that reason gets distorted by power.

Good point. Banks are a prime example. Put into monopolistic position by banking regulations they then pretend they are in operate in a free market. When they fail they say we cannot fail because they are too important and we have to bail them out.

[THE BALD MAN]

Now, where are the guys who say the free market is a myth? A myth is centralised planning as it is futile and always, without an exception, fails. Free markets do work; it is exactly the opposite of the free market that does not work.

It is a myth beause it always reverts to a monopolistic market without governmnet intervention. This is opposed to banks which pretend to be in a free market but only operate profitably because of government regulation restricting the market.

[Neil B]

How can we have a second recession while we havent recovered from the one we are still in?

[Patfig]

Sorry too many paradoxes in the free market, monopolies get created they seek protection, a state give good protection back to square one again.

If you can stop the paradoxes from forming the free market will work, but that requires some sort of organisation to regulate effective, which requires power. Lets say a govt.

Back to square one again.

Govt exits for a reason but that reason gets distorted by power.

So what's the ideal?

[dr ray]

So what's the ideal?

The risk with banks was recognised from the beginning. It was only in relatively recent times (Edwardian? I can't remember now) they were allowed to operate as limited companies. Until then the shareholders were liable for unlimited losses - much like Lloyds names are still today.

It would be unfair to introduce this retrospectively on existing shareholders but a move in this direction would focus the mind of anyone planning to speculate on bank shares or risk the banks assets.