Realistbear Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 (edited) http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/poli...icle6644667.ece From The Times July 6, 2009 Recession may get worse, Gordon Brown warns world leaders Nicolas Sarkozy and Gordon Brown (GERARD CERLES) President Sarkozy and Gordon Brown will be testing their new-found 'entente formidable' at a summit in Evian Sam Coates, Chief Political Correspondent; David Charter in Brussels The worst of the recession may be yet to come and world leaders are in danger of hampering the recovery, Gordon Brown will say today......./ "May" get worse? Unemployment soaring, GDP tanking, IR on the verge of taking off due to deficits, failure to loosen credit.... The idea that green shoots would appear before the troubles really began was the most absurd idea since believing WW1 was going to be over before Christmas. Interesting how Brown is already laying the groundwork for blame shifting on other world leaders. Edited July 6, 2009 by Realistbear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Deflation Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 The recession's hardly begun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazuya Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Aren't the BoE already contemplating printing another £150bn to grow the green shoots? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I think it's more to do with the fact Brown is going to have to slash public sector pay. This way he can claim it's not his fault, the situation has got worse, maybe because of America but it's a global problem and we are all going to have to cut back, meanwhile govt spending will increase by real terms of 0% and the Tories would would cut everything by 10%. Delusional liar. The tax revenue is clearly collapsing debt deflation about to enter the arena? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Aren't the BoE already contemplating printing another £150bn to grow the green shoots? What to shove straight into the financial blackhole? The public will soon start to question what's happening to the money, as clearly it's not getting to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr ray Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Hi RB. Not heard from you for a while. I think there is a realisation that the money printing so far has not worked. Asset prices still dropping - which makes the banks bad debts worse, which in turn reflects on the real economy due to contraction in credit availability. GB is pushing for "just one more roll of the dice" Another concerted push at currency debasement and media manipulation. He only has a few months to engineer a faux recovery so will risk everything now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kazuya Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 What to shove straight into the financial blackhole?The public will soon start to question what's happening to the money, as clearly it's not getting to them. As long as house prices rise, the public won't care but I think the house price crash so far has been due to the credit crunch. The recessionary house price crash is about to start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piece of paper Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 They should heed his words. He is a world leader with considerable experience of making things wore. p-o-p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realistbear Posted July 6, 2009 Author Share Posted July 6, 2009 Hi RB. Not heard from you for a while.I think there is a realisation that the money printing so far has not worked. Asset prices still dropping - which makes the banks bad debts worse, which in turn reflects on the real economy due to contraction in credit availability. GB is pushing for "just one more roll of the dice" Another concerted push at currency debasement and media manipulation. He only has a few months to engineer a faux recovery so will risk everything now. 15TR, maybe a lot more, has gone into the black hole. The world has been living on credit, derivatives and hedge funds for decades and its time to pay it back. This is going to be a generational recession based on the Lancashire maxim: OWT for NOWT. The size of the catastrophe is well beyond Brown's ability to correct. It would be like trying to reverse gravity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DabHand Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 What to shove straight into the financial blackhole?The public will soon start to question what's happening to the money, as clearly it's not getting to them. It was never supposed to, remember? I am still ambivalent about the difference between money purely printed (with no pretence), and spent into the system, and money borrowed into existence (by selling treasuries to yourself with money that you printed), and spent into the system with no likelihood of it ever being paid back. Especially where in this case you would be having to destroy the money once you had drawn it out of the system. How likely is that when their so many utopia's to build, so many votes to buy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HAIR BEAR CRUNCH Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 As long as house prices rise, the public won't care but I think the house price crash so far has been due to the credit crunch.The recessionary house price crash is about to start. nice you may have atarted a new phrase there , recession hpc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyHead Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 "will demand that fellow heads of government “sound a second-wake up call for the world economyâ€. " The SOB is gonna try to get another stimulus. Gordon Brown is nuts! Rather than actually question his method, he's just thinking his analysis is right, but the response simply needs to be bigger. Why isn't anyone in government/civil service going to stop this nutter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbga9pgf Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 "will demand that fellow heads of government “sound a second-wake up call for the world economyâ€. "The SOB is gonna try to get another stimulus. Gordon Brown is nuts! Rather than actually question his method, he's just thinking his analysis is right, but the response simply needs to be bigger. Why isn't anyone in government/civil service going to stop this nutter? You have nailed it. the BOE burned their last 25 Billion this month and the government need more cash off the BOE or we are all in deep do-do. FTSE fall until announcement of further fiscal stimulus, then depending on how the market take it, bounce back to 4500 or perhaps cynical apprehension that QE is not working and further falls? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord D'arcy Pew Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Yes it'll all be over by Xmas. Soften them up with a barrage of Quantitative Easing and our plucky lads will stroll right up to the enemy trenches. A great plan that can not possibly go wrong, old bean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 The late great Cgnao said the 'printing' would never keep up with the black hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbga9pgf Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 The late great Cgnao said the 'printing' would never keep up with the black hole. I agree! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 The SOB is gonna try to get another stimulus. Gordon Brown is nuts! This is Brown's Hitler moment if he can't be PM then no else every should be he'll destroy the country first. The Queen needs to act and act fast and declare that she no longer has faith in her govt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CokeSnortingTory Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Well, they can't print their way out by any measured, pseudo-scientific method. To print their way out they need to open the floodgates until the money overflows. Not that I want to give them any encouragement....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 What to shove straight into the financial blackhole? Financial blackhole + bankers slush funds + offshore lairs for when the sh*t really hits the fan. They won't be safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyHead Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 The late great Cgnao said the 'printing' would never keep up with the black hole. The printing money is the black hole. That's the point. We've been expanding the monetary base by printing, low IR's and loosening credit standards for so long, no one in the establishment even realises it's bad anymore. Decades of inflationary monetary policy, all based on flawed economic theory. Fiddling the figures, changing the basket of goods to artificialy lower inflation numbers. Including consumption as part of our GDP, and then using those falsehoods to justify increasing the money supply, so our politicians can pretend to be Santa Claus, pouring more money into every vote winning cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abharrisson Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I think it's more to do with the fact Brown is going to have to slash public sector pay.This way he can claim it's not his fault, the situation has got worse, maybe because of America but it's a global problem and we are all going to have to cut back, meanwhile govt spending will increase by real terms of 0% and the Tories would would cut everything by 10%. Delusional liar. The tax revenue is clearly collapsing debt deflation about to enter the arena? I don;t really care what excuse is used as long as our bloated public sector is cut and cut hard.. freeze the salaries, stop final salary pensions, get rid of the quangos, slice off the x'000 extra non-frontline staff employed by labour etc etc... we are spending fortunes more than we need to produce exactly the same service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord D'arcy Pew Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Let me see if this is right. Credit money was created without human labour or assets backing it (only having possible future worth). QE money is also not backed by anything tangible (except paper and ink). Now one is being used to pay off another, isn't this like a mathematician multiplying by zero? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellerkat Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Now one is being used to pay off another, isn't this like a mathematician multiplying by zero? It'll end up as dividing by zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theboltonfury Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 (edited) I am quite worried. There was no way this mess was going to be over in a few months. Very concerned that the methodone replacement plan looks set to continue though. Edited July 6, 2009 by theboltonfury Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interestrateripoff Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I don;t really care what excuse is used as long as our bloated public sector is cut and cut hard.. freeze the salaries, stop final salary pensions, get rid of the quangos, slice off the x'000 extra non-frontline staff employed by labour etc etc... we are spending fortunes more than we need to produce exactly the same service. Which will in turn cause even more job losses in the private sector. The web of govt support keeping afloat private business is immense. At a bbq yesterday and one was saying he had a contract with the job centre for the heating which was worth £80k a year to him suddenly that contract has ended as they have stopped spending. Cuts are coming but it's going to be vicious circle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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