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zebbedee

A Question About Benifits Implications Of Gold

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I believe that gold sovereigns and britannias are exempt from capital gains tax as they are legal tender but what is the score when it comes to being assessed for say unemployment benifit. Say you have 30 x britannias, would that be counted as about £18k or do they have to only look at the face value as it is currency. The fact someone would give you £18k doesn't change the fact it's only £3k surely?

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Zebbedee,

It is common coin amongst holders of gold that you don't tell anybody you hoard.

This is sound common sense when it comes to security.

Under, and off, the radar is best advice.

Oh, I'm sorry, I just noticed I have gone off topic and failed to answer your question.

Please accept my apologies.

I couldn't possibly advise you to hide funds from the government.

I'm outraged that you should ask such a question, shame on you.

GO AWAY

Edited by DiggerUK

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Hi - apart from just keeping them out of sight, which would be the most sensible solution, there was a defining case in the US which came down on the side of the employees who'd been apid in gold coins. The courts took the face value - if you really want to go that route!

Best wishes

GoldenEagle

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I was just curious and have no intention of telling anyone, but it came up in a conversation with a friend who is a 'tax specialist' and he said that they'd count the market value but he also said you'd have to pay capital gains.

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I was just curious and have no intention of telling anyone, but it came up in a conversation with a friend who is a 'tax specialist' and he said that they'd count the market value but he also said you'd have to pay capital gains.

Not on Sterling you don't.

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I believe that gold sovereigns and britannias are exempt from capital gains tax as they are legal tender but what is the score when it comes to being assessed for say unemployment benifit. Say you have 30 x britannias, would that be counted as about £18k or do they have to only look at the face value as it is currency. The fact someone would give you £18k doesn't change the fact it's only £3k surely?

Get some Nobles - face value is 33p (6s6d)

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I was just curious and have no intention of telling anyone, but it came up in a conversation with a friend who is a 'tax specialist' and he said that they'd count the market value but he also said you'd have to pay capital gains.

If you tell them they would count their market value. If you dont tell them they don't. You should not tell your accountant about these either because he is then obliged in law to grass you up.

There have been attempts in the UK by employers to save tax by paying in legal tender gold coins but the HMRC did not accept this.

It makes you sick that someone like me who saves for his disabled daughters future care has to find ways for her not to be denied means tested benefits while if I went out and blew it all on pointlessly expensive cars and electronic goods she would have no problem getting all the benefits she needs.

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If you tell them they would count their market value. If you dont tell them they don't. You should not tell your accountant about these either because he is then obliged in law to grass you up.

There have been attempts in the UK by employers to save tax by paying in legal tender gold coins but the HMRC did not accept this.

It makes you sick that someone like me who saves for his disabled daughters future care has to find ways for her not to be denied means tested benefits while if I went out and blew it all on pointlessly expensive cars and electronic goods she would have no problem getting all the benefits she needs.

Cheers, I figured they would the feckers but couldn't trust the mates knowledge on the matter coz of the lack of capital gains knowledge.

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There have been attempts in the UK by employers to save tax by paying in legal tender gold coins but the HMRC did not accept this.

Dr ray,

Could you cite the case(s) to which you refer ?

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Dr ray,

Could you cite the case(s) to which you refer ?

I read it a while ago - pre internet. I'll do some research and post a link if I find one

Seems to be possible in US from the google search I did.

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I found this on the HMRC website

VATFIN2220 - Money (including transfer of money) and related services: Interpreting Item 1: What is meant by "money"

“Money†comprises coins or banknotes, in sterling or any other currency, when supplied as legal tender in a financial transaction. For the purposes of this item, the term does not apply to numismatic or gold coins (although they may be covered by the investment gold exemption (Public Notices 701/21 Gold and 701/21A investment Gold Coins) or coins and banknotes, which are not legal tender.

Please note that under Council Regulation No 1777/2005 with effect from 1 July 2006 platinum nobles are also excluded.

If I understand it this means that even if a gold coin is legal tender it is still not considered money and therefore subject to the same restriction as payment in non-cash goods

This is covered on a different web page

1. The 1994 Finance Act introduced legislation which requires employers to operate PAYE on remuneration in non-cash forms such as gold bars and other assets which can easily be turned into cash. Certain payments by intermediaries and offshore employers were also brought within the scope of PAYE at that time. Since 1994 increasingly complex and artificial schemes have been developed in an attempt to take payments in non-cash form outside PAYE. 2. The aim of these schemes is to put cash into the hands of the employees but take the remuneration outside the scope of PAYE so that the tax due is deferred and does not have to be paid until after the end of the tax year. Such schemes are generally founded on a narrow interpretation of the anti-avoidance rules which is not accepted by the Inland Revenue. The Chancellor's proposals clarify and extend the 1994 legislation to put beyond doubt that PAYE applies where employees are paid in assets which can readily be converted into cash.

I haven't found anything about legal tender silver. Of course there is VAT on these so the saving after dealer margins will be negligible

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I found this on the HMRC website

If I understand it this means that even if a gold coin is legal tender it is still not considered money and therefore subject to the same restriction as payment in non-cash goods

This is covered on a different web page

I haven't found anything about legal tender silver. Of course there is VAT on these so the saving after dealer margins will be negligible

Thank you for taking the trouble of doing the research, dr ray.

I am somewhat familiar with recent legislation and HMRC rules, however I was not aware of any case(s) you alluded to. If you could find any citation(s) I would be very grateful.

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