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Are Thge Post-house-price-boom Generations More Right Wing, Or More Left Wing?

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Are people under the age of 35, or maybe under 30, affected by student debt and unaffordable house purchase, and "pensions apartheid" (unavailability of final salary pension schemes, whether private or public sector) more right wing as a result?

Could this be politically significant if so?

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Are people under the age of 35, or maybe under 30, affected by student debt and unaffordable house purchase, and "pensions apartheid" (unavailability of final salary pension schemes, whether private or public sector) more right wing as a result?

Could this be politically significant if so?

I don't think the young consider politics in the way previous generations did, because the difference between right and left is not so much debated as it once was. We have lived in a two party state since 1979 and you cant put a fag paper between them. It's just tweedle dum and tweedle dee. Nobody's looking further than Micheal Jackson at the moment

Edited by wheresmyfoxhole

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Are people under the age of 35, or maybe under 30, affected by student debt and unaffordable house purchase, and "pensions apartheid" (unavailability of final salary pension schemes, whether private or public sector) more right wing as a result?

Could this be politically significant if so?

I don't know if it is restricted to the "young", all over Europe there has been a big upswing in support for Right Wing parties. This is what happens when things get tough, politics starts to polarise. We have been through 10 years of relative stability (9/11 etc notwithstanding) and there was very little to choose between the parties. I think we may well see the Tories setting out a far more right wing manifesto when the next GE happens, tough decisions bla bla bla.

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I notice among young people who have been successful(like gotten a good career going), they are radically right wing and anti-union. Because the unions and the government haven't hired young people for decades they are seen as simply hindrances and leeches to the young people I am thinking of. How they talk is like the corporate leaders opinion of government and unions. Because of course those corporate leaders are the elders this group of young works with.

I'm sure it would be a very different story in a world where millions of the younger generation had gotten into the unions and were enjoying high wages/cheap housing like the older generation did.

Among the millions of young who got left out in the cold and expected to work for £5 an hour partime.. I see mainly cynicism to politics. I still think deep down this group is a time bomb for a future dictator(left or right) to ride to power on.

Edited by aa3

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I don't think the young consider politics in the way previous generations did, because the difference between right and left is not so much debated as it once was. We have lived in a two party state since 1979 and you cant put a fag paper between them. It's just tweedle dum and tweedle dee. Nobody's looking further than Micheal Jackson at the moment

Yes; I remember the 2005 election and trying to work out what difference there was between the Labour and Tory manifestos.

Iraq war.. both in favour.

ID cards .. both in favour.

Economy.. no discernable differences

Foriegn policy .. both up America's backside

etc..

etc ..

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Guest Parry

I think there has been a realisation that social engineering from the toxic mix of pseudo-socialism in collaboration with big business does not work any more, nor did it ever. It is now so corrupt, both direct corruption and institutionalised corruption, that most age groups are looking for a more natural and fair alternative.

Unfortunately, this often means many are vulnerable to the rhetoric of far-right or far-left political factions. Extremism is not the answer. Careful planning and objective, fully inclusive human scale development is the answer and I'm afraid that will not come from extremism or coercion.

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Dont know about post/pre boom, but it seems mostly liberals pushing all this daft 'Liverpool city of culture' - apartments therefore worth £250k - then moving on to all this Stratford Olympic city rubbish. Often these BTL adverts trumpeted the green credentials of the blocks of flats (not sure whats green about floorspace lying empty) or the diversity of areas or other waffle. I cant think many conservatives would buy into an area on anything other than solid educational performance, reasonable community charge and low crime stats.

On the other hand, much of this regeneration stuff was invented in the 80s, although i would struggle to call Thatcher a conservative.

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Dont know about post/pre boom, but it seems mostly liberals pushing all this daft 'Liverpool city of culture' - apartments therefore worth £250k - then moving on to all this Stratford Olympic city rubbish. Often these BTL adverts trumpeted the green credentials of the blocks of flats (not sure whats green about floorspace lying empty) or the diversity of areas or other waffle. I cant think many conservatives would buy into an area on anything other than solid educational performance, reasonable community charge and low crime stats.

On the other hand, much of this regeneration stuff was invented in the 80s, although i would struggle to call Thatcher a conservative.

but wasn't the conservative view that city centre apartments are handy for young white collar people to be close to work shops and bars, whereas the left wing view is that some kind of urban hippie vibe is the thing, you know, The Young Ones, Camden etc - centrally managed of course

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but wasn't the conservative view that city centre apartments are handy for young white collar people to be close to work shops and bars, whereas the left wing view is that some kind of urban hippie vibe is the thing, you know, The Young Ones, Camden etc - centrally managed of course

haha, what they are marketed for, and who theyll end up housing are two different things.

I would guess most young white collar workers vote Libdem though, if they vote at all. Arent libdem generally regarded as the 'yuppie' party?

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I notice among young people who have been successful(like gotten a good career going), they are radically right wing and anti-union.

Do you live in the US? Most people here join unions for legal cover and discounts on insurance. We don't do union hiring halls and seniority, it makes no sense without a closed shop.

Look, young people with money are always radical libertarians. They were in the early 1960s as well (there is a scene about this in A Hard Day's Night where Victor Spinetti, playing the out-of-touch TV producer complains he can't figure out how to be terribly right-wing but caring at the same time). This was the first time young people had disposable incomes and of course they wanted to keep it for themselves. Same thing in the 80s as well. It seems to alternate with more lefty concerns.

The last notable outburst prior to "pwopperdee developer" 2006ish was during the dotcom boom. Eventually they discover their luck doesn't always hold, they have frailties, responsibilities and all of sudden they realise they aren't Ayn Randian supermen at all but someone whose stock options are worthless and whose job is perilously close to being outsourced. There are no atheists in foxholes and no libertarians with with kids and a redundancy notice in their pocket.

Its something people have been growing out of like clockwork for decades, same with the eco-hippy stuff.

Edited by Cogs

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To the extent we're interested in politics at all (I'll generously call myself 'young' at 27). It tends to be less government interference in your life, with odd hypocritical stances on a particular issue.

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I'm 34. I see our party political system, with its dubious left/right division as completely irrelevant.

All the parties stand for the status quo as regards the biggest issue facing the country: the future of the monetary system and the financial sector. The only differences between them are minor differences of emphasis.

I would happily support the money reform party, but since they garner less electoral support than various parties I would consider "joke" parties - Monster raving loonies etc, it makes the whole electoral system irrelevant to me.

So right/left? Who cares?

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"Left wing" and "right wing" are just arbitrary terms that politicians use to misrepresent each other's views in a pathetic attempt to score points over each other. They have no useful meaning.

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Guest Steve Cook
Are people under the age of 35, or maybe under 30, affected by student debt and unaffordable house purchase, and "pensions apartheid" (unavailability of final salary pension schemes, whether private or public sector) more right wing as a result?

Could this be politically significant if so?

The under thirties are more "right wing" only in the sense that they are more apolitical than previous generations. Being such, they are less inclined to look at the wider political context within which they must live their lives. This kind of narrow world-view tends to be the friend of the capitalist state. Which is probably why it has been fostered.

I would go further and say that this de-politicisation of the mass of the population actually began when Thatcher first came to power and has increased under Labour ever since. However, my guess is that a whole new generation will re-discover their political antennae as a consequence of the hardship that is to come.

Whether such politicisation rewards them with real social and political change or merely earns them a rubber bullet and a place on the DNA database remains to be seen. The trouble is that the state is not going to be in a position to maintain our lifestyles as it is. The best it can do, if it is inclined (or is forced) is to more equitably share out a shrinking pile of resources.

I am not hopeful

Edited by Steve Cook

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Teacher at son's school asked who thought there was too much immigration into the UK. All put their hand up. He commented on "Nick Griffin'll do well" and one of the girls has to ask who he was.

:-/

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what's great about Labour's complete collapse and failure is that it will breed a whole generations of libertarians.

people who think government is glorious and good have seen what damage it does, that there is no free lunch from slimey politicians like Tony Blair promising schools'n'hospitals, that politics particularly left wing politics has been exposed as the sham it is. That governments cannot wave a magic wand and improve health and education services by edict in Whitehall, the fallacy has been utterly ended by the economic realities of a bankrupt government and a bankrupt state.

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"Left wing" and "right wing" are just arbitrary terms that politicians use to misrepresent each other's views in a pathetic attempt to score points over each other. They have no useful meaning.

I couldn't agree more. When I was a lad many moons ago the choice was (or at least looked) left or right. Now they have all just merged in to one centre. When Thatcher more or less gave the nod to Blair I think it confirmed it. I agree with the view that only true monetary reform will achieve anything but I wont hold my breath-both sides are in bed with the same people and have been for a while now. Incest really.

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what's great about Labour's complete collapse and failure is that it will breed a whole generations of libertarians.

people who think government is glorious and good have seen what damage it does, that there is no free lunch from slimey politicians like Tony Blair promising schools'n'hospitals, that politics particularly left wing politics has been exposed as the sham it is. That governments cannot wave a magic wand and improve health and education services by edict in Whitehall, the fallacy has been utterly ended by the economic realities of a bankrupt government and a bankrupt state.

History suggests they are more likely to become communists.

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I find myself (35) to be quite right wing.

However when I talk to friends/relatives who are mostly left wing (due to being from the NE) I find I'm usually more left wing then them.

The point being, that most people flip/flop depending on what they beleive is best for themselves. Ie most people (probably including myself) are hypocrits.

* new computer + no ff spellcheck = dont give a shyte.

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the less politicans do, the better.

the conservative government will still attempt to 'govern' and 'run things' so sadly, it will continue to do damage but cannot possibly be worse than Brown who is running a massively damaging scorched earth policy, trying to keep things going so they can force through the Lisbon Treaty and return as unelected autocrats under President Blair.

What we need to get across to people is that the concept of a politician in whitehall 'running' the health service is abhorrent and cannot ever work. The economic realities of being bankrupt will expose this most and sooner or later we have to rebalance our economy and reduce the size of the state which is now half of GDP and extremely damaging

One of the first things we need to do though is obviously withdraw from the monsterous EU, otherwise Mr. Cameron won't have much to govern.

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The under thirties are more "right wing" only in the sense that they are more apolitical than previous generations. Being such, they are less inclined to look at the wider political context within which they must live their lives. This kind of narrow world-view tends to be the friend of the capitalist class. Which is probably why it has been fostered.

I would go further and say that this de-politicisation of the mass of the population actually began when Thatcher first came to power and has increased ever since. However, my guess is that a whole new generation will re-discover their political antennae as a consequence of the hardship that is to come.

Whether such politicisation rewards them with real social and political change or merely earns them a rubber bullet and a place on the DNA database remains to be seen.

I am not hopeful

Apolitical, or just pragmatic. Maybe we finally realise we are just worker ant drones subjected to the will of the elite, and its a waste of time trying to change the world.

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Guest Steve Cook
Apolitical, or just pragmatic. Maybe we finally realise we are just worker ant drones subjected to the will of the elite, and its a waste of time trying to change the world.

You have been culturally programmed well grasshopper...... ;)

Now get back to your grindstone...there's a good drone

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The under thirties are more "right wing" only in the sense that they are more apolitical than previous generations. Being such, they are less inclined to look at the wider political context within which they must live their lives. This kind of narrow world-view tends to be the friend of the capitalist state. Which is probably why it has been fostered.

I would go further and say that this de-politicisation of the mass of the population actually began when Thatcher first came to power and has increased under Labour ever since. However, my guess is that a whole new generation will re-discover their political antennae as a consequence of the hardship that is to come.

Whether such politicisation rewards them with real social and political change or merely earns them a rubber bullet and a place on the DNA database remains to be seen. The trouble is that the state is not going to be in a position to maintain our lifestyles as it is. The best it can do, if it is inclined (or is forced) is to more equitably share out a shrinking pile of resources.

I am not hopeful

isn't that just assuming that politics equals govt involvement?

I would say that taking an independent world view is a libertarian stance - definitely political

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History suggests they are more likely to become communists.

the communism that E Europe got in early 20th C was just Bolshevik Fascism, and what the rest tried at the time was more honestly and openly fascist. The BNP are that way, nationalist/collectivist. Abhorent, but people DO lean to that in times of hardship.

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