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http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/jun/0...ts-minimum-wage

Another example of people on low pay being denied the opportunity to improve their lot. These companies just can't stand the idea of their staff earning anything more than an absolute pittance; it's perverse.

As they say it's usually those earning the least that do the majority of the work.

Disgusting.

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I always tip in cash, hand it directly to the person that served me- I never just add a tip to the bill.

It is diffcult to account for this cash transaction when claiming the tip as a tex deduction though.

Edited by Bardon

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I always tip in cash, hand it directly to the person that served me- I never just add a tip to the bill.

Sometimes employers insist this money is handed over and counted as wages. Retaining tips against company policy may result in disciplinary action.

Staff are forbidden to discuss this policy with customers.

Edited by eightiesgirly

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Why would you do that?

Well 90% of the time that I eat in a restaurant it is for incoming producing purposes. So either my employer must reimburse me for the cost of it or if it is a bit grey then I claim the total cost including tips as a tax write off against my taxbale income.

I need documentation from the supplier which describes all costs in both cases otherwise I will be out of pocket.

Edited by Bardon

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Its not always as straightfoward as it sounds. We have restaurant business. We split all tips equally between everyone who works a particular shift on the floor or in the kitchen. To me that is the fairest way to do it.

I think it is disgusting that the companies take a slice of the credit card tips to supplement turnover.

With regard to the minimum wage issue....A good waiter probably looks after enough tables that the restaurants turnover in their section on a busy night is say £600. If they generate 10% tips from those tables that is an extra £60 on top of their regular wage. THat is not bad for a 6 hour shift. Trust me, they will not be declaring those cash tips as taxable income, so they are swindling you and all other taxpayers and doing quite nicely thankyou. Should they also get the full £5.73 min. wage (taxed of course) and if they are casual / part time, the 59p holiday pay too?

Should the waiter get all that cash while the poor Polish kitchen porter gets just the minimum wage?

How about the poor young commis chef in the kitchen pulling a 60 hour week for £12k per annum?

Tipping in restaurants is a very devicive issue from many angles!

For the record, we pay minimum wage for over 18s to all our young waiting staff, and the full minimum wage (£5.73 + holiday pay to all the over 21s. TIps are shared between all. Wages are liable to tax and NI, tips just the tax, not NI. It all goes through payroll. A 17 year old waitress working in my place tonight has just earnt £51.50 in wages and tips for a 6 hour shift, which is around £8.50 per hour. Not bad for an A level student!

Edited by Hip to be bear

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Decent waiting staff will go and work for busy restaurants where they can earn good tips, even if they don't get minimum wage. THe tips are a more important factor than the wage. I know a guy who used to work for TGI Fridays. He would walk out with £100 in tips for a waiting shift on a busy night. If you can get that much in tips, are you too worried about the basic rate at £3.50 of £5.73?

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Its not always as straightfoward as it sounds. We have restaurant business. We split all tips equally between everyone who works a particular shift on the floor or in the kitchen. To me that is the fairest way to do it.

I think it is disgusting that the companies take a slice of the credit card tips to supplement turnover.

With regard to the minimum wage issue....A good waiter probably looks after enough tables that the restaurants turnover in their section on a busy night is say £600. If they generate 10% tips from those tables that is an extra £60 on top of their regular wage. THat is not bad for a 6 hour shift. Trust me, they will not be declaring those cash tips as taxable income, so they are swindling you and all other taxpayers and doing quite nicely thankyou. Should they also get the full £5.73 min. wage (taxed of course) and if they are casual / part time, the 59p holiday pay too?

Should the waiter get all that cash while the poor Polish kitchen porter gets just the minimum wage?

How about the poor young commis chef in the kitchen pulling a 60 hour week for £12k per annum?

Tipping in restaurants is a very devicive issue from many angles!

For the record, we pay minimum wage for over 18s to all our young waiting staff, and the full minimum wage (£5.73 + holiday pay to all the over 21s. TIps are shared between all. Wages are liable to tax and NI, tips just the tax, not NI. It all goes through payroll. A 17 year old waitress working in my place tonight has just earnt £51.50 in wages and tips for a 6 hour shift, which is around £8.50 per hour. Not bad for an A level student!

Tips are taxable at a rate decided by the tax office. Staff frequently pay more tax than the rest of us.

Most hospitality staff have no contract of employlment and can be laid off / hours shortened at a moments notice.

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Decent waiting staff will go and work for busy restaurants where they can earn good tips, even if they don't get minimum wage. THe tips are a more important factor than the wage. I know a guy who used to work for TGI Fridays. He would walk out with £100 in tips for a waiting shift on a busy night. If you can get that much in tips, are you too worried about the basic rate at £3.50 of £5.73?

The Guardian readership would find it hard to grasp this perspective.

Edited by Bardon

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I always tip in cash, hand it directly to the person that served me- I never just add a tip to the bill.

When I was in Dubai, one of the big petrol station chains used to make the attendants wear uniforms which had no pockets.

The reason for this was so that the employee could not keep cash tips given directly.

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Guest BoomBoomCrash
Decent waiting staff will go and work for busy restaurants where they can earn good tips, even if they don't get minimum wage. THe tips are a more important factor than the wage. I know a guy who used to work for TGI Fridays. He would walk out with £100 in tips for a waiting shift on a busy night. If you can get that much in tips, are you too worried about the basic rate at £3.50 of £5.73?

Tips are not guaranteed though, especially in a recession.

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Tips are not guaranteed though, especially in a recession.

Just the same as good service, no guarantees

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When I was in Dubai, one of the big petrol station chains used to make the attendants wear uniforms which had no pockets.

The reason for this was so that the employee could not keep cash tips given directly.

In your sock?

Down your pants?

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The Guardian readership seems to find it hard to grasp many perspectives.

What like the waiter hasn't been forced to work in the restaurant or that he hasn't been prevented from finding a better opportuntiy, or should we just try and legislate for solutions and remove any expectation of an indivisdual taking some initiative out of the system altogether?

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For the record, we pay minimum wage for over 18s to all our young waiting staff, and the full minimum wage (£5.73 + holiday pay to all the over 21s. TIps are shared between all. Wages are liable to tax and NI, tips just the tax, not NI. It all goes through payroll. A 17 year old waitress working in my place tonight has just earnt £51.50 in wages and tips for a 6 hour shift, which is around £8.50 per hour. Not bad for an A level student!

Got any evening jobs going?

Oh ******. Forgot tax.

Got any cash in hand evening jobs going?

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All the more reason not to tip in the UK.

When I ran a restaurant in Texas, although the minimum wage was something like $7, by law we only had to pay $2.15 per hour to the staff and only had to pay the difference if their tips did not bring them up to the $7 level. However, Americans do tip well and most of our wait staff made about $20 per hour, of which we only had to provide $2.15. This is how American restaurants work and half would go bust otherwise - just goes to show the difference. But the American system should not be used in a country like the UK where tipping is very low.

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009/jun/0...ts-minimum-wage

Another example of people on low pay being denied the opportunity to improve their lot. These companies just can't stand the idea of their staff earning anything more than an absolute pittance; it's perverse.

Denied the opportunity to improve their lot? Really? Are they forced into these jobs? Can they not move into a job sector that rewards their true worth? Do they not have the opportunity to work for a company that has a fairer tip system or fairer wages? Sadly, this is another example of the silliness of socialist Britain... People expecting the government to sort out all their problems because it is "unfair". If it is unfair don't participate. Go on the dole or rob your hard working neighbor for funds not entitled to you. In a functional free market situation people would refuse to work for a pittance or would revolt. This, in turn, would motivate restaurant owners to increase wages to invite food service employees or go bust. To advocate some sort of minimum wage or tipping structure, theoretically, only serves to distort the market and perpetuate the inefficient allocation of wealth. It all comes down to a view on how stupid the masses are and an arrogance of some who wish to control market forces and ultimately human behavior (be it stupid or not).

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