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toodimm

Is The Telegraph Being Irresponsible?

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Why is the Telegraph being irresponsible? For me that suggest they are somehow responsible for all this.

The Telegraph is responsible for making money for its shareholders end of story. The MP's are irresponsible for behaving the way they did. Had they not behaved as they did the Telegraph would not have had its story.

Its quite easy to draw a line under this, Gordon only has to call a general election.

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Are you trying to defend those thieving Politicians??

I hope not.

nope, read my firt paragraph

To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.
Edited by toodimm

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To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.

However I think that the manor it has chosen disseminate the information is questionable. Clearly the editorial staff know they are sitting on a goldmine of a story, and they are determined to keep it running for as long as possible. By releasing the information daily and slowly, they have shifted the focus of the government, the opposition and parliament away from the second part of the economic collapse.

When things economic start to go wrong again, should the Telegraph take any of the responsibility for the shift in political focus which may blunt the countries response?

I too think its importnant this has all come out... but realistically nay system with any group of people is going to find some ride it harder than others, and in the case of MP's where they were effectively told their expenses were an entitlement some needed little encouragement to go for it.... its the same in the EU, I am sure some "benefit" from the system as much as they can, others less so......

So..... I do think its useful for MP's to go through this process, chuck the badded apples out and try and reform the system etc etc... the reason I think it has been good is that it has engaged so many people otherwise switched off by all things political..... where I disagree with it is the balance of it...... everyone is angry becasue public funds have been misused but I suspect secretly theres an element of jealousy at the amount they are getting, an element of lashing out in hard times and an element of horror that this kind of petty corruption seems so endemic within parliament. BUT up to a point this is all useful but I now think we should encourage the dog to let go of the bone.....

why... becasue going into this depth for a few more months I don't think will change the system we eventually get, nor will it change the result of the next election I feel..... but it may take energy away from more importnant matters... I for one was aghast at the waste of public monies but consider this ... we spend roughly £200,000 on slary and expenses and office costs for our roughly 650 MP's... thats £130m per year..... But we spend more than that ... over £150m on badger conservation..... we give away a multiple of this as overseas aid (for which the benefits are dubious) etc etc...... if MP's and newspapers were to now switch their fire into where we are currently wasting huge sums in government then I feel that would be time better spent now and in some ways a natural roll on form the expenses scandal......

I doubt though my wishes will come through so I prepare myself for months of expenses revelations with MP's hiding in the corner hoping somehow the telegraph won't spot their misdemanours and the telegraph of course spotting them, at which point the MP..apologises.. says its a mistake... pays money back.. tries to cling on .. then resigns.... I'd have more sympathy with them if we saw MP's digging into their past expenses and looking through them knowing what they do today and then coming forward before the telegraph "reveal"..... they don't seem to have that sort of courage.

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To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.

However I think that the manor it has chosen disseminate the information is questionable. Clearly the editorial staff know they are sitting on a goldmine of a story, and they are determined to keep it running for as long as possible. By releasing the information daily and slowly, they have shifted the focus of the government, the opposition and parliament away from the second part of the economic collapse.

When things economic start to go wrong again, should the Telegraph take any of the responsibility for the shift in political focus which may blunt the countries response?

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The Telegraph published an explanation of their methodology in one of the editions the weekend before last.

Firstly, the volume of data is so vast that (so they claim) it takes a team of journalists several days per MP to sift through it and determine if there's a story (i.e. if the subject is notable for sinning or sainthood). They then draft the story, run it past their lawyers and then the MP for comment. Only after this process is complete do they publish the story on an individual member. So their argument is that the exposés are coming out in dribs and drabs because they can't process the data quickly enough to publish it all as a 'big bang'. But I'm sure there's an element of wanting to sell newspapers, too.

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You're assuming that the government is in control of events, or capable of making a positive contribution. Maybe the Telegraph is doing us all a favour by keeping our leaders too busy to make things worse?

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Unfortunately we have a dictator in Government, and as the people and their representatives have lost the spine to remove him from office, the Telegraph are doing it on their behalf.

The Labour Party are elitist, facist, and down right dangerous to both public safety and national security, they have to go by the end of this week.

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The Telegraph published an explanation of their methodology in one of the editions the weekend before last.

Firstly, the volume of data is so vast that (so they claim) it takes a team of journalists several days per MP to sift through it and determine if there's a story (i.e. if the subject is notable for sinning or sainthood). They then draft the story, run it past their lawyers and then the MP for comment. Only after this process is complete do they publish the story on an individual member. So their argument is that the exposés are coming out in dribs and drabs because they can't process the data quickly enough to publish it all as a 'big bang'. But I'm sure there's an element of wanting to sell newspapers, too.

I know what the Telegraph are claiming (and they know what the MP's are claiming ;) ), but I think that it is clear to most people the they have two aims when deciding how to release this information.

1) To sell more papers

2) To get rid of the current government

both of these goals are fair enough in my book, but I think that we have to be realistic and accept that these are their aims.

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Guest BAREBEAR_soon to be ALIVA

If we were to rely on the forthcoming expenses ordit what do we think it would show. It wouldn't do any cross referencing or any research on dates or property interests.

I bet it would have just been a calculator exercise to make sure nothing was duplicated an it all added up right.

It's taken a newspaper to get to the nitty gritty, classic investigative journalism up with watergate. Not irresponsible at all,it has a duty to report news to the public and thats exactly what its done and pretty damned acurately too.

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Rather than point the finger at the The Telegraph, why not ask ALL the other newspapers why, despite having many opportunities to get the gory expense details, they did not do so. The story was being touted for ages and only the Telegraph had the balls to take it on. All the others were therefore complicit in trying to hide the expenses scandal IMO.

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To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.

However I think that the manor it has chosen disseminate the information is questionable. Clearly the editorial staff know they are sitting on a goldmine of a story, and they are determined to keep it running for as long as possible. By releasing the information daily and slowly, they have shifted the focus of the government, the opposition and parliament away from the second part of the economic collapse.

When things economic start to go wrong again, should the Telegraph take any of the responsibility for the shift in political focus which may blunt the countries response?

These so called hounerable members are trough feeding pigs, all of them. Many sat bye idle when vince cable warned a few years back that the debt bubble was out of control and would lead to disaster - laughed at he was!

These politicians have engineered a debt fueled holocaust on us all. They engineered a house price boom restricted land stopped building affordable social housing and dumbed down our people. They profited from there own engineered bubble - that is what i call gross mismanagment of the UK's economy and a crime ontowards it's people.

Simply indefensible criminality ruin at least two generations.

I just got a letter from my councillor saying all affordable housing starts have been mouthballed for the near future and i cannot and would not attempt to mill stone myself at this time by buying an overpriced shoe box in an economy that is collapsing you stupid Bulls!

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Why is the Telegraph being irresponsible? For me that suggest they are somehow responsible for all this.

I think that they are being irresponsible because they are releasing a story (which I do think needs to be released) in such a way as to shift public and political attention away from the much more important issue, which is the possible collapse of our economy.

The Telegraph is responsible for making money for its shareholders end of story.

This is one of their responsibilities, but it is not as you suggest, their only responsibility. Clearly if making money for their sharholders was their only concern, then they would have become a red top.

The MP's are irresponsible for behaving the way they did. Had they not behaved as they did the Telegraph would not have had its story.

I think that it’s a false dichotomy to suggest that it is either the MP’s or the Telegraph, which are being irresponsible, when it is likely that it is both.

Its quite easy to draw a line under this, Gordon only has to call a general election.

If this country were run by referenda, then I’m sure that many governments would have fallen to the latest shift in mood of the populous. Would you have asked for a general election to have been held as soon as the poll tax was brought in?

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I think that they are being irresponsible because they are releasing a story (which I do think needs to be released) in such a way as to shift public and political attention away from the much more important issue, which is the possible collapse of our economy.

Noooo, you are missing the point.

It was the MP's being irresponsible in the first place. The Telegraph is responsible to make money for its shareholders, which I have no doubt it is doing on the back of this story.

The MP's have been found out and if as you state you want the story to move on to more important things then they simply (or Gordon does) have a general election.

Therefore, MP's shouldn't have behaved the way they did and Gordon should put the nation first and call a general election, both parties being irresponsible.

Cause and effect.............

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I think the press know they are dealing with a budding totalitarian government here. They saw how New Labour brutalised the BBC over the illegal Iraq war. True, the Beeb was vulnerable as a public institution but if I was an editor I'd be vary wary of hillwalking with these Nazis in charge.

Well done to the Torygraph for bringing these ******* down.

Edited by CrashedOutAndBurned

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Guest X-QUORK
I too think its importnant this has all come out... but realistically nay system with any group of people is going to find some ride it harder than others, and in the case of MP's where they were effectively told their expenses were an entitlement some needed little encouragement to go for it.... its the same in the EU, I am sure some "benefit" from the system as much as they can, others less so......

So..... I do think its useful for MP's to go through this process, chuck the badded apples out and try and reform the system etc etc... the reason I think it has been good is that it has engaged so many people otherwise switched off by all things political..... where I disagree with it is the balance of it...... everyone is angry becasue public funds have been misused but I suspect secretly theres an element of jealousy at the amount they are getting, an element of lashing out in hard times and an element of horror that this kind of petty corruption seems so endemic within parliament. BUT up to a point this is all useful but I now think we should encourage the dog to let go of the bone.....

why... becasue going into this depth for a few more months I don't think will change the system we eventually get, nor will it change the result of the next election I feel..... but it may take energy away from more importnant matters... I for one was aghast at the waste of public monies but consider this ... we spend roughly £200,000 on slary and expenses and office costs for our roughly 650 MP's... thats £130m per year..... But we spend more than that ... over £150m on badger conservation..... we give away a multiple of this as overseas aid (for which the benefits are dubious) etc etc...... if MP's and newspapers were to now switch their fire into where we are currently wasting huge sums in government then I feel that would be time better spent now and in some ways a natural roll on form the expenses scandal......

I doubt though my wishes will come through so I prepare myself for months of expenses revelations with MP's hiding in the corner hoping somehow the telegraph won't spot their misdemanours and the telegraph of course spotting them, at which point the MP..apologises.. says its a mistake... pays money back.. tries to cling on .. then resigns.... I'd have more sympathy with them if we saw MP's digging into their past expenses and looking through them knowing what they do today and then coming forward before the telegraph "reveal"..... they don't seem to have that sort of courage.

Just once is fine.

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To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.

However I think that the manor it has chosen disseminate the information is questionable. Clearly the editorial staff know they are sitting on a goldmine of a story, and they are determined to keep it running for as long as possible. By releasing the information daily and slowly, they have shifted the focus of the government, the opposition and parliament away from the second part of the economic collapse.

When things economic start to go wrong again, should the Telegraph take any of the responsibility for the shift in political focus which may blunt the countries response?

I know this forum is about house prices, but that seems a rather strained way to keep the thread on topic if you ask me.

Edited by waitingscot

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To begin with I think that what the Telegraph is doing is very important, and desperately needed to be done.

However I think that the manor it has chosen disseminate the information is questionable. Clearly the editorial staff know they are sitting on a goldmine of a story, and they are determined to keep it running for as long as possible. By releasing the information daily and slowly, they have shifted the focus of the government, the opposition and parliament away from the second part of the economic collapse.

You have to be trolling

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Guest BAREBEAR_soon to be ALIVA
Come on now Barebear. Think about what the banksters are getting away with (trillions) compared to the MPs expenses (hundreds of thousands). I think the Mps are thieving bast*rds, but the banksters are in a different league and the media are completely ignoring them.

The government is the banks.

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When things economic start to go wrong again, should the Telegraph take any of the responsibility for the shift in political focus which may blunt the countries response?

The best answer to the current economic crisis would have been to do nothing. Instead they bail out bankers and quantative ease the sh*te out of the country just to save Gordon's reputation of no more boom and bust.

The lying cheating thieving ratbags can go to hell in a handcart. The country is better off without them.

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Guest BAREBEAR_soon to be ALIVA
I personally am hacked off with all of the reporting of this shyte. First and foremost the fact that everyone is missing is THERE WERE NO FIDDLES on the go. The whole thing is insanely manufactured by the telegraph and the timing is no coincidence. This has been going on for years. Ironically at the start of this I had no respect for MP's of any hue, now I find myself defending them all. The expenses were never intended to be just expenses. For what they do MP's are not paid enough. It's a thankless sh1tty job with insane hours and the need to live in two places simultaneously. They are for better or for worse the guardians of democracy, you know that thing all those millions of people died defending. Just about the best system of social organisation humans have managed to devise so far. We don't have a dictator in power as laurejon would have it - we don't vote for individuals we vote for parties - currently. For that they need to be paid properly but can't be for fear of all the crapola about snouts in troughs. I say abolish allowances but treble their salaries. Before this kicked off we were focused on the real thieving b@starts, the banks. Let me ask you, who are friendly with the banks and many of the top bankers? Who didn't want tax havens brought under control? Who try and run Sark like a fiefdom? The Barclay Brothers - owners of The Daily Telegraph. These c UN ts are now f ucking with our democracy because they want the heat removed from the real villians. I'd like to see the pair of them hung for this. The MP's allowance scheme is a non-story. The real scandal is the hijacking of democracy by rapacious newsmen with a political agenda from the dark ages - oh and, as has been pointed out elsewhere, The BBC's fees and expenses. This won't fix the system.

:lol: OMG you are really living up to your name arn't you.

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I personally am hacked off with all of the reporting of this shyte. First and foremost the fact that everyone is missing is THERE WERE NO FIDDLES on the go. The whole thing is insanely manufactured by the telegraph and the timing is no coincidence. This has been going on for years. Ironically at the start of this I had no respect for MP's of any hue, now I find myself defending them all. The expenses were never intended to be just expenses. For what they do MP's are not paid enough. It's a thankless sh1tty job with insane hours and the need to live in two places simultaneously. They are for better or for worse the guardians of democracy, you know that thing all those millions of people died defending. Just about the best system of social organisation humans have managed to devise so far. We don't have a dictator in power as laurejon would have it - we don't vote for individuals we vote for parties - currently. For that they need to be paid properly but can't be for fear of all the crapola about snouts in troughs. I say abolish allowances but treble their salaries. Before this kicked off we were focused on the real thieving b@starts, the banks. Let me ask you, who are friendly with the banks and many of the top bankers? Who didn't want tax havens brought under control? Who try and run Sark like a fiefdom? The Barclay Brothers - owners of The Daily Telegraph. These c UN ts are now f ucking with our democracy because they want the heat removed from the real villians. I'd like to see the pair of them hung for this. The MP's allowance scheme is a non-story. The real scandal is the hijacking of democracy by rapacious newsmen with a political agenda from the dark ages - oh and, as has been pointed out elsewhere, The BBC's fees and expenses. This won't fix the system.

Hilarious post. Good job they're aren't too many American posters here or they might take it at face value.

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:lol: OMG you are really living up to your name arn't you.

Come on now Barebear. Think about what the banksters are getting away with (trillions) compared to the MPs expenses (hundreds of thousands). I think the Mps are thieving bast*rds, but the banksters are in a different league and the media are completely ignoring them.

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